Mekkah

I find Elice useful in Warpskipping FE11. If you are forced to let someone die in the Hammerne chapter (since you have to visit it with Marth then Warp him out of there), you only have 2 Warpers without Elice, which means you can't use Hammerne and do a full skip. This matters if you are using Swordmaster Shiida for her joining chapter (if you're using Dracoknight you need to rig a crit I think), and it also matters in 24x. I guess it doesn't matter if you have enough of an opportunity to Hammerne beforehand, but I'm not sure of that. dondon used Maria in his newest FE11 0% growths run, simply because she would be able to Warp.

I expected more discussion on what would have been a more appropriate top 30 but I definitely don't mind this. Now I'm quite late in responding to this but GOD DAMN SOMEONE IS WRONG ON THE INTERNET That wall only has 10 HP left. Barth can break it, Oujay can walk through, Wendy can just go back to being Bottom Tier.

10/10 awesome bosskiller with luna, stays alive forever with nosferatu, and the only dark magic user in the game so you pretty much have to use him anyway

Guy also has like 2 less con than Raven before promotion, js. Raven is obviously not doing all that much for the most efficient playstyles, but if you're being a tad slower and you like someone that kills stuff, Raven is awesome. Raven already starts ORKOing some enemy types at base level, which is more than a lot of people can say. I'd say 6/10 for efficiency and 8.5/10 for, well, less efficiency.

Erk and Lucius have like the same offense throughout the game taking everything into account. But Lucius has C staves so he wins. Still not the greatest unit.

1/10 can't be better than fucking bartre lol

That's what I used to think, but then I never needed it. Better off just using it to make it easier to train him up.

In Elincia's case it's really more the fault of her sissy sword.

Other logical problems that I'm sure will be addressed by others aside, grinding is not a rule in FE. Maybe if it were so "difficult" (strong enemies vs weak PCs) that you couldn't beat it without grinding, then it would be a proper flaw. I dunno about FE2, but FE8 is considered one of the easiest games even by people who do not enter tower/skirmishes.

She doesn't do anything though. Negative utility. Leaf wins for being in FE1, FE3, FE4, FE5 and FE12 imo. He's just called Rody in some of them.

Seth is one of the longer reviews. There's just not as much to say about him. Note that he did get some attention even in Sigurd's review :p

Alright, this is it. Two more units. Everyone knows which they are, the only question left to ask is: which one of them is going to win? And the number two of the Top 30 best units of all time is... 2. Seth, from FE8 How do you describe Seth without repeating yourself? I don't know. Seth has every good quality from the below units, except perhaps the flying part, and then some more. For one last time, we have a GBA Paladin, which means 8 movement, more WTC than most units (though he lacks axes), and the ability to ferry units around. This is backed up by the best availability in the game, beating even Eirika since she's not on Ephraim route, and then also the best combat in the game. With "pretty good" bases (ridiculous for his join time, of course) and an A in both lances and swords, Seth can take down the most cheesy mooks with just Javelins, and the strongest bosses with a wide arsenal of more valuable weapons, most notably that Silver Lance he joins with. For the most part, FE7 Marcus had this in the bag too. What makes Seth so ridiculous is that he has some of the best growths in the game on top of it all. 90% HP, 50% Str, 45% Skl, 45% Spd, 40% Def, 30% Res and 25% Luk keeps him going all game long as long as he gets enough bosskills, and in an efficient playthrough it's pretty much impossible not to give him bosskills. Early on he's a tank and ORKO (often OHKO) machine because of his good bases, but he doesn't actually slow down one bit in any way. Wherever you move Seth, he leaves a path of destruction, which makes him the best unit for clearing the way to the boss (and the boss himself), or just taking out a portion of a rout map by himself. Seth is so strong that if you use him to his full potential, you pretty much have no room to train anything else whatsoever. And this is fine for most maps, because there are plenty of units in this game that can function just fine at base level, or little EXP. Duessel, Cormag, Gerik, Saleh, etc. This style of play generally makes it desirable to make Seth even more broken by loading stat boosters on him, since he will doing almost all the fighting. Luckily, FE8 gives you an Angelic Robe AND a Dracoshield pretty early, minimizing Seth's *gasp* death chances. One more thing I want to mention about Seth is that he gets to abuse 3x Mt slayer weapons, unlike for example FE7 Marcus or FE9 Titania. And unlike FE6 Marcus, he gets to have good accuracy with them. So whenever not even Silver or Killer weapons do the trick, Seth has access to an extra trick up his sleeve. Why is he not #1, then? He dominates the whole game, right? Well, he definitely does that, but he has some very very tiny flaws. For one, there are chapters where he is not the most important unit, or not by far. Ch7 comes to mind, where it's Vanessa who transports him and Eirika over the river. Or just Eirika if she's strong enough, or any combat unit that can handle that place. Then there's the desert chapter where he is limited on where to go, and Ch20 which is like 70% forest, so he'll likely take a backseat to either fliers or Warpers. It seem almost unfair to "penalize" a unit for extremely minor things like this, but that's what it comes down to when you are this close to the top! That leaves us with one more unit, and that unit is none other than... 1. Sigurd, from FE4 Sigurd isn't just a unit in FE4. Sigurd is FE4, at least for the first generation (but as I said, I count that as a whole game simply because otherwise you get Fin as best unit). The story and the gameplay is all about Sigurd, everyone else is simply a side effect. To beat the six chapters he appears in, you need nothing but Sigurd to win...and he'll do it quite efficiently, too. This is his main difference with Seth, who is often restricted by chapter win conditions that require more than just him. Getting Eirika to the throne, or routing an entire map, that's something he plays a great part in, but he's never the whole picture. Sigurd, however, defines how fast you complete chapters. He is kind of like Celice in that sense, including the part where every droppable item pretty much falls into his hands through the natural flow of things, except he doesn't have to promote. He starts out prepromoted (I snicker every time young Oifaye goes "You can't promote. Leave.", he's so rude) and, as some people say it, he's his own Jeigan. Except he's not a Paladin and his growths are nothing like Jeigan's. 50% Str, 50% Skl, 40% Def, and my favourite, 110% HP. Thanks Holy blood! 30% Spd is a bummer, but once again, we're playing FE4. Sigurd is using swords and his base Spd is sufficient to double 90% already, so all he needs is some Spd procs and he'll take care even of those "fast" Swordsmen. The fact that promoted units don't get an EXP cut in this game allows Sigurd's level to skyrocket until he hits that soft ceiling (15 levels above whatever you kill, and you actually stop gaining EXP, lol). While Sigurd's * in swords does not give him 5% hit/crt like you might want it to, it does allow him to use every sword in the game, including the Prologue Silver Sword. Now, a lot of the times people make the mistake of assuming that weapons certain people receive through events is theirs (Jamka's Killer Bow, Ayra's Hero Sword), but for Sigurd, there isn't even any possible competition* at first. Even when people who have the required A in swords join, they're always behind him by miles in everything (Ayra can't overkill an enemy with 23890320 Astra hits if Sigurd gets there first). Sigurd taking out enemies faster does so many things for you at once, you should be wondering why you'd do it with anyone else. First off, it gets him delicious EXP, so he gains more stats and kills things even more. Second, it gets enemies out of his way really quickly (since he's so strong), which means he can move his full movement next turn and seize earlier. Third, it buils up kills on the weapon he is using, which at some point allows him to start critting things. * Ethlin should be in the kitchen and not on the battlefield As you can see, Sigurd's growing is kind of an infinite circle of positive feedback. He's kind of like a can of pringles that you don't even need to pop, he'll do it for you. If that all isn't amazing enough, Sigurd also gets a personal legendary weapon in Ch5 that happens to be pretty much forged for beating the last few "difficult" bosses. It's the same one Celice gets: +20 Res, +10 Skl, and +10 Spd, and it's just as ridiculous. My favourite part of it is that it allows you to ignore those annoying Sleep Staff priests when marching through the desert. Speaking of that...Sigurd's desert has a convenient road paved through it, unlike Seth's (though Seth can still contribute on the border, he's just limited on where to go). And even though there are some units that can cross through the actual desert faster than Sigurd (I can only think of Fury but maybe the foot units beat him too), the chapter still requires Sigurd to reach the end for it to matter. The lack of competition for Sigurd's dominance is also a big factor in why he is #1. To put it in perspective, let's take FE6 Roy. Now imagine if he had the class and base stats of Marcus, with the weapon levels of Percival, the EXP gain of Dieck, while his growths are...well, no one in FE6 comes close except Karel and Fa, but just imagine they are awesome! Also, he can repair his amazing weapons an infinite amount of times. That is what Sigurd is, sort of. A quick word on a few units you or I might have expected to be on there, but missed out for some reason or another. In no particular order. Thanks to everyone who read the whole thing, or even part of it. It was a lot of fun to write, which was really the main point. For those who didn't notice yet, there's a convenient index in the OP so you can reread it whenever you feel like it. And feel free to make your own lists and we'll see if we can churn out something great. I know for a fact there will be a lot of Alanceless lists...

10 turns for 5 star tactics 1900 EXP for 5 star EXP 99500G for 5 star funds You do get the Fell Contract but it doesn't seem like the best chapter to pad your rankings overall. Still, I'd want to do that for a sense of completion. Have you tried burning RNs so that Jaffar dodges more things?

Hi I'm back, thanks to the_pugilist for filling in for me. 1. Convoy Zeis, from FE6 RR (outdated patch) For those who don't know, RR means Reverse Recruitment. It's a hack type where the joining time of all characters are reversed, and their bases are adjusted to what they would be if they were that lowered or upped level. For example, in FE7 RR, Vaida and Lowen switch places, so Vaida joins as a L2 Wyvern Rider and gets her levels and bases adjusted so that if you were to level her up to the L9 Wyvern Lord she is normally, she'd have those bases. Meanwhile Lowen joins as a L9 Paladin in Cog of Destiny. Zeis replaces Merlinus, and therefore joins in Ch2, carrying around the oh so important convo. As anyone who has followed the FE7 tier list would know, having the convoy is a big deal even if you are just a map tile that would otherwise be ranked below forest, mountain, river and plains. You are carrying 100+ items (I believe FE6 is even 200), which alone holds up your funds rank. It allows you to take a 6th item without having to discard one, increasing your flexibility. It means you don't have to put up with constant trading from one character to another. But Zeis isn't just a map tile. He's a flying tent! With his fine HP/Str/Spd/Def bases, he'll kick the unfortunate butt of any enemy that tries to cut down your supply convoy. Bows and magic cause some issues, but that's what you have Juno, Percival, and Niime for.

I see your lips moving but all I hear is "nuh-uh!".

3/10 1-range and what might as well be WTD lock, horrible durability (worse than Lucius taking everything into account), stuck with 5 mov for a long time due to a stupid promotion item, and offense is only really good vs axers and things that often carry lances. Salvageable but just not worth the trouble. There's worse things to put up with when trying to get Geitz though, like Eliwood. One of the most overrated units in FE history.

You can't blame me for checking out why there's a baby crying so loud that I can hear it five blocks away.

Hiding your idiocy on forums where people are less likely to refute it, eh? You're pathetic.

Ah yes, Hammerne is very important. cba editing it in though, plus once again I must say that the posts between the rankings can sometimes just be as informative as the actual rankings for anyone rereading this topic later. And yes, generations are counted separately, or else you would have seen Fin on here.

Haar is fine at BEXPing, I thought? 46 HP (4 from cap), 24 Skl (2 from cap), and 23 Def (3 from cap) with 9 levels to work with seems enough ...then again, wow, 30% HP growth, that's terrible rofl. 3. Saphy, from FE5 and Lena, from FE11 Two frail little sisters all the way up there, sitting rather uncomfortably with badasses such as Haar and Marcus. What exactly have they done to get to the top? Surely it can't have been "take a lot of hits", because both of these get OHKO'd pretty consistently in their respective games. It can't have been their combat, because they have none until they promote (well, Lena can go Mage, but she shouldn't), and even when they've promoted it isn't amazing enough to be up here. However, I am pretty convinced that both of these units broke the games they are in, multiple times. The reason why: infinite range Warp, almost instantly, nearly the entire game long. They can reduce the chapter from "fight your way to the seize point, through all the enemies" to "Warp, bosskill, Warp, seize", turning this strategy game into a non-strategy game. And with that in mind, who cares if their stats are bad? Only one enemy matters, and that's the boss. For FE5, the main bosskiller (when Warp is available) is Asvel, and maybe Mareeta counts too. In FE11, it will be Dracoknight Shiida, sometimes replaced by Swordmaster Shiida. At the end, throw in a little Galzus/Sety/Nagi/etc, but for the most part, the game becomes a less-than-five-men show. Of course, as the game goes on, more units with the capability to Warp join, and that would kind of rain on their parades...but on the other hand, you often need 2 Warps for a 1-turn win (bosskiller + lord), and sometimes you want to Warp even more than that to get important things from villages, or recruit new characters, or get new Warp staves. The best example of this is the Hammerne Staff in FE11, which is actually rather tricky to get when you've been skipping entire chapters! Warpskipping is not something done by JUST these units, but they are such a huge part of it and they change the dynamics of the game so much that I felt #3 was sufficient for them. The only things better than Warp trivializers, imo, are units that literally trivialize the entire game, from start to end. I could have tagged Malleelsleielslesilesia in here, but 1) I don't really have enough FE12 H3 experience to comment properly on her, and 2) she can't Warp in H3, just Rescue, and Rescue is significantly less game breaking. It saves quite a few turns if your Marth goes sidetracking, but it's not like Warp where you just jump over all the enemies, kill the boss and take the throne. In addition, you do get Wendel and Etzel quickly enough to kinda dimnish the worth (I don't believe you need multiple Rescues very often?). Maybe she should have been somewhere in the Top30, but we can always evaluate that later.

Why are you even expecting people to acknowledge your pathetic whining when you only respond to the single sentence out of people's post that you have a halfassed answer for? Okay fine, if the one I made doesn't count then make it an 8.

I kinda wrote it fast but it was almost everything I knew about him. I mentioned that he's slow and I mentioned the three main ways people fix it up. What more were you expecting?

I'll be giving some more honorable mentions when the Top30 is completed, along with reasons why they were not included. 4. Haar, from FE10 2-P was put into the game for one reason: to kickstart Haar's career of awesome. Where all these winged sissies are failing to do significant damage to all those scary Dracoknights, Haar comes in, laughs at their feeble attempts to damage him and puts an axe through their skull. And then there's a million more jokes I could put in about how that's him with his eyepatch on, or how he does it while taking a nap, but I don't think that's necessary. Haar is extremely tough. 46 HP and 23 Def is not easy to get through, especially when they got rid of the arrow weak for wyverns. His 23 Str plus axes also gives him some extreme power per hit, even though it takes some tricks to get him to double with that lowish 20 Spd. Thankfully, several of Haar's stats are close enough to capping to make BEXPing his Spd a serious option. In addition, he's a great Speedwing candidate, because the only thing that's better than an indestructible flier that kills everything in two rounds is an indestructible flier that kills everything in one round. A Master Crown also goes a long way towards getting him to double. Along with things like the Brave Lance and Killer weapons, you can minimize Haar's little speed problem and maximize his perks. Haar decides he might as well join up with the Greil Mercenaries in 3-2 after probably killing Ludveck in 2-E in a matter of 1-2 turns, and proceeds to show everyone what consequences a powerful flier at this point of the game has. The map layout and objectives for the upcoming chapters all greatly favor Haar. In 3-2, he can fly over to the boss in 2 turns and get rid of him with I believe just a Stun or critical proc. In 3-3, you basically have to seize several points of the map (though "putting things on fire" sounds cooler), and who is better at that than a flier that can get anywhere on the map in a moment's notice? In 3-4, Ranulf and Ike both need to reach the top of the mountain. Haar can carry one of them while the other makes their way up there the hard way. 3-5, Haar's best friend Reyson joins the frey, and together they can Canto-destroy the entire map, starting us off with a nice 1-turn. 3-6, Haar can fly into the swamp to kill all the laguz with ea-...oh, he is taking a nap in that one. My bad. 3-7 is boring but Haar can contribute anyways if you want Ike to get to the Black Knight ASAP. 3-8 and 3-10 he's just a high move unit that greatly assists the rout, 3-11 he can carry Ike to the seize point, 3-13 you should be glad you don't have to fight him, 3-E he's useful but not as turbo amazing. Part 4 has a lot more terrain to fly over, most notably the desert. Haar dominates from the moment he joins. He does take a resource or two to go from "dominant" to "isitabirdisitaplane" level, and in addition he doesn't laugh at the ENTIRE game (Part 1, and then he also slows down a little speed wise occasionally). That's why he's #4, not #1. But he's still so awesome.

I was just taking precautions for him lowering the score even further.

Except Pent and Erk's combat has been shown to be exactly the same in the chapter after Pent joins, and you've given no evidence to the contrary. And Erk can also do quite a lot of things that Pent can't, among which are killing enemies in Ch15, killing enemies in Ch16, killing enemies in Ch17, killing enemies in Ch18... But that's not even the main point here. I am not disputing Pent > Erk. I am disputing that Pent's combat "crushes" Erk's. All you are doing is bringing up other things not related to their direct combat parameters. Again with the pretty numbers that mean nothing in a vacuum. I can't even be bothered pulling the exact numbers here at several levels (I doubt you're giving Erk his proper level lead), but you are failing to take into account that both Erk and Lucius will generally ORKO any enemy they manage to double. If they don't double, then they're bringing something into a range where anyone except maybe some scrub like Rebecca can KO it. Beyond that, you are acting like they should always be compared Fire vs Lighting, Thunder vs Shine. This is not how it works in the game. Erk has a Thunder tome with him from the moment he joins, and can buy more from vendors in 17x or 18. Lucius doesn't have Shine available until some Monk drops it in 21, and it doesn't become available in shops until 26...which is when Erk can buy Elfire. Divine isn't even buyable until 31x. Okay, a little tidbit on how much Lucius's damage lead matters. Enemy samples from Dragon's Gate: 28 HP/2 Res/7 AS Cavaliers. 11 AS needed to double, 16 Atk needed to 2HKO. Erk hits 12 Spd at L11, where he has 9 Mag, which gives him 17 Atk with Thunder. Lucius has 11.2 Spd at L6, but he needs 12 Mag for the 2HKO with Lighting, so he actually needs to be 11/0 or 12/0 to do the trick. Almost everything else you can think of has similar numbers that don't help Lucius more than Erk. 23 HP/2 Res/9-10 Spd Nomads, they will probably not double. 27 HP/3 Res/2 AS Knights, neither of them have problems. 27 HP/2 Res/8 Spd Archers that often weigh themselves down, not an issue. 30 HP/2 Res/8 Spd Fighters, same. 22 HP/6 Res/7 AS Mages. 17 Atk needed to 2HKO. Erk needs one more Mag level-up on top of what he has above to do this, but Lucius needs two since he has WTD. The only enemies Erk has more trouble with than Lucius are Shamans, who have roughly the same parameters as Mages. But Lucius still needs to hit 16 Atk to 2HKO them. You could argue they can promote with the Guiding Ring from the Pirate Ship, but then they both ORKO everything on this map. You're acting like there's some situation where Rebecca can be more useful to field than Erk. There isn't really one, again unless you are facing hordes of flying enemies that always attack you at range, and even then Erk could prolly 2HKO. That and Rebecca is completely irrelevant in a case of Erk vs Pent, or Erk vs Lucius. If Rebecca is more useful in a situatin than Erk, she is probably more useful than Lucius and Pent too, at combat. Not that this would ever be the case.