Cynthia

I didn't say it was relevant. And to be honest from what you said on AIM, if you're going to hold a grudge over something on a forum, you're the one being immature. I do not hold grudges against anyone on the internet simply because it's immature and gets no one anywhere. Sorry but that was the most immature thing ever done, telling me you can't talk to me anymore because of a disagreement on a forum. Also it's funny how you tell us we're being rude to the staff by being rude back and even admitting you're being rude. Then you start behaving rudely off the forums. I don't think. "I can't talk to you anymore because you fucking annoy me." is a polite thing to send someone on AIM especially when they weren't talking to you on AIM to begin with.

That's your opinion. It's not fact. Just because you think we're being immature does not make it so. Irrelevant, but it's one of my pet peeves: It's improper English to end a sentence with "at."

So you're going to judge a topic but not read it? Sorry, but I have to STRONGLY disagree, as this is a public discussion and we should be allowed to post our opinions on WHOEVER enters here. You tell US we need maturity and respect yet say we're a bunch of idiots and have no maturity, tact, or anything?

All relevant, and posing a good point. Also the moderators doing their jobs is all relevant to this topic, as the spam comes from moderators taking no action. Not to Fox brought it to the table.

That's nice and all, but if you read the whole topic, I already quoted that and we had a discussion about it... I suggest you go back and read it.

And yet we're not allowed to post opinions that oppose the staff members, but we are allowed to post a million messages saying, "Lol!" "XD" "ROFL" "lulz" and take up more bandwidth?

Well, it's a personal opinion. It's not bashing, as Death truly believes she is not doing her job correctly. Just because Fox feels she is doesn't automatically make it true. Death was stating an opinion that he believes to be true, if Fox is allowed to state her opinion saying she is doing her job, why is Death not entitled to his? How are we supposed to trust a staff that won't even take criticism so that they can either improve or move out of the way for someone else to do the job. The fact he got warned for all of that just shows that he's just being discouraged from going on, when no one has proved he was wrong. Just because a staff member says it does NOT make it true.

There's a difference between bashing and disagreeing. If we can't point out the incompetence of the staff and what expectations we have from them, then what CAN we do to ask for improvement from them? Are you suggesting we just accept the staff how they are and never oppose them?

I have to say it DOES sound that way from what I've been seeing in here... However as you said, to each his/her own right?

Looks to me like you said you don't care. You don't care about an issue that was brought up. An issue that happens to be a concern for this place. How much can you love it if you don't care if other people are upset with things that are happening here.

I will admit, I am not a very siding person. I won't side with someone just because they are a friend. In fact even if I am siding with them, and they cross the line, I tell them to take a step back, as I did tell Blue Fox when he was going too far. But when I see someone makes a point and they are right about something, I WILL side with them. Just as if I thought Red Fox or Zeph was right, I'd side with them no questions asked. I carry a policy of, I'll only stand by you if you're right. I won't stand by you simply because you're a friend, because friends can be wrong too. But I have to say that I am going to have to side with Arch, Blue Fox, ZXValaRevan, Death, and Tino.

If you're just going to walk away and not care, then perhaps you shouldn't have that job in the first place, and give it up to someone else that does. Nothing personal, just if you really cared about Serenes Forest you would either at least acknowledge it's a problem and say you're going to at least DISCUSS IT with the other staff members, and not just tell us to deal with it, or give the job to someone else who will. This is about what's best for the forest in the long run, not about the satisfaction of the few.

The other two staff members who posted here pretty much said they realize it's a problem, and they don't have a solution at this time. And pretty much are saying they'll get back to us on it. The reason no one said anything to them, is because they acknowledged there's a problem, and said something should be done, but they aren't sure what yet. What you did Fox was say you didn't see a problem, and started to justify the problem. Even though if 5 people are complaining about it, it's obviously a problem. That's why people targeted you, because they disagreed, and you continued to try and justify the problem. Even saying you don't know what to do about the issue, and that you'll come back when you have an idea, or just discussing it with other staff members would have been enough. But when you deny it's a problem, it makes us worry that the staff don't see it as a problem, and therefore aren't going to address it.

I just have one question, and that is: How many complaints must be registered about a problem before it is addressed? Because we have about 5-6 people complaining about one problem already.

You said without reports it's hard to do your job, and if you can't do it alone, then obviously you need help. Your suggestions to fix problems are so similar whenever I see you give them. Maybe it's just me, but pretty much all they ever seem to do is either state that you don't believe it's an issue worth addressing, if an issue at all, or that we should just deal with it because there is nothing that can be done. I am rather concerned about this, then again it may just be me.

ZXValaRevan makes a good point. We can't deem these topics, "reportable," because you'll just send something back saying it's spam in a spam forum. So what's the point in reporting them if nothing is done about them?

Red Fox, if you say we didn't need more moderators, and now you're saying you're having trouble doing your job, and that without reports it makes it harder, when we got 1 new moderator and 1 new admin, then clearly we DO need more moderators, or more out of the ones we have.

Basically, we want it so that just because members who post this idiocy outnumber us, doesn't mean they should be allowed to do so and trample us over because they have superior numbers.

To add to what Blue Fox said, I have nothing against you personally Red Fox, but I disagree with some of the things you are saying and/or doing. But basically the smart have little to no power, while the village idiot controls the show. We can't keep bending things to please the spammers. If we stop some of the spamming now, and start getting people into good habits and behavior, we won't need as much moderation.

I'm sure you've seen reports from me. So there's no need to answer that question, as you already know, but to humor you, I see things almost EVERYDAY that don't need to be there, or shouldn't be there. And the point of this topic is that the amount of idiocy in the FFtF section needs to stop, if we reported all of it, then you wouldn't be able to do your job simply because there would be too much job to do. I am addressing your side of things because you brought it up, I am just making a reply to your statements. Edit: And if you read that, it says you said we DIDN'T need more moderators.

Also, you were one of the people who said we didn't need any more moderators, and now you're telling us you're having trouble doing your job?

Logging on now and then and addressing issues is one thing, but flat out ignoring entire sections is another. Plus we can't have EVERY moderator doing that. Yes, we are encouraging people to report, but we are also saying that not everything gets reported right away, because of an irresponsible bunch of users, and they become irresponsible from not being attended to by the staff. As much as I detest having to be babysat by staff members, the users here have proven they are incapable of handling themselves without it. Thus all staff members should try a little more to look at more sections to see what is going on. If the job is too hard for you, then resign. No one is FORCING you to do this job. You can ask for help too, as it's not as if you can't put a request in for more help. However I have no way of telling if you have already done that or not. Plus I just said I'm not pointing the finger at you specifically, and I give you credit for what you do. You understood the conditions when taking the job. So unless you just took it to have power and be higher than everyone, which I highly doubt, as I see you as more sensible than that, then you have to be ready to be addressed with these problems and help compromise about it.

Let's not point the finger at her. As it isn't entirely her fault, its all the people who spam there's fault, and the other staff members who share the blame. As I do give Fox credit for actually trying at least once, regardless of being successful or not, she made and effort, she just stopped trying after that. Mostly because she had insufficient help.

All that does is creates more and more issues that you're ignorant on, then you have to spend time playing catch up to figure out where judgment is needed, and by then the problem escalates.

I thought you were supposed to help the members, not yourself? Just because YOU don't see it as a problem doesn't mean it doesn't need to be addressed, as obviously some of us do. Staff members are supposed to take care of their members, and address their problems as a group. Yes I know they aren't supposed to cater to our every demand, but if there is a problem bothering the memberbase, whether you see it as a problem or not doesn't mean it should not be considered. The fact that you failed at it is a sign you should try and take it up with other staff members, and other members to find a solution. There's nothing wrong with admitted you can't do it alone, as I understand you alone can not do it. If all you care about is what bothers you and not us, then you shouldn't have accepted the job.