PAIRINGS The Pairing Thread

[Flying Shogi]

Leaving it off is definitely OK sometimes, but if you are going to drop a GF I recommend doing it on Noire to open her up to a wider range of fathers.

To look at things in a different light, think of GF not as an offensive skill but as a mobility skill. Your units typically start their turns very clustered together so your Rallybots can hit them all. Even with Rallies Heart/Mov and the occasional Deliverer, 8-Mov lead or +Mov support, there are only going to be so many enemies you can reach from where you start out, and odds are there will be fewer enemies than you have attacks. Having two GFs in one pair gives you 1.5x the movement range of your non-double Galepairs, allowing you to reach enemies that are further away and increase your efficiency of kills per turn. It's pretty nice.

If I were to not give Noire GF, who would you recommend her father to be?

I think I've never fully saw GF as a movement skill. I usually don't use the extra turn given by GF to move but rather attack so that could be the reason why.

[Czar_Yoshi]

Okay, I almost thought so. My Avatar ended up being pretty mediocre with +HP/-Luck. I married Nowi in my first file by accident (had no idea that you could marry anyone and just paired up with her to preserve her Dragonstone and then just before chapter 13, they ended up getting married). Never married her again, but I recently looked back at my first file (which I still have for some reason) and I thought "Hey, maybe this pairing can do better" but eh... I don't really want to be accused of pedophilia so... in hindsight, I probably won't do that again (no means no, right?). Thinking about marrying Sumia in my next file to get a strong Dark Flier mage Cynthia. Is +Magic/-Strength a good approach for this if I want to mainly use magic as a Grandmaster and get Cynthia and Morgan to have good stats with Sumia as a mother?

OK, so a) this is a very gameplay oriented forum that won't judge you for your pairing preferences (unless you talk really loudly about them), and b) Avatar is one of Nowi's tamest supports, so I'd honestly encourage doing it for anyone trying not to be creepy.

Sumia is one of Avatar's best first gen options (along with Cordelia and Aversa) though she still carries all the normal caveats of marrying first gen (no 3rd gen Morgan and a benched Nah). A Def flaw will work slightly better than Str in the long run, but +Mag/-Str is still pretty good. You could also consider going +Spd.

If I were to not give Noire GF, who would you recommend her father to be?

I think I've never fully saw GF as a movement skill. I usually don't use the extra turn given by GF to move but rather attack so that could be the reason why.

Non-GF Noire hasn't been fully explored, but I think she'll work well with Frederick, Virion and Vaike for both non-Apo postgame and Apo. Personally, I'm using Fred in my 100% DS team.

I use the extra turn on GF to attack pretty often too, but it's fairly rare that I attack something that's right next to my first target- usually I press further into the block of enemies to pick a target (normal postgame, so I get more fights on EP. Apo, so there are more nearby units for the rest of my team to reach- it's a pity to waste turns because there were no targets in range).

[Diabeasty]

I would think Gregor would be a good choice for a non-GF Noire, personally. She gets solid stats and a pretty nice set of skills to work with. Plus Gregor is a relatively low demand father, even if he's usually just given to Laurent out of convenience.

[Ownagepuffs]

For a non Galeforce Noire, Gregor is without a doubt the best choice. Gregor gives her sword and axefaire along with Astra for Astra/Luna and Vengeance for Vantage/Vengeance. It's crazy how diverse Gregor!Noire is.

[Alastor15243]

For a non Galeforce Noire, Gregor is without a doubt the best choice. Gregor gives her sword and axefaire along with Astra for Astra/Luna and Vengeance for Vantage/Vengeance. It's crazy how diverse Gregor!Noire is.

You mean VANTAGE for vantage/vengeance, right?

[Owain_the_swordsman]

Just a question, should my Sumia!Lucina and Chrom!Cynthia be physical or magical?I know they both have a +1 magic and +0 strength but I'm still not sure how to run then. Also, what class should Lucina be?Cynthia will run dark flier or falcon knight.I know dark flier is one of the best for Lucina, but she misses out on a very important weapon-Parallel Falchion. That infinite use is very useful, so I was thinking great knight or paladin, but I still need some advice.Thx

[Flying Shogi]

Rearranging the pairings around I now get:

Tharja x Frederick

Panne x Gaius

Cherche x Gregor

This means:

1) Sage!Owain will now lead and Paladin!Noire will help Owain reach 70 Speed without AS + 2 nor tonic. If Noire was a Sniper, Owain would have to run AS + 2 over Tomefaire and I would have to give Owain a Speed tonic. Dunno which one is better.

2) Gerome gets both Axefaire and AT so I'm happy. If I replace Lucina's Bowfaire with AS + 2 and give her a speed tonic, she'll have 75 speed with Hero!Gerome support

[Alastor15243]

Just a question, should my Sumia!Lucina and Chrom!Cynthia be physical or magical?I know they both have a +1 magic and +0 strength but I'm still not sure how to run then. Also, what class should Lucina be?Cynthia will run dark flier or falcon knight.I know dark flier is one of the best for Lucina, but she misses out on a very important weapon-Parallel Falchion. That infinite use is very useful, so I was thinking great knight or paladin, but I still need some advice.Thx

Both Sumia!Lucina and Chrom!Cynthia make crazy amazing snipers capable of cutting through apotheosis like it's nothing if they have a partner whose class grants them at least 8 speed.

Parallel Falchion is great in-game, but postgame, you have better options, like forged brave weapons. Or if you ban them, like I do, forged silver swords surpass it too. It's pretty devastating against wyverns, but then, so are bows.

And Lugh: Speed tonics cost like 75 gold a pop once you've cleared IR at least once. There's no reason to base your strategy around not using them unless you've specifically banned them.

Edited November 23, 2014 by Alastor15243

[Leon_Cerberus]

I have a male avatar with +Skill/-Luck. I don't care about DLC which means no Apoth. Who would be the best wife for my Avatar on a Lunatic+ run?

Edited November 23, 2014 by Leon_Cerberus

[Alastor15243]

I have a male avatar with +Skill/-Luck. I don't care about DLC which means no Apoth. Who would be the best wife for my Avatar on a Lunatic+ run?

I haven't got a clue about male avatars on Lunatic+. I have heard that for Lunatic+, Female avatars generally are best off marrying Chrom though.

[Czar_Yoshi]

Just a question, should my Sumia!Lucina and Chrom!Cynthia be physical or magical?I know they both have a +1 magic and +0 strength but I'm still not sure how to run then. Also, what class should Lucina be?Cynthia will run dark flier or falcon knight.I know dark flier is one of the best for Lucina, but she misses out on a very important weapon-Parallel Falchion. That infinite use is very useful, so I was thinking great knight or paladin, but I still need some advice.Thx

Generally they're either Snipers or DFs. P.Falchion isn't really a big deal (and GK is a terrible class for endgame).

Rearranging the pairings around I now get:

Tharja x Frederick

Panne x Gaius

Cherche x Gregor

This means:

1) Sage!Owain will now lead and Paladin!Noire will help Owain reach 70 Speed without AS + 2 nor tonic. If Noire was a Sniper, Owain would have to run AS + 2 over Tomefaire and I would have to give Owain a Speed tonic. Dunno which one is better.

2) Gerome gets both Axefaire and AT so I'm happy. If I replace Lucina's Bowfaire with AS + 2 and give her a speed tonic, she'll have 75 speed with Hero!Gerome support

Panne x Gaius? If you're not using GF Noire, there's absolutely no reason not to use Gaius!Kjelle, who's fairly close to being another Lon'qu!Severa and has potential to be one of your best units. Gaius has nothing for Yarne either besides mods (which Fred is better in), so at the very least you'd want to switch Gaius and Fred (Gaius!Noire makes a nice Bride, which will give Owain his 75 Spd and a +Mag support to boot).

I have a male avatar with +Skill/-Luck. I don't care about DLC which means no Apoth. Who would be the best wife for my Avatar on a Lunatic+ run?

Cordelia in general is a very strong choice for lategame Lunatic+ due to having Sol+GF and giving excellent starting classes to your children, and isn't very hard to get going if you get her a nice weapon and support. If you're willing to Dance spam to boost Olivia's stats and save your Seed of Trust to shave a chapter off her B support, she can also be a strong choice thanks to starting Morgan as a Tactician and being a good unit to keep around in general. Sumia is also very powerful later on, with much earlier access than the other two, but marrying her yourself means Chrom can't have her which Lucina doesn't like. Finally, Lissa is very easy to build support with and can get far ahead of the pack in levels with a lot of patience, but her starting class for Morgan is completely useless.

[Leon_Cerberus]

Thanks a ton mate. I'll probably go with Cordelia since she's the only one you listed that I haven't seen the supports for yet. I've got another question if you don't mind answering. Who would be the best choices for marrying Nowi and Panne?

[Ownagepuffs]

You mean VANTAGE for vantage/vengeance, right?

Yeah, that.

Just a question, should my Sumia!Lucina and Chrom!Cynthia be physical or magical?I know they both have a +1 magic and +0 strength but I'm still not sure how to run then. Also, what class should Lucina be?Cynthia will run dark flier or falcon knight.I know dark flier is one of the best for Lucina, but she misses out on a very important weapon-Parallel Falchion. That infinite use is very useful, so I was thinking great knight or paladin, but I still need some advice.Thx

Either one. Seriously, either one works. They have a bazillion classes to rock in because they have solid faires.

Dark Flier, Sage, Paladin, Bow Knight, Sniper, Great Lord (for Lucy), or even General if you are feeling ballsy (their Speed and Skill are nuts).

Wanna know something funny? Lancefaire General Sumia!Lucina is the highest strength Lucina aside from Robin!Lucina.

[Flying Shogi]

Panne x Gaius? If you're not using GF Noire, there's absolutely no reason not to use Gaius!Kjelle, who's fairly close to being another Lon'qu!Severa and has potential to be one of your best units. Gaius has nothing for Yarne either besides mods (which Fred is better in), so at the very least you'd want to switch Gaius and Fred (Gaius!Noire makes a nice Bride, which will give Owain his 75 Spd and a +Mag support to boot).

For Panne x Gaius, I was thinking Yarne inherits Hero from Gaius so he can put his Axefaire to use.

But if we go non-GF Noire and thus Gaius!Kjelle, who will Yarne's father be if I keep Frederick as Noire's father? Also, how did you get 75 speed Ricken!Owain @ Sage? At base speed(43), with LB(+10), Bride pair up bonus(+7), and Rally(+10), Owain is only hitting 70 speed. Even if I ran AS + 2 and gave him a speed tonic, he's still one speed short of 75.

[Alastor15243]

For Panne x Gaius, I was thinking Yarne inherits Hero from Gaius so he can put his Axefaire to use.

You seem to be under the impression that Berserker isn't insanely awesome. Just to clarify, it totally is, and you absolutely do not need any other axe using class for Yarne. You just need, maybe, hit+20.

[Flying Shogi]

I just don't like that low skill cap for Berserkers.

[Alastor15243]

I just don't like that low skill cap for Berserkers.

In the back that just means 5.5 less crit rate (which means like nothing) and 16.5 less hit rate (which can easily be compensated for with hit+20 from stahl or virion) and in exchange the entire couple starts doing insane amounts of damage.

[Czar_Yoshi]

Thanks a ton mate. I'll probably go with Cordelia since she's the only one you listed that I haven't seen the supports for yet. I've got another question if you don't mind answering. Who would be the best choices for marrying Nowi and Panne?

Nowi won't do very well on Lunatic+, but if you want to use her Gregor is her best bet. Panne likes Fred and Stahl.

Wanna know something funny? Lancefaire General Sumia!Lucina is the highest strength Lucina aside from Robin!Lucina.

Olivia!Lucina's GK is tied with her, actually.

For Panne x Gaius, I was thinking Yarne inherits Hero from Gaius so he can put his Axefaire to use.

But if we go non-GF Noire and thus Gaius!Kjelle, who will Yarne's father be if I keep Frederick as Noire's father? Also, how did you get 75 speed Ricken!Owain @ Sage? At base speed(43), with LB(+10), Bride pair up bonus(+7), and Rally(+10), Owain is only hitting 70 speed. Even if I ran AS + 2 and gave him a speed tonic, he's still one speed short of 75.

Sorry, I thought you put Owain at 75 Spd in your previous build- what I meant was that Bride gives the same +Spd boost as Paladin.

Don't like Berserkers? Go Warrior or, in Fred's case, General.

Edited November 24, 2014 by Czar_Yoshi

[Leon_Cerberus]

Thanks again mate

[Ownagepuffs]

Forgot about GK's 48 Str. It is still kind of funny since for the longest time Sumia!Lucina was thought to not have any physical capabilities due to her +0 Str.

[Flying Shogi]

In the back that just means 5.5 less crit rate (which means like nothing) and 16.5 less hit rate (which can easily be compensated for with hit+20 from stahl or virion) and in exchange the entire couple starts doing insane amounts of damage.

I might try this out. I can always run Kellam!Laurent and try it out with Virion!Yarne @ Berserker.

Sorry, I thought you put Owain at 75 Spd in your previous build- what I meant was that Bride gives the same +Spd boost as Paladin.

You're probably thinking of my Lon'qu!Brady that hits 75 Speed with Vaike!Nah @ Hero support.

I'm liking this idea of Bride!Noire as she gets to use Bowfaire.

Edited November 24, 2014 by Magician Lugh

[Sorin]

For a Dark Flier!Cordelia paired with a Spd+ Lck- Dread Fighter!MU, how viable is this setup for endgame and DLC? I'm on Lunatic btw

Cordelia-

LB, GF, Iote's Shield, Lancefaire, Sol

I figure between Sol and Iote's Shield, she shouldn't be in danger too often. Lancefaire is there to make use of her strength mods while as a DF so she can have both forms of attack.

Sorin(MU)-

LB, Tomefaire, Agg, Vantage, Ignis

The only thing I'm not sure of in this set is Vantage. I only put it there to ensure he can survive a bit of tanking in the event he takes too much damage on the enemy phase without messing up his Ignis proc.

A sort of last resort for me is to change Cordelia into a Falconknight, but since I already have a Sumia who is stuck to the hip with Chrom acting as my mobile staff user...

Edited November 25, 2014 by Sorin

[Alastor15243]

For a Dark Flier!Cordelia paired with a Spd+ Lck- Dread Fighter!MU, how viable is this setup for endgame and DLC? I'm on Lunatic btw

Cordelia-

LB, GF, Iote's Shield, Lancefaire, Sol

I figure between Sol and Iote's Shield, she shouldn't be in danger too often. Lancefaire is there to make use of her strength mods while as a DF so she can have both forms of attack.

Sorin(MU)-

LB, Tomefaire, Agg, Vantage, Ignis

The only thing I'm not sure of in this set is Vantage. I only put it there to ensure he can survive a bit of tanking in the event he takes too much damage on the enemy phase without messing up his Ignis proc.

A sort of last resort for me is to change Cordelia into a Falconknight, but since I already have a Sumia who is stuck to the hip with Chrom acting as my mobile staff user...

Sorry to tell you this, but Sol is borderline useless in Apotheosis. You just don't do enough damage to heal enough. Iote's shield also isn't recommended because if nothing can kill you in a single hit, you don't need any more defense. Tanking is ineffective, and the main focus of Apotheosis is on all-out attacking to kill your foes before they can kill you.

[Sorin]

Sorry to tell you this, but Sol is borderline useless in Apotheosis. You just don't do enough damage to heal enough. Iote's shield also isn't recommended because if nothing can kill you in a single hit, you don't need any more defense. Tanking is ineffective, and the main focus of Apotheosis is on all-out attacking to kill your foes before they can kill you.

Okay, fair enough. So for Apotheosis I'd need to change those. Probably Lifetaker and Axebreaker (Or AT. Also seems like a good option) for them on her.

What should replace Vantage on my Avatar?

What about for the other DLC? I remember being told that Apotheosis preparation skillwise is extremely specific.

[Alastor15243]

Okay, fair enough. So for Apotheosis I'd need to change those. Probably Lifetaker and Axebreaker (Or AT. Also seems like a good option) for them on her.

What should replace Vantage on my Avatar?

What about for the other DLC? I remember being told that Apotheosis preparation skillwise is extremely specific.

the other DLC can generally be done with anything that's worked before then, with the possible exception of the "Ultimate Training" pack (Death's embrace, five anna firefight, roster rescue), the maps of which are VERY hard, especially without LB (but I highly recommend doing them, especially "Death's Embrace, probably the best DLC there is). Sol's generally pretty useful, at least until the enemies start getting really high defense and procs become necessary to one-round enemies.