Fire Emblem Heroes General Discussion and Links

[Brand_Of_The_Exalt]

2 minutes ago, Glaceon Mage said:

Lucina also loses relevance to FE13 after she drops the whole Marth facade, having about two times when she does anything of note and both ultimately leading basically nowhere.  Her personality is somewhat cute from time to time but her design is basically meme ascension.  As a init she really depends on her mother, but regardless of who it is she's good in some way.  Sumia and Olivia make for good offensive Lucinas, Maribelle is good for support, etc.

She's still present in the story after that (and that's the only memorable moment in that arc). The excitement to finally get this mysterious fighter also helped her a lot. She's the face of modern FE IMO. Because a lot of persons played and liked FE13 (even if the core fanbase of FE did not like it, it is very popular), most of them started the series with it and had a lot of fan made arts, comics, etc (even more than Fates). She kind of represents Lords, she is strong, wise, beautiful, chivalrous, and appeared in Smash, making a lot of persons to use her because she's a more easy to play Marth, and also in other games. I'm extremely surprised she isn't first.

[Anacybele]

I always felt that Chrom was the "face" of modern FE since he's the main lord of Awakening and that was the game that revived the series and became the most popular. As Glac said, Lucina loses relevance after dropping the Marth disguise, and her design is awful and boring as hell because it's too Marth-like and unoriginal, imo. I don't think she's beautiful at all either, personally. "strong" "wise" and "chivalrous" describes a lot of lords and characters.

Lucina is a badly written character to me too. She's obsessed with protecting her father and...what else? She has a couple amusing moments in supports, but besides that, is boring. I've also never been a fan of time travelers either though.

Basically, I agree with a lot of what Glac said about her.

As for RD Ike, even I agree that he lacked any development whatsoever, and his ending is terrible, but I still think his personality was written well and I absolutely love his design. I've already said it's my top favorite in the series. I tend to like badass muscular swordsmen in general, though. :P Also, RD Ike gets the most amusing conversations EVER, particularly those involving Aimee. LOL

Edited January 24, 2017 by Anacybele

[Quintessence]

@Glaceon Mage Don't know exactly what were you trying to say with your post, though. That "unimportant" characters are on the top of the list and shouldn't be?

Whether this be true or not, Lyn's just a minor importance character (wouldn't label her as irrelevant to the story, as that applies to a lot of other characters) that went with Eliwood and Hector as an act of gratitude after helping her with the Laus invasion on Caelin.

[Birdy]

I feel like the 'is irrelevant to the story' argument goes for 90+%  of all characters. I don't think that's fair to hold against them. I guess the tag of 'Lord' does raise the expectation bar quite a lot. 

 

[Gima]

...Hasn't there always been only one real Lord in the games where there are multiple Lords in the first place?

[Birdy]

6 minutes ago, Gima said:

...Hasn't there always been only one real Lord in the games where there are multiple Lords in the first place?

I would consider all three (Lyn, Eliwood, Hector) of Blazing Sword to be 'real' lords personally. Unless you see their own modes as different games that is.

[Brand_Of_The_Exalt]

7 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

I always felt that Chrom was the "face" of modern FE since he's the main lord of Awakening and that was the game that revived the series and became the most popular. As Glac said, Lucina loses relevance after dropping the Marth disguise, and her design is awful and boring as hell because it's too Marth-like and unoriginal, imo. I don't think she's beautiful at all either, personally. "strong" "wise" and "chivalrous" describes a lot of lords and characters.

Lucina is a badly written character to me too. She's obsessed with protecting her father and...what else? She has a couple amusing moments in supports, but besides that, is boring. I've also never been a fan of time travelers either though.

Basically, I agree with a lot of what Glac said about her.

Chrom only appears in two crossover games (TMS, and he's barely recognizable and another game, but with Lucina), so he did not have the same visibility as Lucina outside of the series, who is playable in Smash and Code Name STEAM. In Awakening she's the most captivating character for a part of the game, and after that she's still present, and her design is very similar to Marth's (and is pretty cool TBH) who was already rather known outside of the community by Smash players. And Chrom's pretty bland too, he's meh as a unit since he gets stuck with the simple Falchion for the majority of the game and doesn't shine anywhere. 

Concerning her writing, I doubt the average player really cares about that. SF may be the core of the community, it's still a rather small part of it. Awakening had gimmicky but more colorful character, so they were appreciated by a larger public, that's why there was tons of fan stuff about it, and why it was so popular.

[Elieson]

4 minutes ago, Brand_Of_The_Exalt said:

Chrom only appears in two crossover games (TMS, and he's barely recognizable and another game, but with Lucina), so he did not have the same visibility as Lucina outside of the series, who is playable in Smash and Code Name STEAM.

Chrom's in Smash Bros (as Robin's Smash Ball move). He's also a badge for 3DS online play for what it's worth. He was also playable in Project X Zone 2, along with Lucina.

 

4 minutes ago, Brand_Of_The_Exalt said:

Concerning her writing, I doubt the average player really cares about that. SF may be the core of the community, it's still a rather small part of it. Awakening had gimmicky but more colorful character, so they were appreciated by a larger public, that's why there was tons of fan stuff about it, and why it was so popular.

I always viewed it as how the Terminator goes back in time to protect Sean Connor obsessively, because if Sean died, the world ends. Lucina has emotional attachment to her dad, plus the obligation of keeping him alive so big ol' dragons don't explode the world. It's covered in the Future Past DLC which emphasized the personality of all of the kids, but even without it, the high pressure for a high purpose is what kinda forces Lucina to act the way she does. Kinda like Trunks in DBZ...he's all about saving the future and keeping people alive who he knows can save the future. If I looked into Lucina's character, I'd find faults, but in general, I can see why she was written as she was, and its doesn't bother me. Heck, FE is notorious for tropey characters as it is.

[Anacybele]

12 minutes ago, Brand_Of_The_Exalt said:

Chrom only appears in two crossover games (TMS, and he's barely recognizable and another game, but with Lucina), so he did not have the same visibility as Lucina outside of the series, who is playable in Smash and Code Name STEAM. In Awakening she's the most captivating character for a part of the game, and after that she's still present, and her design is very similar to Marth's (and is pretty cool TBH) who was already rather known outside of the community by Smash players. And Chrom's pretty bland too, he's meh as a unit since he gets stuck with the simple Falchion for the majority of the game and doesn't shine anywhere. 

Concerning her writing, I doubt the average player really cares about that. SF may be the core of the community, it's still a rather small part of it. Awakening had gimmicky but more colorful character, so they were appreciated by a larger public, that's why there was tons of fan stuff about it, and why it was so popular.

Her design being "cool" or not and being "captivating" is subjective and opinion, not fact. Stop treating it as fact. Lucina was originally meant to be a Marth skin in Smash, not a separate character. She was given her own slot late into development. And she was going to be a Marth skin because she looks like him and highly admires him. She's only in Codename Steam because she got an Amiibo and that was due to being in Smash. And no, she's hardly still present in the game after dropping her disguise.

It doesn't matter what side games Chrom has been in, he's still the central character of the game that saved the franchise and Lucina is not. Also, Chrom was the one chosen for the FE Warriors trailer. Lucina is nowhere in it. And if you think writing doesn't matter, why bring up Chrom being bland or not? (even though I agree, he is bland and boring as well)

I know why Awakening is popular, this is not about Awakening being popular or not, it's about Lucina not being the face of modern FE and Chrom actually being that face.

Edited January 24, 2017 by Anacybele

[The Malign Knight]

40 minutes ago, Birdy said:

I would consider all three (Lyn, Eliwood, Hector) of Blazing Sword to be 'real' lords personally. Unless you see their own modes as different games that is.

Well, story- wise Eliwood could be considered as the "real" lord of the game: the story begins because he wants o search for his father while Hector and Lyn joins either because of ELiwood or because of...well, let's say "destiny". It must be also mentioned that Eliwood seems to have a stronger rivalry with Nergal(not to mention having more reasons of wanting him dead) than either Hector and Lyn. Still, I can see why you would consider the three of them to be protagonists in the same way.

28 minutes ago, Elieson said:

Chrom's in Smash Bros (as Robin's Smash Ball move). He's also a badge for 3DS online play for what it's worth. He was also playable in Project X Zone 2, along with Lucina.

I think he was referring exactly to Project x Zone 2 when he said that Chrom appears with Lucina in another game. I could be wrong tough.

 

31 minutes ago, Elieson said:

I always viewed it as how the Terminator goes back in time to protect Sean Connor obsessively, because if Sean died, the world ends. Lucina has emotional attachment to her dad, plus the obligation of keeping him alive so big ol' dragons don't explode the world. It's covered in the Future Past DLC which emphasized the personality of all of the kids, but even without it, the high pressure for a high purpose is what kinda forces Lucina to act the way she does. Kinda like Trunks in DBZ...he's all about saving the future and keeping people alive who he knows can save the future. If I looked into Lucina's character, I'd find faults, but in general, I can see why she was written as she was, and its doesn't bother me. Heck, FE is notorious for tropey characters as it is.

 There is also the fact that Lucina has lost her father at such a Young age that she could not bear the tought of losing him again, so she doesn't want to protect him because the world would end, but also out of love towards her love, which is porbably why I like her this much(along with other reasons, of course)

Anyway, albeit expected, I'm happy to see Lucina in the Top 3, tough I wasn't expecting to see Lyn at the very top.

 

[Brand_Of_The_Exalt]

49 minutes ago, Elieson said:

Chrom's in Smash Bros (as Robin's Smash Ball move). He's also a badge for 3DS online play for what it's worth. He was also playable in Project X Zone 2, along with Lucina.

 

I always viewed it as how the Terminator goes back in time to protect Sean Connor obsessively, because if Sean died, the world ends. Lucina has emotional attachment to her dad, plus the obligation of keeping him alive so big ol' dragons don't explode the world. It's covered in the Future Past DLC which emphasized the personality of all of the kids, but even without it, the high pressure for a high purpose is what kinda forces Lucina to act the way she does. Kinda like Trunks in DBZ...he's all about saving the future and keeping people alive who he knows can save the future. If I looked into Lucina's character, I'd find faults, but in general, I can see why she was written as she was, and its doesn't bother me. Heck, FE is notorious for tropey characters as it is.

Yes, but he's not playable and appears only for seconds so you can totally miss him in Smash and Lucina appeared too in XCOM2. Agree with your second point. In fact she reminded me of Gandalf too, who appears out of nowhere and makes his life outside of the screen and come back from time to time.

49 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Her design being "cool" or not and being "captivating" is subjective and opinion, not fact. Stop treating it as fact. Lucina was originally meant to be a Marth skin in Smash, not a separate character. She was given her own slot late into development. And she was going to be a Marth skin because she looks like him and highly admires him. And no, she's hardly still present in the game after dropping her disguise.

It doesn't matter what side games Chrom has been in, he's still the central character of the game that saved the franchise and Lucina is not. And if you think writing doesn't matter, why bring up Chrom being bland or not? (even though I agree, he is bland and boring as well)

I know why Awakening is popular, this is not about Awakening being popular or not, it's about Lucina not being the face of modern FE and Chrom actually being that face.

I'm not treating it as a fact. I'm judging from what I saw in people who did not know FE before. She gets the attention early, a masked, mysterious, and skilled swordsman who wears dark clothes and appears out of nowhere, just in time, twice. That sounds pretty cool and that's what stood out for a huge part of persons I talked with who only played Awakening. On the other, Chrom seems less heroic and more generic. The fact that she's present but not playable for a while also arouses interest, who wasn't excited when she joins? You're overestimating the average player here. FE fans are only a small part of the people who played the game. There isn't a central character in Awakening, there are 3, and Lucina coming from a hopeless future also adds something. Even if he's the central Lord, he got less interest. Like Micaiah

The fact that she was meant to be a Marth skin doesn't change anything. If she actually was, yes, things will be a lot different, but she isn't. And the fact that she's very easy to play and well balanced (and powerful) contributed to make her more popular, and brought people into FE too. And again, her design is close to Marth who is rather well know for the larger audience. That's why she's so popular. Why do you think Ike is well placed in the poll too whereas his games didn't sell well? She also has a better role than Chrom in the trailer, he seems pretty ridiculous if you don't know him. That's why he isn't in the poll. Lyn's popularity can also be partly be explained by the fact she's a pretty good assist trophy. 

Because you said she's bland as a superiority over Chrom. But, again, I don't think the average player takes this sort of thing into consideration, or stuff like COD wouldn't be so popular. OK this isn't the best example since it's more about multiplayer. Modern Assassin's Creed then.  

10 minutes ago, The Malign Knight said:

I think he was referring exactly to Project x Zone 2 when he said that Chrom appears with Lucina in another game. I could be wrong tough.

No you're right!

Edited January 24, 2017 by Brand_Of_The_Exalt

[Magical Glace]

@Quintessence, generally just elaborating on my opinions, really.

[Anacybele]

You can completely miss Lyn's assist trophy in Smash as well if you can completely miss Chrom in Robin's FS. :/ So if you can attribute some of Lyn's popularity to being an assist trophy, then some of Chrom's can come from being a Final Smash too.

You're the one that's underestimating Chrom's significance. There is one central character in Awakening, and that is Chrom. I kind of consider Robin a lord as well, but Chrom is the MAIN lord. Just like Eliwood is the main lord of FE7 despite Lyn and Hector being lords as well. Eliwood's tale is the main part of the game, Lyn's mode is just a tutorial and then she's just there the rest of the game, and Hector's story isn't even available until you complete Eliwood's.

Lucina is only a lord in class. She's not a forced unit and her defeat doesn't result in a game over. I'm not arguing against her popularity, I'm arguing against her being the face of modern FE. I see Chrom as the face of modern FE and you won't change that.

[Birdy]

23 minutes ago, The Malign Knight said:

Well, story- wise Eliwood could be considered as the "real" lord of the game: the story begins because he wants o search for his father while Hector and Lyn joins either because of ELiwood or because of...well, let's say "destiny". It must be also mentioned that Eliwood seems to have a stronger rivalry with Nergal(not to mention having more reasons of wanting him dead) than either Hector and Lyn. Still, I can see why you would consider the three of them to be protagonists in the same way.

 

Hmm, fair enough. I agree that Eliwood has more personal issues that unravel through the story and that he's central of the game because of that. I do feel that because of the screen time and the different modes that the game has, all three of them are lords and certainly more than side characters (I know, you didn't say that, just putting it out there ^^). Anyway, thanks for the explanation, good answer! :) 

[Brand_Of_The_Exalt]

16 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

You can completely miss Lyn's assist trophy in Smash as well if you can completely miss Chrom in Robin's FS. :/ So if you can attribute some of Lyn's popularity to being an assist trophy, then some of Chrom's can come from being a Final Smash too.

You're the one that's underestimating Chrom's significance. There is one central character in Awakening, and that is Chrom. I kind of consider Robin a lord as well, but Chrom is the MAIN lord. Just like Eliwood is the main lord of FE7 despite Lyn and Hector being lords as well. Eliwood's tale is the main part of the game, Lyn's mode is just a tutorial and then she's just there the rest of the game, and Hector's story isn't even available until you complete Eliwood's.

Lucina is only a lord in class. She's not a forced unit and her defeat doesn't result in a game over. I'm not arguing against her popularity, I'm arguing against her being the face of modern FE. I see Chrom as the face of modern FE and you won't change that.

I don't say he isn't popular, but he's less iconic. In fact we barely saw him since Awakening, he reappeared recently with the Direct. Chrom appears only if Robin is on the map, whereas Lyn can appear as long as assist trophies are enabled. But anyway, that's not important. I maintain that a huge part of Lucina's popularity is due to Smash. Same for Ike. At least for the larger audience. That's why I consider she's the face of modern FE.

Lyn served only as a tutorial, but she is here, and Eliwood isn't. Anyway, FEA is different from the rest of the series, and the attention is split between its 3 Lords. And I think that being the main Lord does not mean being the more iconic. It's missing a lot of factors that come into play.

 

Edited January 24, 2017 by Brand_Of_The_Exalt

[Thane]

Now the question is who the other 17 characters are. Personally, I'm happy to see three different games being represented, and I did expect to see all of those at least show up in the calendar pictures.

You know what I would love? To hear Intelligent Systems reaction to all of this. We all know how much they love their polls and how much importance they place on them. If Lyn wins here, I think we can expect to see more of her at some point in the not too distant future. We know how hard they've pushed certain characters recently, so I wonder how they feel about them not being on top of the list.

Speaking of which, do you think that's why Corrin doesn't appear in the main artwork of Fire Emblem Heroes? We've got at least one lord from the games 6-13, but Fates opts to go with Takumi and Camilla as their "representatives".

[AbsoluteZer0Nova]

Some videos where we can actually hear the voices of like Lyn and she sounds rather disappointing... maybe I'll get used to it.

 

 

[Brand_Of_The_Exalt]

1 minute ago, Thane said:

Speaking of which, do you think that's why Corrin doesn't appear in the main artwork of Fire Emblem Heroes? We've got at least one lord from the games 6-13, but Fates opts to go with Takumi and Camilla as their "representatives".

Yes and no. Camilla isn't exactly the more popular character... Her design and personality even disgusted some people that refused to play Fates. And Takumi got meme'd a lot for his role in Conquest. The only similarity I see is that they both attack Corrin in Chapter 13. But yes, you're right, that's weird. Maybe because Corrin doesn't have a cannon side.

[Anacybele]

Lyn's voice is fine to me. It's Roy's that doesn't work. The voice itself is fine, it just doesn't fit Roy at all. It's far too deep.

[Thane]

7 minutes ago, Brand_Of_The_Exalt said:

Yes and no. Camilla isn't exactly the more popular character... Her design and personality even disgusted some people that refused to play Fates. And Takumi got meme'd a lot for his role in Conquest. The only similarity I see is that they both attack Corrin in Chapter 13. But yes, you're right, that's weird. Maybe because Corrin doesn't have a cannon side.

Intelligent Systems probably don't care about people being disgusted if she causes them to rake in the cash because of lewd fan art. For whatever arcane reason, she was placed number two in the female popularity poll of Fates, and that means we'll be seeing a lot of her. That'll probably hold true for Lyn now as well. 

Takumi being "meme'd" is pretty much a source of popularity, and he has ranked highly in several polls and is often talked about as being one of the best written characters in Fates. Intelligent Systems don't just love polls, but it seems as if they're good at reading forums as well...I hope.

Besides, have you seen the Takumi memes? Shit's hilarious.

Corrin choosing a side is irrelevant; they're still in the game wearing their Nohr Prince/Princess class outfit. I would argue that it's either for weapon diversity or to represent both Hoshido and Nohr, but the thing is...a huge part of Corrin's role in the game is to represent both of those countries. Ah well, I'm probably hoping for too much if this is an indication of Corrin's impopularity.

[Gima]

8 minutes ago, Thane said:

Corrin choosing a side is irrelevant; they're still in the game wearing their Nohr Prince/Princess class outfit. I would argue that it's either for weapon diversity or to represent both Hoshido and Nohr, but the thing is...a huge part of Corrin's role in the game is to represent both of those countries. Ah well, I'm probably hoping for too much if this is an indication of Corrin's impopularity.

That's not Corrin. That's the fact that, as I have pointed out on other forums, class change (excepting cases where you only have one option) is noncanon. Or, rather, it's presumably canon, but we never actually see the characters outside of their main class (excepting, again, Fates where characters promote on the route you fight them in). This is why Laslow and Severa are both Mercenaries in Fates, Cordelia has breasts as a Dark Mage, Cherche can lose their wyvern upon promotion, etc. etc.

[Magical Glace]

There's also the fact they used Mamui for Hoshido and Femui for Nohr in the boxart, so I don't see much reason they couldn't continue using that for representation, but eh, whatever.  It's not like it really matters in the end, and while the reasons are different, Takumi and Camilla both get more like than Kamui from what I can tell.

Honestly I need to hear a bit more of the voicework to decide if I like it.  I do think Lyn's a bit too high pitched, though.  

[Thane]

3 minutes ago, Gima said:

That's not Corrin. That's the fact that, as I have pointed out on other forums, class change (excepting cases where you only have one option) is noncanon. Or, rather, it's presumably canon, but we never actually see the characters outside of their main class (excepting, again, Fates where characters promote on the route you fight them in). This is why Laslow and Severa are both Mercenaries in Fates, Cordelia has breasts as a Dark Mage, Cherche can lose their wyvern upon promotion, etc. etc.

I'm sorry, but what are you talking about? Corrin is in the game, at least as the male version, wearing his Nohr Prince outfit. Look at the trailer linked above and go to 3.30.

[AbsoluteZer0Nova]

3 minutes ago, Thane said:

I'm sorry, but what are you talking about? Corrin is in the game, at least as the male version, wearing his Nohr Prince outfit. Look at the trailer linked above and go to 3.30.

From what I have seen Male Corrin uses swords and Female Corrin has a dragon icon so she transforms. Where as Male Robin uses tomes, but I think I saw somewhere that Female Robin had a sword icon.

[Gima]

8 minutes ago, Thane said:

I'm sorry, but what are you talking about? Corrin is in the game, at least as the male version, wearing his Nohr Prince outfit. Look at the trailer linked above and go to 3.30.

...You might be confusing Nohr Prince with Nohr Noble. Nohr Prince is his base class on all routes. Nohr Noble is his promotion in Conquest and one of his promotions in Revelations. Nohr Noble is non-canon since class change in Fire Emblem: Awakening and Fates is non-canon. Nohr Prince is canon. (And, again, they likely do change classes, but since that is left up to player choice, we never actually know what their canon final class is.)

 

Edit: My main point is that the Nohr Prince outfit is the one we see him in the trailer. Look again.

Edited January 24, 2017 by Gima