What was your opinion on Byleth as an Avatar/Character?

[Landmaster]

I don't usually make topics such as this, but I'm curious on other peoples' thoughts on this.

Not counting dear old Mark, Byleth marks the 4th Avatar character we have, following the likes of Kris, Robin, and Corrin. Unlike those Avatars who were generally quite talkative and interactive with others, Byelth functions more as a traditional RPG silent protagonist with a stoic and almost emotionless personality, with several characters noting that it seems as though they don't care about anything that goes on around them. 

So coming off of the very controversial Corrin, who garnered a lot of mixed opinions and is widely viewed in a negative light, what did you think about Byelth? Personally, I really liked them. I liked that they were primarily silent as a tie in to their character (not just silent protagonist.jpg) and I enjoyed seeing their growth in this regard. As you stay at the Monastery, characters, such as your House Leader and Jeralt start to notice Byleth smiling more often, occasionally joking, and gradually becoming more expressive. Even in their actions, they become more animated instead of just nodding in response to their students. It's minor, but it's some nice character development.

What really made me like Byleth was... *minor-ish spoilers*

Spoiler

...seeing them cry at the death of Jeralt. Being the first time Byleth cried and basically deeming Jeralt the only person worthy of tears really hit my heart. 

It's even more stinging in the following month when Byleth is visibly depressed when you choose to Explore. This is the first major case of emotion we see from them and it shows that they are capable of caring about other people around them, even if they don't always show it.

Byleth and Jeralt, IMO, have such a...professional relationship. By that I mean, he seems more like a mentor or Mercenary boss than a Father and the two don't have a traditional father-child relationship in that never really see them express outward affection for each other, even though it's obviously there. I think that really made this scene stronger, at least for me, to actually see how much Jeralt meant to Byleth.

I know there's some story related reasons for Byleth's behavior but I have only played the Blue Lions route as of now and am currently into Golden Deer, which I hear explains a little more about Byleth's history, so there may be actual explanations for some of the things I mentioned that I'm just not fully aware of, but I want to just ask in general, regarding Byleth as a character. What did you think of them?

To specify, I don't mean what you thought about them as a unit~ You can mention it if it some way ties into your thoughts on them as a character, but I really am more interested in how you felt about their characterization. 

Edited August 7, 2019 by Landmaster

[EntireInternet]

I liked Byleth, though it never takes center stage he does grow as a character which I appreciate, becoming less stoic and stone faced as the game progresses. In that way he fills the quiet protagonist archetype really well, but not so much so where he has no personality or is just a self insert.

[nevar]

I honestly prefer that they're silent! I've had people tell me already that they hate that Byleth is not like Robin (talkative, has a set personality), but I dunno. I prefer it the way it is now. When there are dialogue options, I can then imagine what sort of tone or in what way they say those words (don't know if that makes sense). I think if Byleth had voiced lines, I wouldn't dislike it per say...but it's sort of like playing Link in the Zelda games where if Link had a voice it would ruin my interpretation of his personality or how he carries himself. Anyway yeah, I like the fact that Byleth does show emotions as the game progresses.

[De Geso]

Spoiler

The way he looked so bummed out on the screen where you choose to explore, attend a seminar or battle after Jeralt was stabbed in the back

really endeared me to him. I like how he's a silent protagonist whose silence and coldness is acknowledged by the characters. It's pretty well done.

[Strullemia]

I much prefer the lords in the story but I don't mind playing as Byleth instead of playing as Edelgard/Dimitri/Claude because I like the role of a teacher and I do like his supports and the way some of them are handled.

I'm just glad he didn't overshadow any of the lords and while he certainly is special I find his backstory interesting enough that it doesn't bother me.

 

[Sentinel07]

17 minutes ago, Hekselka said:

I much prefer the lords in the story but I don't mind playing as Byleth instead of playing as Edelgard/Dimitri/Claude because I like the role of a teacher and I do like his supports and the way some of them are handled.

I'm just glad he didn't overshadow any of the lords and while he certainly is special I find his backstory interesting enough that it doesn't bother me.

 

I agree. It's nice how they balanced Byleth in comparison to the other Lord's.

At the very least, he's my favorite Fire Emblem avatar so far.

[nhaer042]

I like him. He has a nice little character arc that I appreciate l.

[Fabulously Olivier]

The silent protagonist thing has had mixed results. But I would like to express my admiration for how expressive they've managed to make him.

 

In his supports with Manuela, he gave her the most brutal side-eye and I burst out laughing.

[Etrurian emperor]

I'm generally not very fond of silent protagonists but I think Byleth is handled very well. 

There are real lore reasons why Byleth is so low key regarding his emotions and I like that his silent protagonist status gets called out as weird without making it a joke. They aren't making cheeky references to how weird a silent protagonist is but instead the characters speculate that something is just wrong with Byleth.

It might also have been the smartest thing to do regarding this avatar. Corrin drew so much criticism because he was an avatar with a very defined personality that would often clash with the wishes or personalities of the players he supposedly represented. With Byleth this never happens. 

[Vince777]

I don't see the reason for him/her to be a silent protagnist and hopefully this won't be coming back in future installations. It has always been immersion-breaking to me when I'm supposed to see dialogue and interactions where there isn't any. I don't feel the need to inject a character with my own personality. I don't need to be in the game. 

It annoys me enough that I'd rank them pretty low. Almost as low as the tactician in Blazing Sword or Kiran in Heroes. Love the rest of the cast though and the voice acting in general.

One thing I did appreciate about them however is that they looked older and more mature than past lords. I'm glad the leader of my army wasn't a 15 yo again. 

Edited August 6, 2019 by Vince777

[Armagon]

Definitely the best Avatar as he actually fits the role of one. With Kris, Robin and Corrin, these were characters that had very defined personalities, so they were less Avatars and more just customizable characters. Byleth also at no point takes center stage. Three Houses is still Edelgard/Dimitri/Claude's story, depending on which route. Byleth is simply the guide.

Though ironically enough, all the other Avatars do something Byleth doesn't, and this hurts him: customization. Kris, Robin and Corrin all had customizable appearances while Byleth, while there are some costumes and of course, the class outfits, Byleth's appearance is static. You can't change his hair style/color, his voice, his height, etc. You can play as female Byleth but that's about it.

[xchickengirlx]

My only gripe with Byleth, is that I wish their character model could emote a little more with their facial expressions during some of their Supports.  Some of the students B support convos get pretty emotional, yet Byleth has this deadpan expression on their face the entire time...I find it to be a bit jarring.😅

I'm pre-timeskip still, and understand there will be an explanation to why Byleth is so expressionless, but yeah. Otherwise I don't the silent protagonist mc at all, since I play Zelda games and Persona games. Although I would argue that Joker from P5 is a little better handled as the silent protagonist type? but that's just me.

I guess IS learned their lesson from Corrin in Fates. IMO Corrin was okay/meh in Birthright and Revelations, and downright insufferable in Conquest haha

[Tribute]

You say "Silent protagonist" but honestly between his interactions with everyone and the fact character creation is just Gender/Name he feels alot more like a character built into the story than the usual avatars. Even without actually having very many explicitly voiced lines, it feels alot more like a cohesive part of the narrative that connects differently to different people.

1 hour ago, Armagon said:

Definitely the best Avatar as he actually fits the role of one. With Kris, Robin and Corrin, these were characters that had very defined personalities, so they were less Avatars and more just customizable characters. Byleth also at no point takes center stage. Three Houses is still Edelgard/Dimitri/Claude's story, depending on which route. Byleth is simply the guide. 

Though ironically enough, all the other Avatars do something Byleth doesn't, and this hurts him: customization. Kris, Robin and Corrin all had customizable appearances while Byleth, while there are some costumes and of course, the class outfits, Byleth's appearance is static. You can't change his hair style/color, his voice, his height, etc. You can play as female Byleth but that's about it.

See I got the complete opposite. Robin/Corrin felt like Character Creators that happened to be plot macguffins too.

The way Byleth LACKS that same customization, actually adds on positively to your opener about it being the students story. It makes Fe3H feel alot more like a story happening around you that you're playing in first person, rather than a story who's only purpose is to serve you.

 

Character wise, AVATAR INCLUDED, I think that FE3H is leaps and bounds better than Awakening and Fates.

Edited August 7, 2019 by Tribute

[Tribute]

1 hour ago, Armagon said:

 

Edited August 7, 2019 by Tribute

[Heathcliff]

Byleth is my favorite by a loooong shot. I'll take no-customization if it means incredible cutscenes.

He's also less of a blank slate. A lot of his dialogue options say the same thing in two different ways. This shows me that Byleth, in those moments, does have a personality and way of thinking, which I like. Even if I sometimes find myself wanting to say the exact opposite. 

Like others have said, the best part is that he doesn't dominate the story. This is a story about your students, kind of like how The Witcher is supposed to be about Ciri. 

[Katyusha]

Im big into customization;
I just do not like his haircut and his face is pretty bland

I wish he had some defining features - scar, tattoo, something

[Humanoid]

I haven't gotten past the point where Byleth supposedly starts becoming more interesting than Kiran so I'll hold off on judgement for now. One thing I will say is that the awful animation suite they use (particularly in supports) does them no favours - the stiff, janky canned animations and the inability of the models to interact with literally any object means it's even harder than it should be to reveal much in the way of character through that medium.

Frankly I wonder sometimes if the reverse shots featuring Byleth's wordless, emotionless mug actually accomplish the opposite goal and make them more of a soulless mannequin. Would the Byleth supports be better if the camera just stayed on the other person?

I don't think the technological limitations can be blamed solely on the Switch either. Yeah it's no powerhouse, but there are still significantly more detailed games available on it that don't have to rely on shortcuts to show simple things like, y'know, literally anything other than the characters currently engaged in dialogue. The most horrible recurring kludge is when they just put a tiny static image in the middle of the screen to show an object the character has seen, and that's if they didn't just decide to fade to black. This is the kind of thing you'd do in the late 80s.

Edited August 8, 2019 by Humanoid

[Book Bro]

Really bad. Byleth has no expression other than pissed off (male)/doe eyed (female), has no personality, isn't customizable, and is still way too important to the lore to ever feel like "I'm him". Like, if you need an avatar, make a completely irrelevant character who's just a witness to the story like Mark and stop forcing established characters to "stand in" for the player because it doesn't work. Byleth would've been way more interesting if he had opinions on the events of the story, actually spoke or reacted, etc.

Story spoiler for chapter 9-10.

Jeralt dying was so underwhelming because I never bought their supposed relationship. Byleth never showed any affection, Jeralt always claimed they had a close relationship but there was nothing shown to make it believable. And then the cutscene of Byleth silently crying with the same dead expression on his face. 

I'll never get this trend or why so many need avatar characters even if they're so bland and don't add anything to the experience. 

[Florete]

If they continue to use avatars (and I hope they do), Byleth is closer to what they should do than Robin and Corrin, but I think they took "silent protagonist" too far. Where this really got to me is the scene where Jeralt dies; sure, she shows some expression and cries, but her saying absolutely nothing just made the scene feel really awkward. They should be willing to have voice acting at times like that, and I also think it would be improved if they took the Mass Effect route where the player still chooses the dialogue but it's all voiced.

[Landmaster]

On 8/6/2019 at 7:56 PM, xchickengirlx said:

My only gripe with Byleth, is that I wish their character model could emote a little more with their facial expressions during some of their Supports.  Some of the students B support convos get pretty emotional, yet Byleth has this deadpan expression on their face the entire time...I find it to be a bit jarring.😅

Understandable, but I think that's the point. Other characters constantly point out that Byleth doesn't emote much and very literally state that they look like they aren't affected by anything happening around them. So it does make sense that they don't express very often.

1 hour ago, Book Bro said:

Really bad. Byleth has no expression other than pissed off (male)/doe eyed (female), has no personality, isn't customizable, and is still way too important to the lore to ever feel like "I'm him". Like, if you need an avatar, make a completely irrelevant character who's just a witness to the story like Mark and stop forcing established characters to "stand in" for the player because it doesn't work. Byleth would've been way more interesting if he had opinions on the events of the story, actually spoke or reacted, etc.

Story spoiler for chapter 9-10.

 

  Hide contents

 

Jeralt dying was so underwhelming because I never bought their supposed relationship. Byleth never showed any affection, Jeralt always claimed they had a close relationship but there was nothing shown to make it believable. And then the cutscene of Byleth silently crying with the same dead expression on his face. 

 

I'll never get this trend or why so many need avatar characters even if they're so bland and don't add anything to the experience. 

 

As I said before, they're meant to be emotionless (for story reasons), so the monotone expression, while I can see it as off-putting for some, isn't there out of laziness or anything like that, that is Byleth's personality. I also don't think any Avatar (at least for me), is meant to feel like a self-insert. They have all, besides Mark, I suppose, been their own characters with their own given personality traits. It's just the character that you happen to play as and that you can just choose the gender and sometimes appearance of.

Also, Byleth does have opinions on a lot of things and does "speak", they just have no voiced lines for this.

I personally find them most similar to Kris, in that they are just there to Support the main Lord, but the story isn't really about them. They do have some major points such as being able to wield the Sword of the Creator and their relationship with Sothis. But for all intents and purposes, the story is about the House Leader.

[Humanoid]

Then for story reasons, Byleth should be incapable of S-supporting anyone. 😉

[The Roger The Paladin]

3 minutes ago, Humanoid said:

Then for story reasons, Byleth should be incapable of S-supporting anyone. 😉

I'd argue that a part of Byleth's character arc is gaining emotions from contact with the students/faculty, thus making an S rank by the end plausible.
This is coming from someone who largely doesn't care for the entire "avatar romance" angle. Though perhaps I feel it works better with Byleth, because they are fairly established in how they are.

[MasterSlayerX]

I mean I’m fine with a silent protagonist and the way the character is handled in the story along with why the character is quiet was nicely handled . As a character I like Byleth

 

The only issues I have with Byleth as a character would really be compared to robin, Corrin and such this is one of the characters I felt should of had more customization 

Spoiler

I know story wise he or she is meant to be proficient in swords because of the sword of creation and faith magic because of what Rhea did but I kind of wish the player could of picked the areas they had been stronger in so players who wanted to have a high rank in lances and horses could to reflect upon the character and help link the character to a silent protagonist where it’s left to the players imagination . But I know this is more linked to gameplay than character 

 

[Book Bro]

9 hours ago, Landmaster said:

 I also don't think any Avatar (at least for me), is meant to feel like a self-insert. They have all, besides Mark, I suppose, been their own characters with their own given personality traits. It's just the character that you happen to play as and that you can just choose the gender and sometimes appearance of.

This is what I'm getting at. Is this type of character necessary? Is Path of Radiance any worse off because we can't choose the gender of Ike and name him Bobby and because it wasn't "my very own adventure"? 

IS want to have their cake and eat it too, but all it does is result in characters that don't reach the full potential of a player avatar nor of a fully realised protagonist.

[Wolfen09]

I'm mixed on byleth.  The design of the character itself is fine (except those damn floppy sleeves?  Hate those).  The silent protagonist thing I can deal with, but when every other character in the game is voiced it just confused me why they didn't just Mass effect Shepard it with a voice for male and one for female.  I think the role this avatar plays in the game is probably the best implementation of the avatar system.  Yeah you're the hero, but your story is not wholly the main focus as it has been in the past couple of games.  I would have liked some customization, but that's no deal breaker.  Also would like to pick my starting weapon specialties, I understand the sword thing for story reasons, but I'm an axe guy myself (Viva hector)