Book VI Discussion Thread

[Diovani Bressan]

1 hour ago, Tybrosion said:

Though if it’s any consolation, Elm is probably gonna die in the next chapter (for the same reason that Askr did). That, and September is a known killer of secondary antagonists (like Laegjarn, Helbindi, Thrasir, Plumeria, and Otr).

Yeah...

The thing is... I can see Elm dying next chapter but his summonable version being saved for November to go with Embla in a double Mythic banner. However, another idea I had is Elm being the September's Mythic, and in November we get Embla as that month's Mythic... and Ascended Veronica making her debut in the Mythic banner as well. The map would be like a BHB as well, like last year.

[Tybrosion]

3 hours ago, Diovani Bressan said:

Yeah...

The thing is... I can see Elm dying next chapter but his summonable version being saved for November to go with Embla in a double Mythic banner. However, another idea I had is Elm being the September's Mythic, and in November we get Embla as that month's Mythic... and Ascended Veronica making her debut in the Mythic banner as well. The map would be like a BHB as well, like last year.

Yeah, I'm expecting Elm to get saved for a November double feature with Embla too mostly because of how badly Otr fared on his own last September. That, and Xander's presence on the September banner indicates that Mythic will probably be green.

As for Ascended Veronica, I'm thinking she's just going to be the headliner of one of the remaining Book VI New Heroes banners (whichever one doesn't have Ascended Eir or Ganglot as the headliner).

[Sunwoo]

Have you guys noticed that FEH seems to be slowly killing off the gods of this world? It's not just Askr, but almost every OC who classifies as a god of a realm seems to be introduced just to die.

Hel died back in book 3. She was also the main villain of book 3, so this probably wasn't too surprising back then.
Freyr, of the realm of dreams, died (and was never released in his base form).
Freyja, of the realm of nightmares, also died. Or sacrificed herself. Either way, her in-story base form is not living anymore.
Ymir, newly introduced and of the realm of life, sacrificed herself to save Eir. She died before we ever saw her portrait in-game.
Askr died in the latest chapter, of course.

Embla is probably going to follow by the end of the book, if she really is the final boss of book 6. Muspell might be dead? I don't remember that TT+ very well because it was dumb, but I think Muspell also was killed off or an equivalent of killed off. Nifl might be the only one who's not explicitly dead, but that makes her an exception. Loki and Thorr do their own thing, so I'm not counting them.

For all we know, when FEH's story ends they could just have the characters slaying all the gods of old and starting a new world without gods. Or something.

Edited August 17, 2022 by Sunwoo

[Humanoid]

Hopefully it's not the standard Fire Emblem thing where they kill off or otherwise disappear all the other rulers on a given continent so that the Mary Sue lord gets to rule everything.

[jameslove001]

I think Alfonse and Veronica are going to be the new Askr and Embla but somehow do away with closing gates if I were to guess. Or they will have a kid that unites it or something of that nature. With as little as they have done with Anna and Sharena I kinda hope we can just move onto the next generation. It would have been different if they had worked harder on anyone but Alfonse. Maybe I am misreading.

[Fire Emblem Fan]

Ya know, I've been trying REALLY hard not to complain about Feh story-related things and all that, but...

Screwwww this game and it's terrible writing and treatment of characters, because of COURSE Askr just had to die. Sigh. Heavy sigh. Feh's story has been consistently garbage for multiple books now so I guess I shouldn't be surprised, but I'm sighing anyway.

9 hours ago, Tybrosion said:

Though if it’s any consolation, Elm is probably gonna die in the next chapter (for the same reason that Askr did). That, and September is a known killer of secondary antagonists (like Laegjarn, Helbindi, Thrasir, Plumeria, and Otr).

I fully agree Elm is gonna be dying soon, but I don't think it'll be for the same reason as Askr. If that was the case, then Ash will end up dead, as well, and I don't see that happening. They'll kill Bull but not Cow for...reasons.

[Mercakete]

Before I read anyone's responses, I'll put my own.

 

Of course Askr's realm is the world tree. Guess I was getting too focused on what was actually given to us in lore and not looking at the Norse myths. (It's still a bright and open world, though, so I did get that right at least.) The "dad" thing was kind of last minute. I feel like that would have been nice if it had had the proper amount of time to develop. It also makes Elm's situation even more sad, if he sees Embla as his mom. Suddenly, being a fervently loyal minion becomes him desperately trying to earn his mom's love. 😞 The guy's already died at least once for her (back when Ash explained to us that Elm kind of died but also wasn't completely gone) and even went into a realm that's basically poisonous to him. And all the while, Embla's looking right past him, bemoaning being "alone." Man, poor guy...

Also, let's just look at the repeated themes here... IS pulled another "She didn't used to be that bad, please feel bad for her even though she's being a brat and kind of brought this upon herself." And then killed the guy who stuck up for her. Man, feeling bad for Freyr (even though he was an enabler to a narcissist and really should have set his sister straight) all over again. Askr did it better, though. He tried to legitimately help Embla when she misunderstood the situation, and didn't enable her temper tantrum, but also remained open if she ever changed her mind. Good on him. He's such a bro. (I kind of want a Freyr and Askr duo.)

That said, he's still dead (and apparently the gods have some other afterlife they go to, according to what Askr told Ash) and you could kind of see it coming. First, Ash asked if Askr was okay, and Alfonse didn't seem convinced when Askr said he was fine. Then there were things Askr said like the unrealistic hope that Embla will turn around is "what drives him." That means that there's something he's actively trying to do, and that it's not something easy. Then there were all the talks he had along the way to the tree sounding like last words, with the only exception being when he told Alfonse that he hopes that he (Alfonse) could one day see Askr as a friend, implying a steady growth in relationship over time. And then there was his turning away people's help for the rite to get the "key." All the while, he kept calm and cheerful. The guy did a great job of making sure no one worried about him, though it's kind of ironic that the god of openness kept a secret like that. I kind of expect Ash to succeed him as the deity of openness (maybe post story), too. Again, such a gentle and great guy, who didn't excuse any of the bad going on, was careful with people's feelings, and addressed things with honesty, realism and optimism. Man, he was well-written.

But now let's talk about the fruit. Like... First off, I was surprised that this game got a bonafide scene artwork like that. It really shows how important this thing is, perhaps to the story at large and not just to this book. That said, well... Askr said that this thing would free people from Embla's grasp. Specifically, if people at it...but it's kind of tiny. And Embla kind of sealed off whole towns' worth of people. I guess they could make it into a smoothie or something and really spread it out, but even then, that's going to help, like, 20 people max? They said it's also a weapon, but it only poisons Embla if she refuses to release whoever it is who ate it. So...yeah. Good for Bruno for finally finding the thing he's been looking for all this time, though! (That said, on the way, I was seriously expecting the mcguffin to be another mode for Briedablik. ... Also, why didn't Askr say anything about it if it was an Askr-made divine weapon? I feel like we should have gotten some lines about it. This is one of the few times when one of the characters talking to Kiran actually would have made sense.)

Also, I get that they needed enemies to fight, but... This world actually has a bunch of gates open all over the place. Did they really need to send Elm in there? Maybe it wouldn't have occurred to Askr, Ash, or the Askrans to close the gate behind them, but they have one of the royal Emblians with them. Bruno could have closed the gate. Why didn't he even suggest it? I almost want to script a comic about this... (It even specifically says that their foes followed them through the gate.)

All in all, though, I enjoyed the chapter. It was kind of sad, and it certainly had its flaws, but I liked it.

Now time to read other people's impressions!

@Sunwoo

I forgot to mention it, but I noticed this, too. (Muspell and Nifl both disappeared at the end of that TT+, by the way. Muspell died I think, and I think Nifl just sort of let herself move on to the next life. Which was kind of "Then what was the point?") Also, Freyja isn't dead. She's unconscious sleeping beauty style. She "sacrificed" herself, but her fairies swore to revive her. Anyway, the deities also have clear heirs for the most part (Hel has Ganglot, Freyr has Peony, Nifl left her realm to the royal line, and so on), but yeah, things are really snowballing towards Ragnarok (the end of the natural cycle of the world (before it begins anew) according to Nordic mythology, and is pretty much always caused by Loki, actually) (and have been since at least Book 3 with Lif's hatred for the gods and Thorr offering him a job. This was extended at the end of Book 4 when Lif recruited the dark fairies and ranted about how terrible the gods were.) I don't know whether Lif will be the final boss (in a scenario where our Alfonse is trying to prevent the gods' system from completely collapsing), Alfador will be the final boss (in a scenario where we join up with Lif to take the gods down), or we get a "best ending" scenario where everyone winds up just being friends at the end. If Alfador's the Ragnarok final boss, then his lieutenants will probably be Thorr and Loki, or some representation of Odin's ravens (or maybe both.)

Edited August 18, 2022 by Mercakete

[Aedan7479]

So, are just going to ignore all the living parents for the sake of the joke? Eh, why not. That aside, Askr's death has more impact after only two chapters compared to Nott who had eight or so chapters; I'd say the writing has improved, even if they're using the same tropes. One this I noticed with the fruit is how it relies on the desire of whoever eats it, so maybe if Veronica wants to die, that might complicate things, after all, we're certainly going to fight Embla directly in the Final Chapter, of course, if Veronica did want to die, the power of friendship will convince her otherwise; we've already met our good guy death quota.

[EricaofRenais]

Well, all I have to say is I was crying at Askr's death chat with Ash that hit a little to close to home after losing my dad.  Yeah I am a little peeved IS loves to kill off the gods, the only one still alive is Nifl.

[Mercakete]

4 hours ago, Aedan7479 said:

So, are just going to ignore all the living parents for the sake of the joke? Eh, why not. That aside, Askr's death has more impact after only two chapters compared to Nott who had eight or so chapters; I'd say the writing has improved, even if they're using the same tropes. One this I noticed with the fruit is how it relies on the desire of whoever eats it, so maybe if Veronica wants to die, that might complicate things, after all, we're certainly going to fight Embla directly in the Final Chapter, of course, if Veronica did want to die, the power of friendship will convince her otherwise; we've already met our good guy death quota.

The only living parent who we actually have a face for right now is Henriette, though others have been mentioned (i.e., Veronica's mom.) Speaking of which, I wonder if IS is going to try to pull the twist of Veronica's mom being the actual final boss (especially if she's possessed by Embla, but we know the blood-bearer was her and Bruno's dad, so unless he married a cousin or something (entirely possible - probable even, especially if Bruno was betrothed to Letizia) then she wouldn't be able to be possessed, I think.)

Anyway, that aside, there is a better way to use the fruit. Actually, a couple of them. Sure, the obvious path is to give it to Veronica, but what would be even more tragic (sorry; I like tragedy (IN FICTION.) Helps me feel and thus cope with my own negative feelings, and in addition, compassion in general is just such a beautiful thing) is if they somehow convinced Elm to eat it. His power/life is tied directly to Embla's, so that's got to have some sort of effect on her, even if he dies instead of Embla dying in his place (as the fruit is supposed to work if she doesn't let go of whomever she's trying to hold onto.) Really, though, the most effective thing they could do would be to get Embla herself to eat it. No caveats that way, unless she lets go of herself (because, let's be honest, she's in a prison of her own making, imagining all these betrayals when no one ever actually betrayed her. People (the Emblians who visited Askr and Askr himself) even TRIED to explain to her that she got it wrong, but instead she just lashed out and began subjugating people.)

I'd also like to point out that the wording was "whoever eats OF this fruit" which means that you can just eat part of it and it'd have the same effect as eating the whole thing, so it's better to give it to as many people as possible.

1 minute ago, EricaofRenais said:

Well, all I have to say is I was crying at Askr's death chat with Ash that hit a little to close to home after losing my dad.  Yeah I am a little peeved IS loves to kill off the gods, the only one still alive is Nifl.

Actually, Nifl died (after Muspell died, she was all "I leave the realm to you" and so on) and Freyja's just in a magic coma (the dark fairies are on a mission to revive her.) Sorry to hear about your loss, though. 😞

[Lemmy]

Not that jealousy hasn't led to many, many deaths; but I assumed Embla's missing eye and eye motif had something to due with her grudge, but it could have been of her own doing, like Odin.

This is also the first book Loki hasn't been visibly acting, letting us know she knows what's going to happen. IIRC we still don't know what motivated Letizia to start the rite of closing, whether the book she stole was needed to start it, or if the book is something Loki wants (she has a running literature theme), so she might have played a role. Not knowing whether Loki is ultimately a villain or antihero keeps me intrigued.

[EricaofRenais]

On 8/18/2022 at 10:08 AM, Mercakete said:

 

Actually, Nifl died (after Muspell died, she was all "I leave the realm to you" and so on) and Freyja's just in a magic coma (the dark fairies are on a mission to revive her.) Sorry to hear about your loss, though. 😞

Ah I thought she was still alive though that TT was going on when RL was being tough so no wonder I missed that part. Now I wonder if Freyja will be woken up next year if they do Peony after Eir.  Thanks it means a lot to find kind kind people out there.

[Mercakete]

2 hours ago, EricaofRenais said:

Ah I thought she was still alive though that TT was going on when RL was being tough so no wonder I missed that part. Now I wonder if Freyja will be woken up next year if they do Peony after Eir.  Thanks it means a lot to find kind kind people out there.

Thank you for the compliment. 🙂 I think that (IS waking up Freyja) is certainly a possibility. It would be a good use of what they've set up...though, I do wonder, since the dark fairies joined Lif and Freyja is seriously their whole motivation. So, it would be weird if they were just all "Nevermind." Unless Peony's trying to protect sleeping Freyja for some reason? Like, "She's important to my sister so I'll protect her!" or something. It would be interesting if the threat came from the Realm of Dreams instead of the Realm of Nightmares. Like, someone being all "What if we just got rid of the Queen of Nightmares? Then everyone could dream happily, so I'll just go destroy her now. Wheee!" and Peony would be all "No, I don't think that's right." And all.

[EricaofRenais]

1 hour ago, Mercakete said:

Thank you for the compliment. 🙂 I think that (IS waking up Freyja) is certainly a possibility. It would be a good use of what they've set up...though, I do wonder, since the dark fairies joined Lif and Freyja is seriously their whole motivation. So, it would be weird if they were just all "Nevermind." Unless Peony's trying to protect sleeping Freyja for some reason? Like, "She's important to my sister so I'll protect her!" or something. It would be interesting if the threat came from the Realm of Dreams instead of the Realm of Nightmares. Like, someone being all "What if we just got rid of the Queen of Nightmares? Then everyone could dream happily, so I'll just go destroy her now. Wheee!" and Peony would be all "No, I don't think that's right." And all.

Yeah that would be interesting and make some sense.

[DefyingFates]

On 8/18/2022 at 3:27 AM, Mercakete said:

The "dad" thing was kind of last minute. I feel like that would have been nice if it had had the proper amount of time to develop.

Yeah, the scene taken by itself was well-written, but backing it up beforehand would have made it land much harder. For example, having someone comment that Askr sounds like a father to Ash when she describes him in previous chapters, only to have her freak out about how she would never dare assume something like that. You're right that it adds a potentially messed up angle to Elm & Embla's relationship though.

On 8/18/2022 at 3:27 AM, Mercakete said:

"She didn't used to be that bad, please feel bad for her even though she's being a brat and kind of brought this upon herself."

At least Askr makes it clear that there's no changing her mind now? It won't change people fawning over her, but Freyja had the Dokkalfar doting on her while Embla only has Elm doing his best Otr impression. I... guess there's a chance Embla won't just be treated as a "troubled waifu"? Oh, who am I kidding.

On 8/18/2022 at 3:27 AM, Mercakete said:

All the while, he kept calm and cheerful. The guy did a great job of making sure no one worried about him, though it's kind of ironic that the god of openness kept a secret like that.

Yeah, it was obvious what was going to happen, but he died as he lived: super upbeat and supportive of everyone around him. I know he's only been around for two chapters, but this one really made me like him. If he's on next year's AHR (or gets a NY/ Valentine's alt), I may end up pulling for him, we'll see.

On 8/18/2022 at 3:27 AM, Mercakete said:

Specifically, if people at it...but it's kind of tiny.

Yeah, I assume this seed will be used to cure Veronica and/ or Bruno, and Ash will use Askr's power to create more for the other people (or Embla will have a last second redemption like Freyja, we'll see).

On 8/18/2022 at 3:27 AM, Mercakete said:

If Alfador's the Ragnarok final boss, then his lieutenants will probably be Thorr and Loki, or some representation of Odin's ravens (or maybe both.)

Thorr seems set to be an anti-villain and Loki a wild card so I think having two other women who are actually loyal to him would be useful narratively. Heck, even if the former two do stick with him, having two characters be lackies who are killed off early on and two who serve as penultimate bosses could lead to a strong showing for Alfadhor's forces too.

17 hours ago, Mercakete said:

It would be interesting if the threat came from the Realm of Dreams instead of the Realm of Nightmares. Like, someone being all "What if we just got rid of the Queen of Nightmares? Then everyone could dream happily, so I'll just go destroy her now. Wheee!" and Peony would be all "No, I don't think that's right." And all.

The Book 4 NY paralogue ended with Peony learning that sometimes it's better to give people bittersweet dreams than happy ones all the time, so this would be in character for her (or at least that version of her, if she's considered different).

On 8/18/2022 at 4:55 PM, EricaofRenais said:

Yeah I am a little peeved IS loves to kill off the gods, the only one still alive is Nifl.

Someone on Reddit mentioned that having Alfonse and co. know a "good" god personally would be a gamebreaker since they could just call him for help (or info) whenever they wanted. I don't think that entirely holds water, but I understand the reasoning at least. Still doesn't change that Alfonse has a killcount that would make Kratos blush, but what are ya gonna do.

On 8/18/2022 at 4:55 PM, EricaofRenais said:

Well, all I have to say is I was crying at Askr's death chat with Ash that hit a little to close to home after losing my dad.

I'm incredible sorry to hear this, and I'm happy you were able to find something to relate to. I hope you and your family are doing okay, we wish you all the best Erica!!

Edited August 20, 2022 by DefyingFates

[EricaofRenais]

11 hours ago, DefyingFates said:

 

Someone on Reddit mentioned that having Alfonse and co. know a "good" god personally would be a gamebreaker since they could just call him for help (or info) whenever they wanted. I don't think that entirely holds water, but I understand the reasoning at least. Still doesn't change that Alfonse has a killcount that would make Kratos blush, but what are ya gonna do.

I'm incredible sorry to hear this, and I'm happy you were able to find something to relate to. I hope you and your family are doing okay, we wish you all the best Erica!!

That does make sense but is still a bit sad since they could find some way to write it so the god didn't have to die if they wanted to. 

Thanks it was last November so this year has been up and down but my family and I are doing ok though some things will make us cry, but that is the way it goes and the good memories are nice.

[Mercakete]

Okay, I was recording my thoughts as I went through the chapter and the whole thing disappeared on me for some reason. I copied it to my clipboard and it just didn't copy for some reason. Usually, SF has a copy available in case something like that happens, but its copy is gone. So, yeah, frustrated. Trying to keep it together, though. Roll with it...

Okay, so, here's the summary of what I had (I did have exact quotes and basically a play by play through Part 3 but that's all gone now, so... This'll be the lower-quality analysis. Sorry, guys. That said, I also want to point out how amazing the background art in these games consistently are. Way to go, background artist(s)!

So, at first I wasn't sure if Bruno wasn't already possessed when he offered to go off by himself to confront Embla with the fruit, but apparently it was a plan he and Alfonse came up with together. He somehow got a communications off to meet with Xander. Nice to see him showing up for plot again. He has a secret contingency plan, too. I wonder what it is. Also, Sharena talking about things being as they used to be was just so sweet. 🙂 But Bruno promised to help her with her lance work, and that just makes me feel like he's not going to survive this chapter. He, himself, didn't even seem convinced that he would survive it. Guess he just has this sense that this is going to be it for him, which may especially be why he relayed his contingency plan to Xander. Also, Ash getting all bashful about her relationship with Askr was really cute.

Embla being upset about Askr's death caught me by surprise, but as I thought about it, it made sense. She must have known deep inside that he was sympathetic toward her, and she must have appreciated that, but in addition, hating him has been part of her identity for a very long time. When something impacts your identity like that, it affects you in ways you don't expect. And, really, Askr's death didn't solve her loneliness problem in the end. So now she has to deal with that: she got what she wanted, but it only made things worse for her, as she lost yet another connection. She needs to wake up and realize that the one isolating her is herself, and that neither Askr nor the mortals ever actually betrayed her. She may be on her way to realizing that.

And then there was Elm's bit. Oh dang was that something. We got something of a snapshot of what his and Embla's daily life is like: Embla bemoaning her problems and Elm being there for her. She recognizes his loyalty, which is more than she does for most people, but it's just such a sad relationship dynamic. He was literally made to serve her, so it's not like with Freyr and Freyja where Freyr was enabling Freyja's bratty immaturity. Elm doesn't really have much of a choice: it was folded into his very being. Yet, I'm sure, he wishes that Embla showed care for him and his own concerns, too. When he went to Embla, all he did was try to assuage her own concerns, even though he was literally dying. He kept that to himself so that he would stave off her loneliness and worries for even just a little bit longer, but as a result, he has no one to help him through this. He's always there for Embla, but she's never there for him. It really fits the "broken bonds" theme of Embla, while still fitting the servant-master/parent-child relationship they have, and still has room for his loyalty without being contradictory. Embla's so absorbed in her own problems that she can't even see the suffering of the most loyal person to her in her life. And it's just so sad... Elm's handling all of this all on his own because he has no one he can lean on for help or comfort. Yet, Ash notices his pain and calls his bluff, making it plain for everyone what he's going through. Since he guards his pain so heavily, it's no wonder that having it exposed scared him, and so he lashed out instead, even after his defeat. It was really nice to see Ash expressing her sentiments of respect and what she has in common with Elm. It's probably because she's so open (cause of the whole "god of openness" thing) but she can see Elm's pain and problems fairly clearly, even though he was an enemy. I think that's a really neat and easily overlooked dynamic which occurred there, and it really made Elm's position even more sad. That openness scares him, so he lives in isolation. There are a lot of people who try to shoulder everything and feel like they have no one to turn to for help, especially taking care of a narcissist or other toxic, needy person like he is. It's so sad...

Oh, also, what he said about Embla having Bruno (if we didn't already know it was coming) would have been really alarming to hear. It was a good plot drop and concerning element, at least to the Askrans.

Oh dang. Okay, Embla released Bruno. Didn't expect that. And she's being more clever than I expected. Her analysis isn't bad, and it looks like she suspects something's up. She may even know the plan. Or, at least, Plan A. Ah, apparently, she just did her homework on Askr. Okay, I have to say, that earns her some respect from me. Well done, Ma'am. "Embla's...paranoia...is our ruin..." Oh man, I like how Bruno put that. (As you can see, I'm giving the play-by-play again.)

Ooooooooooh man.... "By Embla's will, close the way. Close the sky. Close the stone. Close it all. Become...alone." Okay, that incantation is heckin' chilling! And the music shift with it... Dang! (Even though I had to try to remember the first part to quote it and probably forgot stuff.) Man, how sad...she doesn't realize that Elm is gone, probably... She's more alone than she realizes... But dang! Okay, she feels much more like a serious threat now! She's shutting down the McGuffin!

Oh man, this is exactly the situation Bruno was trying to avoid so long ago. He ran away from his friends because he didn't want to hurt them, but knew that he couldn't resist it when Embla made him attack them. And so he began his quest to find a way to free himself and Veronica from Embla's blood so they could live in peace again. All that effort and time and loneliness and it all comes to this... Man, it's so sad...

"Please... Tell me you have a plan, Alfonse... You always have a plan!" Oh my gosh this is amazingly sad. Poor Alfonse, too, having so much put onto him like that. You know the guy's already wracking his brains to find a solution. (Sharena, you are NOT helping...but I get it.) Dang... This is really well-written, and, more importantly, had the proper buildup for this kind of drama. OH MAN okay so Sharena getting a new crying sprite was one thing but the look on Alfonse's face... Wow. Oh man... The way these guys are agonizing over this... Oh man this is amazing. What a way to end it. Just with the last line being "Zacharias is dead." Man... Poor guys... I love this. Man. I just want to see what Embla's doing while all this is happening. She's probably grinning maniacally, soaking all this suffering in. Sure, she wants the Askrans dead (especially the ones carrying Askr's blood) but I could see her waiting to kill them so she can enjoy all this. My goodness.

I do wonder why Bruno stopped himself from saying Veronica's name, and instead said "my sister." For a moment, it made me wonder if "Veronica" wasn't really her name, but this is probably just a translation thing. Like, by saying "my sister," he was probably being more tender about Veronica there, and letting himself express his closeness to her. (But dang, Bruno. You know the situation Veronica's in. It's entirely possible that she won't be able to be saved either. Don't make that your dying request when your friends are the main targets of Embla and will have enough of a time of it just trying to survive.) Still, I get it.

Loved it. This chapter was so good. Oh man. (Also, it makes me really, really want a Hel!Bruno. It looks like he and Lif would really get along well, not only because they technically used to be friends, but because they had similar experiences, such as being controlled against their will to do things they desperately didn't want to do.)

[Etrurian emperor]

5 hours ago, Mercakete said:

And then there was Elm's bit. Oh dang was that something. We got something of a snapshot of what his and Embla's daily life is like: Embla bemoaning her problems and Elm being there for her. She recognizes his loyalty, which is more than she does for most people, but it's just such a sad relationship dynamic. He was literally made to serve her, so it's not like with Freyr and Freyja where Freyr was enabling Freyja's bratty immaturity. Elm doesn't really have much of a choice: it was folded into his very being. Yet, I'm sure, he wishes that Embla showed care for him and his own concerns, too. When he went to Embla, all he did was try to assuage her own concerns, even though he was literally dying. He kept that to himself so that he would stave off her loneliness and worries for even just a little bit longer, but as a result, he has no one to help him through this. He's always there for Embla, but she's never there for him. It really fits the "broken bonds" theme of Embla, while still fitting the servant-master/parent-child relationship they have, and still has room for his loyalty without being contradictory. Embla's so absorbed in her own problems that she can't even see the suffering of the most loyal person to her in her life. And it's just so sad... Elm's handling all of this all on his own because he has no one he can lean on for help or comfort. Yet, Ash notices his pain and calls his bluff, making it plain for everyone what he's going through. Since he guards his pain so heavily, it's no wonder that having it exposed scared him, and so he lashed out instead, even after his defeat. It was really nice to see Ash expressing her sentiments of respect and what she has in common with Elm. It's probably because she's so open (cause of the whole "god of openness" thing) but she can see Elm's pain and problems fairly clearly, even though he was an enemy. I think that's a really neat and easily overlooked dynamic which occurred there, and it really made Elm's position even more sad. That openness scares him, so he lives in isolation. There are a lot of people who try to shoulder everything and feel like they have no one to turn to for help, especially taking care of a narcissist or other toxic, needy person like he is. It's so sad...

That's a nice analysis of their relation. Embla's clearly fond of her boy but so far its all take and no give.

Elm's a dead man walking so I guess that once he finally perishes Embla's going to realize that she'll miss him and snap.

[Mercakete]

28 minutes ago, Etrurian emperor said:

That's a nice analysis of their relation. Embla's clearly fond of her boy but so far its all take and no give.

Elm's a dead man walking so I guess that once he finally perishes Embla's going to realize that she'll miss him and snap.

Yeah, I think it's going in that direction, too (the Embla snap.) And thank you. 🙂 Though, I don't know if she's actually fond of Elm or just of the service he provides/role he fulfills. Being so self-focused, I don't think she even knows Elm very well at all, despite having been his creator.

Hmm thinking of the dynamic of how much Embla noticed and how much Ash noticed about Elm's suffering, I can't help but draw this conclusion: "Those who look within live without. Those who look without live within." (Original quote by me -- I just came up with it.) That is, the more you look to others' circumstances, needs, and feelings, the more you wind up being a part of something bigger yourself. But if you only look to address your own needs and desires, you will live without others to help and support you. So, if you're feeling sorry for yourself, maybe you should look around at what other people need and try to help them out instead of just trying to make yourself feel better, because then the healing will come automatically as you realize you're not alone anymore. This story really shows that well, and it may be its central theme (even thinking back to when Letizia tried to use everyone around her to fulfill her own desires as opposed to Veronica who was trying to be selfless (even if that was kind of a sudden leap in character development.))

[Sunwoo]

It's kind of amazing how despite having absolutely no expectations for the story, IS continues to disappoint me.

While I was never overly attached to Bruno, what happened to him this chapter is so utterly dumb. This is basically a Surtr situation all over again, where the main villain pulls out their SUDDEN INVINCIBILITY CARD on the protagonists and the reason their plan failed is for incredibly stupid reasons that only serves to drag out the plot more and didn't need to exist and just makes everything pointless. And sometimes weren't even foreshadowed ... merely pulled out of the villain's ass right then and there.

There are literally two chapters left in book 6, should IS stick to its formula (and I have no reason to believe they'll break the 13-chapter mold). Our heroes have literally two chapters to figure out how to put down Embla AND actually put down Embla. This is going to be incredibly rushed, incredibly half-assed, and incredibly stupid.

[Tybrosion]

That feel when Hrid is the only non-Alfonse male OC left alive in the main story (Elm doesn't count because he's next to die), but only because he wasn't even worth killing off due to being that irrelevant and unnecessary.

[Othin]

I'm not sure what appeal IS expects this to have.

Heroes is at its best when it's not trying to be edgy.

[Humanoid]

Killing off male heirs and having female ones abdicate so that the lord of a given title can rule the entire world is basically *the* Fire Emblem plot, is it not?

[Sunwoo]

26 minutes ago, Humanoid said:

Killing off male heirs and having female ones abdicate so that the lord of a given title can rule the entire world is basically *the* Fire Emblem plot, is it not?

Hey man, that's literally how FE1 ends!

Even if they've been getting a little better about this, the society that produced FE games is still a society that by law doesn't allow a woman to become empress in a society where emperor is a ceremonial role with no power. I imagine some people in IS back in the 90s, ah ... didn't like the idea of a female actually keeping power.

[DefyingFates]

9 hours ago, Sunwoo said:

And sometimes weren't even foreshadowed ... merely pulled out of the villain's ass right then and there.

While Embla's anti spell came out of nowhere, it does make sense if you think about it: she knows what Askr is capable of, so having a contigency in place doesn't seem too farfetched. If anything it makes it weirder than past antagonists never bothered to check if they had their own kryptonites.

But yeah, it is annoying that Bruno got killed off so abruptly. We got new art for him and the Askrans though, that was a nice surprise! I'm curious what he told Xander about as well.

As for Elm... well, he's definitely dying soon, but seeing his "obsession in action" so to speak in his conversation with Embla helps his characterization a little by adding context to it. We'll see how Embla reacts to his death, I guess.