Etrian Odyssey 3 Mafia - Game Over

[Bluedoom]

withs this kinda posting I'm going to keep pushing F5

[Athena_57]

3 minutes ago, Vi-astra said:

you are new you wouldnt understand

First you say not to brush me off as town as I've played mafia games before, now you say this to get away from a legit question?

[SB.]

Clarinets bothers me but I feel weird about the wagon having no real competitor. Either scum bussed early and can't get off or they just haven't made any attempt to start a counterwagon ever? Only Via has really tried to argue against it and I don't think they'd go all in like this as scum regardless of Clarinets' alignment so that's pretty exciting I guess. Meh.

Take it easy Via.

[Prims]

dude I left the thread open while doing some other shit and there were 17 replies in this thread? at this hour? now 2 more? what the hell is going on?

I think Eury is scum on gut but I haven't read her newer posts LOL

[Percivalé]

1 minute ago, athena_57 said:

First you say not to brush me off as town as I've played mafia games before, now you say this to get away from a legit question?

sorry dude i;lll properly respond to you tomorrow i promise. i need to go to bed

[Athena_57]

Okay, fair enough

[Shinori]

1 minute ago, Vi-astra said:

why would i be this dumb about it as scum though

I mean, I know this isn't you, but look at my play last game.  I'd say I defended flailing/caught Eury much harder than what you could be doing.  I never once accused you of defending Clarinets for that matter.  However the fact that you could be defending Clarinets whether they are town OR scum is a fact that could be there and I'm disliking your current actions.

Also no offense: I've gotten high before plenty enough and it can sometimes spark bad decisions.  I don't mean it in a bad way and normally I don't think you let it get to you in that manner but it is also a possibility that could spark bad ideas.

[Shinori]

4 minutes ago, Magnificence Incarnate said:

withs this kinda posting I'm going to keep pushing F5

3 minutes ago, Prims said:

dude I left the thread open while doing some other shit and there were 17 replies in this thread? at this hour? now 2 more? what the hell is going on?

I think Eury is scum on gut but I haven't read her newer posts LOL

Two people who are known for spam posting happened.

Sorry.

[SB.]

@Prims What do you think of Omega now?

Clarinets should claim. Slowly catching up but I need to do some things before I can bigpost.

[Shinori]

Please make sure no one else votes Clarinets at the moment: They are already at 5 votes and I don't wanna risk an early hammer on accident from someone else putting them at like L-2/1 and Clarinets getting to quick hammer themselves.  I'm also about to go to bed so I'll be back tomorrow.

[Prims]

3 minutes ago, Kokichi Oma said:

@Prims What do you think of Omega now?

when I read his post I'm like "yeah that makes sense" so I'm willing to give him time and also see where the Marth/Boron thing goes but I could also still easily see him being scum, not a preferred D1 lynch though over clarinets/eury. on future days it really depends on how much he delivers I think

[Percivalé]

before i go i want to say sorry everyone i kinda flipped my shit there but im ok i hope i didnt sound too jerkish

[Athena_57]

4 minutes ago, Prims said:

when I read his post I'm like "yeah that makes sense" so I'm willing to give him time and also see where the Marth/Boron thing goes but I could also still easily see him being scum, not a preferred D1 lynch though over clarinets/eury. on future days it really depends on how much he delivers I think

So I take it you're still scumreading Eury, did you read their recent posts? Thoughts?

[Athena_57]

1 minute ago, Vi-astra said:

before i go i want to say sorry everyone i kinda flipped my shit there but im ok i hope i didnt sound too jerkish

It's cool, just go to bed

(I want answers tomorrow though :P)

[Shinori]

Prims stated he hasn't read Eury's posts so until he makes a comment about them, assume he hasn't read them.

[Athena_57]

3 minutes ago, Shinori said:

Prims stated he hasn't read Eury's posts

Ah, missed that amongst the spamfest from just now, my bad.

[SB.]

w/e I skimmed

I still kinda think Omega is the scummiest. His explanation for not scumreading Boron in the end is alright but afterwards I don't really buy into the Marth thing. It feels like a big jump to go for that as your main suspect and I kinda don't like it.

Eury is... I dunno. Initially I was dismissing her as scum because she felt far less aggressive than last game in terms of not scumreading the whole playerlist, which I guess was pretty dumb of me? It's a pretty easy change to make and her suspicions don't really jive well with me (especially Bart, why is she scumreading Bart again?) so that could just be because rl is messing with her anyway. I'm probably just being stupid.

##Unvote
##Vote: Eurykins

I want this to be a contest. I'm fine with lynching Clarinets because individually they're a decent play, but it feels too easy right now? I think I need to read more later, but I have super evil work and things to do first. I'll be back!

[Bartozio]

Clarinets recent posts didn't really do anything for me (suprise suprise). Only real reads he showed was Prims being inactive and SB roleplaying, and he later even went back on the SB read. Still failed to talk about anything relevant happening in the thread, like the Boron vs Marth thingy.

 

13 hours ago, athena_57 said:

 

@Bartozio After rereading your Eury case, I like it less. I still want her opinions on stuff, not just questions, but this sentence is weird:

"I'm also somewhat suprised you're keeping your vote on Shinori when you seem to suspect Marth more."

Where did you get that from? I initially agreed with this, but then I reread Eury and I'm not sure why you think they suspect Marth more than Shinori?

She talks a lot more about Marth then Shinori in her post (without anything really good to say about him), and all she says about Shinori is that his vote felt like a sheep, but that he explained it later. Mostly logical deduction, as Eury didn't say who she suspected more.

 

4 hours ago, Eurykins said:

 

@Bartozio I have a few questions regarding the vote post:

1. The concept of Clarinets having played off the pretty bad fake claim was part of the "Not doing anything during ED1/coming out of RVS stage", which showed a lack of scum-hunting and a lack of active productive gameplay. This was just one out of the many lazy/empty posts that occurred during post RVS, and something that was just unnecessary/filler at most.

If this had been your case it would have been fine with me, but it's not what you said.

On 17-3-2018 at 9:37 AM, Eurykins said:

Clarinets feels like that white noise you hear in the background currently- where is the scumhunting efforts? I get that it was still around ED1, but faking an informed claim, adding a vote with it, and then passing it off as a simple joke is a little excessive for RVS shinanegans.

This part really doesn't read to me like your only problem with him was that he didn't do anything. You first said you thought him making that joke was bad, but now you're saying your problem was simply the fact that that joke was his only content. This feels bad to me, because it sounds like you tried to jump on the Clarinet wagon without it being a simple sheep (as Clarinet not doing much is basicly Prims' case), but now that you're called out for it you're jumping back to that being your case after all.

4 hours ago, Eurykins said:

> How does this conflict with the fact that I found Marth's reaction, when he was inclined to entertain any truth/possibility to said claim due to the host's past games? I found his reaction odd because it seemed unnatural to assume that such an information role like that would exist in a Mafia game (especially a small one like this) with little to no reasonable reason outside of the creator's habit for crazy games? Unless I had stated that I BELIEVED or not accepted Clarinet's claim as being truly false for any reason (which would make my notion against Marth hypocritical had I done so), I fail to see where the issue lies.

If your argument was that it was indeed an obvious joke, but Clarinet should have been doing more, then that is indeed not in conflict with calling Marth out for that reaction. As I said before though, it didn't sound like that was what you were doing to me.

10 minutes ago, Eurykins said:

Regarding secondary scum reads (as Clarinets still sits at the top), I'm not altogether sure tbh.

While I found Bartozio's vote on me kinda weird/questionable casing, I am not sure if it's scum/town indicative or not. Could've resulted as a simple misunderstanding of what I had said/posted, or in worst case scenario it was a means of misrepping/mudslinging of sorts- unsure of the interest/intent of what it was meant to do. 

Marth has felt off with his reactions in general- seeming oddly long-winded with some of his justifications and sometimes those in themselves seem pretty far-fetched or stretched. At times his self-justifications of votes/cases seemed forced and almost artificial, which is what's partially bothering me as well.

Weapons... I legit have little memory wrt his actual posts so far this game. He hasn't been a prominent player in my memory thus far, and it sort of bothers me (which is probably why I forgot to ask/send questions his way when I was doing other posts). 

Omega's overall tone/posting style feels remarkably like the last game I participated in, so I have no issues currently as far as my brain can remember atm.

Kokichi (who I failed to realize is SB, wtf) has partially been turning me off in reading his posts because of the RPing style, if I were to be completely honest. Maybe it's being as effective as my wallposts are in deterring people from reading them, but outside of the guarded ED1 claim, I can't really say I retained much read/interest in this slot. 

So my priorities would probably look like Clarinets >>> Marth >> Bartozio??? (In the event that he intended to mudsling, but I'm having trouble feeling the vibe personally.) Everyone else is kinda off my radar priority currently.

Actual reads posted here, which is good. I don't really agree with the case on Marth though, as I feel he only justified his votes/actions when he was pushed for it.

I still don't like how Eury jumped on the Clarinets wagon, nor how she apparently dropped her initial reasoning, and her main defence seems to be pointing out that Prims' reasoning for scumreading Clarinet is still valid.

I'd be fine with lynching either of these two right now tbh. Only read up to page 6 now btw, gonna read the rest now.

[Bluedoom]

Fuck it I'm doing this post by post because I hate getting pinged before every time I type something.

-Clarinets: I can't say the stuff he has been doing is townie but I agree with SB that it feels weird that no counterwagon was offered to him. Another thing is that I don't think his catch post a few pages ago is bad and it doesn't strike me as scum trying to get votes off them? This is more that I have played with Clarinets in at least one other game(there are probably more in the past but I cannot be asked to search through) and also EIMM games and in my experience Clarinets is not a proactive player. I think Shinori saying that Clarinets' play fits the bill of someone rolling scum and getting demotivated is wrong; Do you remember Clarinets' play in the last anon game? He flaked from the game and he was town, I was even partly responsible for his mislynch. So I feel like that isn't a very good argument for scum!Clarinets. I won't cry if Clarinets gets lynched but this feels like one of those times where we lynch the newb lynchbait.

 

-Eury: I agree with Via that Eury is using technicalities to discredit his case, but also Eury's actions don't match up with her vote. Like she has so much to say about me/Boron, Shinori and other people but she emphasizes Clarinets is distracting which looks weird if you look at the context in which she is approaching the Clarinets wagon in her posts. For example, Boron is supposed to be more likely town because she voted me over Clarinets, and Shinori is supposed to be scum for voting Clarinets, but she thinks Clarinets is scummy as well? What is the huge difference b/w Shinori and Weapons' votes? Like there isn't any coherent thought in this post,  I feel like it looks very weird for her to be sticking her vote on Shinori when she could've moved it to other players to push the game forward, it didn't feel like she was pressuring Shinori with her vote. For reference this is the second last post of page 3. Also feel like she was just setting herself to hop on to the Clarinets wagon.

[Grace]

Can’t do votals atm, on my phone. I have a notice to make though:

If hammer is reached (8 votes), you may still talk until I post saying otherwise. Hammer cannot be reversed if it reached.

If the phase ends by time instead of hammer, stop talking at deadline. Day One ends in 11 hours and 40 minutes.

[SB.]

Votals 1.3

Clarinets (4): Weapons, Athena, Prims, Eury
Eury (3): Bartozio, Vi-astra, Kokichi
Bluedoom (2): Sunwoo, Omega
Sunwoo (1): Bluedoom
Not Voting (2): Clarinets, Shinori

With 12 alive, it takes 4 to lynch at deadline, 8 to hammer. There are approximately 11 hours and 30 minutes left in the phase.

[SB.]

The Clarinets wagon only peaked at 5 votes so that's less than I thought, actually. He can hang.

[Athena_57]

Thanks Kokichi!

Worth noting Shinori said this an hour ago:

1 hour ago, Shinori said:

Clarinets is at 6 votes with Eury and Prims votes added to the previous 4.  Following that is Marth and Eury both at 2 votes.

That's L-2 so I'm doing this to avoid an early hammer.  I still am all for a Clarinets lynch.

##Unvote:

Putting Clarinets at a virtual 5 votes atm, though this was before the whole Via vs Eury thingy, so I'm not a 100% certain on where he stands currently.

[Bluedoom]

-Bartozio: Bart's post on page 4 is actually very good. I like the Eury case, should've sheeped it earlier actually.  I'm an idiot for missing that. I don't find his reason for thinking Boron and I are town in-fighting because  I think saying things like Boron and I having reasonable logic for finding each other scummy isn't really handwaving the thing down? I think expecting him to dissect the interaction further would be forced IMO. The thing is if a situation arises where a TvS interaction seems more likely Bart can just change his mind according to the information present, I think the resistance towards this is unwarranted. It is not like he worded it such that he would not entertain a different line of thought in the future at all.

 

-Boron: I haven't see a lot from Boron since I left the thread but I do think that she tried looking into other people after the initial back and forth between her and I.  I agree with Shinori that her view of the Clarinets wagon is hypocritical in light of her vote on my wagon. She can talk about which votes she thought were serious or not but any viewer other than Boron would have a different view? Which votes are serious or not isn't very obvious so I feel that argument is a stretch. Still, there are bigger fish to fry and I want to see more from her.  Also, I almost missed the ascetic claim, but its null IMO.

-Omega:  I think his actions currently have been very scummy. So for the most part his content in this game as solely been related to Boron and I. I think his argument for Boron and I being TvS is bad mostly about the way he pushes it. Like if both of us are having good reasons for pushing each other why is it likely that one of us has to be scum? It could just be that both of us are town and are trying to think critically to gamesolve, or god forbid SvS(let them cannons loose!) where we have good arguments against each other because we know that the other is scum.  The argument here:

I don't get this. If my posts were spent considering the possibility of Boron being town, wouldn't the natural progression be to vote Marth?

As for Marth vs. Boron being TvS, well, I'm speculating that because how the game has flowed thus far. The Weapons wagon I felt was just a wagon for being a wagon and I personally didn't get much out of it. Then, we had the Clarinets push which was fine, and is still developing, but I personally have nothing more to offer there because it was pushed for a lack of content and now Clarinets is producing (I admit I skimmed it and have to read it more in depth, though). Then, Boron came into the thread and picked at Marth, and Marth fired back a vote Boron's way. I found this last interaction the most interesting because I saw a lot of decent reasons on both sides (Marth had a weird entrance, Boron chose to talk about things others were not, etc.) to scumread the other. So, I figured it was the best chance to find scum, because I could see the reasons being presented way likelier to peg scum than anything we've seen elsewhere thus far. I mean, it COULD be town on town violence, but I still think it's the most interesting thing that's happened so far so I'm focusing on it. That, and gut.

I'm actually a bit surprised both you and Bart have called it TvT the way y'all have.

 is not very convincing to be signing it off as TvS. This feels more like an excuse to ignore the rest of the content in the thread and votepark. Also if I've missed anything my apologies but I don't remember Omega giving any reason for me actually being scum based off of my play?

[Bartozio]

Alright, more general post now:

The last two pages don't really do a lot for me with regards to Eury. I don't really think she's trying to defend herself with semantics, because she actually posted other reasons then that. I also don't really see how Clarinet not producing content is supposed to be a distraction though. I mean, the only things he said that could be somewhat counted as a distraction is an obvious joke during rvs (which doesn't really do much, since it's rvs) and a bad case on SB after being pushed for a case. Or are we counting getting lynched as a distraction now?

Somewhat suprised Via managed to not have an opinion on the biggest wagon of the day, will have to reread her.

I'm not a big fan of how Omega is handling his Marth vote. He seems to have decided the Marth vs Boron interaction is SvT, and since Boron doesn't feel scummy, Marth has to be scum? Without any reason as to why the interaction looks scummy wrt to Marth? I also find it weird that if he thinks Marth is more likely scum, he'd put in so little effort to push him over Clarinet. Although I guess he mentioned he finds Clarinet scummy as well... @Omega. Can you maybe clearify your lynch priority a bit?
I do think Omega interacted better with town then Eury or Clarinet though, so I'd prefer their lynch.

@Kokichi Oma and @Magnificence Incarnate: I don't really follow, how were you guys expecting a counterwagon to form? From MPOV, you could argue there were attempts to push Marth, Eury and Boron as wagons, it's just that those attempts never gained much track.

Seconding Clarinet should claim. I won't be around at deadline, but I'll be around for most of the day until then (I think until 3 hours before deadline).