Alastor plays and ranks the whole series! Mission Complete! ...For now.

[Alastor15243]

1 minute ago, Jotari said:

No, because I think the point is that he's well intentioned but misguided, what we got was he was well intentioned, but a complete moron.

Yeah the mood of that scene was that we're supposed to feel Yen'fay died a hero. But all I see is him dying an idiot.

Edited January 4, 2021 by Alastor15243

[Jotari]

8 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

Question for the ages.

 

Also, any thoughts on the DLC? Would anyone be broken up if I didn't do the rest of it?

For plot I'd like to see Future Past at least. I think they do manage to successfully create tense drama in those chapters from what I remember. I'd also like to see the SpotPass Chapters, but if all of them are off the table then I request at least Aversa's for it's interesting gameplay gimmick.

Edited January 4, 2021 by Jotari

[Alastor15243]

2 minutes ago, Jotari said:

For plot I'd like to see Future Past at least. I think they do manage to successfully create tense drama in those chapters from what I remember.

I'll try at least, probably. But I remember those demanding your army be in many places at once to succeed.

[Jotari]

3 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said:

I'll try at least, probably. But I remember those demanding your army be in many places at once to succeed.

I see from the quote that you posted before I edited my previous quote. So I'll throw the edited section in here.

 I'd also like to see the SpotPass Chapters, but if all of them are off the table then I request at least Aversa's for its interesting gameplay gimmick.

[Alastor15243]

2 minutes ago, Jotari said:

I see from the quote that you posted before I edited my previous quote. So I'll throw the edited section in here.

 I'd also like to see the SpotPass Chapters, but if all of them are off the table then I request at least Aversa's for its interesting gameplay gimmick.

I think I can try them if people want them.

[Ottservia]

3 minutes ago, Jotari said:

No, because I think the point is that he's well intentioned but misguided, what we got was he was well intentioned, but a complete moron. It's not that he does something bad or refuses to talk, it's that he continues to do so long after he has any conceivable reason to do so, right up until his death.

 

1 minute ago, Alastor15243 said:

Yeah the mood of that scene was that we're supposed to feel Yen'fay died a hero. But all I see is him dying an idiot.

I like to think of it this way. Let’s say you have a fight between two characters. Whoever wins or loses the fight is kind of arbitrary cause the fact of the matter is the writer can make either character win or lose for whatever reason. It’s their story and their characters they can do whatever they want with them. From an analytical perspective though, you have to think why the writer would make one character win over the other when they are both established to be of equal strength. There’s always a reason at least in regards to big fights. The reason as to why a character lost is usually due to some innate character flaw like hypocrisy, not understanding their master’s teachings, overestimating their ability, etc. which is usually in line with the story’s overall themes and ideas.

what does this have to do with Yen’fey? Simple, The writers could’ve easily written it the other way where he does join you at this point of the game. The fact that they didn’t is something to question. So why didn’t they write it that way? Well the primary difference between the two scenarios is that well Yen’fey lives. Like to put it another way. If Yen’fey did the rational thing he would be alive but he didn’t and look where that got him. Now he’s nothing more than a lifeless corpse. It’s kind of like how I view Celica trusting Jedah. Did she do a stupid? Yes but look where that got her. She lost her soul because she did a stupid. If she had done the rational thing then she wouldn’t be in that situation now would she? And that’s kind of how I like to look at it.

[Jotari]

1 minute ago, Ottservia said:

 

I like to think of it this way. Let’s say you have a fight between two characters. Whoever wins or loses the fight is kind of arbitrary cause the fact of the matter is the writer can make either character win or lose for whatever reason. It’s their story and their characters they can do whatever they want with them. From an analytical perspective though, you have to think why the writer would make one character win over the other when they are both established to be of equal strength. There’s always a reason at least in regards to big fights. The reason as to why a character lost is usually due to some innate character flaw like hypocrisy, not understanding their master’s teachings, overestimating their ability, etc. which is usually in line with the story’s overall themes and ideas.

what does this have to do with Yen’fey? Simple, The writers could’ve easily written it the other way where he does join you at this point of the game. The fact that they didn’t is something to question. So why didn’t they write it that way? Well the primary difference between the two scenarios is that well Yen’fey lives. Like to put it another way. If Yen’fey did the rational thing he would be alive but he didn’t and look where that got him. Now he’s nothing more than a lifeless corpse. It’s kind of like how I view Celica trusting Jedah. Did she do a stupid? Yes but look where that got her. She lost her soul because she did a stupid. If she had done the rational thing then she wouldn’t be in that situation now would she? And that’s kind of how I like to look at it.

They wrote it that way because they wanted a tragic turning point for the story and a volcano battle, but didn't have the time or inclination to make it better.

[Ottservia]

7 minutes ago, Jotari said:

They wrote it that way because they wanted a tragic turning point for the story and a volcano battle, but didn't have the time or inclination to make it better.

Look I’m not saying it’s not underdeveloped because it is. I’m just saying maybe you’re barking up the wrong tree in regards to your criticism

[Jotari]

2 hours ago, Ottservia said:

Look I’m not saying it’s not underdeveloped because it is. I’m just saying maybe you’re barking up the wrong tree in regards to your criticism

Why would that be when my criticism is that it's underdeveloped? Which is the issue with pretty much everything in the Valm arc and the reason why people say it should have been given its own game. Sure the bones of Yen'Fay could have been whipped up into a better plot, but as it is in game, his motivations are backwards and his actions would necessitate him being incapable of rational thinking to perform.

[Ottservia]

2 minutes ago, Jotari said:

Why would that be when my criticism is that it's underdeveloped? Which is the issue with pretty much everything in the Valm arc and the reason why people say it should have been given its own game. Sure the bones of Yen'Fay could have been whipped up into a better plot, but as it is in game, his motivations are backwards and his actions would necessitate him being incapable of rational thinking to perform.

First of all no human on this earth is completely capable of entirely rational thinking so that point is moot. I know this is a bit of a bad faith argument but if characters acted completely rationally all the time that would make the story really fucking boring and stories kind of need conflict to be interesting unless a boring coffee shop AU is what you want. Secondly, you’re criticizing the story for not being believable enough to you. That’s essentially what your criticism boils down to and to that I say that’s not a criticism. Because it is entirely subjective. The believability of anything in fiction is subjective. What’s unbelievable to you isn’t going to be unbelievable to everyone else. We’ve been over this. I will criticize this moment for being underdeveloped that is true because it is. The issue isn’t that I have a hard time believing in Yen’fey’s plan and why he chooses to die. No the issue is that Say’ri and Yen’fey’s relationship isn’t as fleshed out as it needed to be for me to sympathize with their situation on the level the story wants me too. Say’ri only mentions her brother a few times before this moment and through those mentions we barely learn a thing about the guy. All we really know is that he’s almost as strong as walhart and is Say’ri’s brother. 
 

The details of their relationship prior to this, the conflicted feelings Say’ri may or may not have about having to face her brother, and other such things aren’t really elaborated on. And that’s the problem. Whether or not you find Yen’fey’s actions “believable” is a matter of personal preference. Because as it stands, I can just easily counter that argument with “I find it believable” and we can’t argue any further than that. Fact is personally, I can buy into it because my personal suspension of disbelief is hard to break. Regardless the larger point the story is trying to make is that these two siblings were divded and forced to fight due to loyalty through fear and dominance. The tragedy is obvious of having one sibling kill another under the false assumption that the older one is a traitor. The reason the emotions don’t land as well as they should is because of how underdeveloped those two siblings are as characters. It isn’t because of a lack of realism or believability. It’s a lack of development of the characters the story wants us to care about. 

[eclipse]

. . .not this shit again.  Please.  Don't.

[Jotari]

1 minute ago, Ottservia said:

First of all no human on this earth is completely capable of entirely rational thinking so that point is moot. I know this is a bit of a bad faith argument but if characters acted completely rationally all the time that would make the story really fucking boring and stories kind of need conflict to be interesting unless a boring coffee shop AU is what you want.

I can handle characters acting irrationally. Never said I couldn't, so extrapolating that to, well I don't know what you mean by a boring coffee shop AU is also bad fate. My issue isn't that he's actin irrationanlly. It's that he's both acting irrationally without motivation and in such a way that goes completely against his motivations.

1 minute ago, Ottservia said:

Secondly, you’re criticizing the story for not being believable enough to you.

No, I'm saying it's not following it's own rules, which was the only criteria you said stories should be judged by previously. The rules the story itself establishes that Yen'fay wishes to protect Say'ri. Yen'fay's actions in fact do the opposite and put her in more danger even though he has the ability, motivation and encouragement to do the opposite and no motivation but an inexplicable fear of a negative sterotype who has no power in the situation to do the opposite. This is Awakening breaking its own rules.

1 minute ago, Ottservia said:

That’s essentially what your criticism boils down to and to that I say that’s not a criticism. Because it is entirely subjective. The believability of anything in fiction is subjective. What’s unbelievable to you isn’t going to be unbelievable to everyone else. We’ve been over this. I will criticize this moment for being underdeveloped that is true because it is. The issue isn’t that I have a hard time believing in Yen’fey’s plan and why he chooses to die.

Okay so tell me why Yen'fay standing at the base of that volcano where his sister has had no choice put to retreat to chooses to go on the offensive instead of turning on Whalhart? What are the things that are important to him as a character at that moment in time that causes him to make that decision? It's not that he's acting irrationally, it's that he's acting irrationally without reason. This goes back to another rule of writing you're sworn by, that things naturally follow consequences. What is Yen'Fay's actions a consequence of? At this specific moment in time when he should absolutely know that Excellus's threats are no longer possible.

1 minute ago, Ottservia said:

The details of their relationship prior to this, the conflicted feelings Say’ri may or may not have about having to face her brother, and other such things aren’t really elaborated on. And that’s the problem. Whether or not you find Yen’fey’s actions “believable” is a matter of personal preference. Because as it stands, I can just easily counter that argument with “I find it believable” and we can’t argue any further than that. 

Oh no, you can't. If you don't find it believable you have to explain why for your argument to have merit. I've explained why his actions are unbelievable, he has no personal motivation, inclination to take them and has every motivation, inclination and encouragement to do the opposite of what he does/

1 minute ago, Ottservia said:

Fact is personally, I can buy into it because my personal suspension of disbelief is hard to break. Regardless the larger point the story is trying to make is that these two siblings were divded and forced to fight due to loyalty through fear and dominance. The tragedy is obvious of having one sibling kill another under the false assumption that the older one is a traitor. The reason the emotions don’t land as well as they should is because of how underdeveloped those two siblings are as characters. It isn’t because of a lack of realism or believability. It’s a lack of development of the characters the story wants us to care about. 

No, you need a reason for them to fight. If Lissa just randomly started fighting Chrom to the death declaring she's doing it to protect Chrom and Chrom is forced to kill her, that's not going to be a good story beat even though we are familiar with Chrom and Lissa. We need to have a solid reason as to why Lissa is suddenly attacking Chrom which to her in some way equals protecting him. That's what Yen'Fay lacks, a reason. He has it in the backstory before we are introduced to either character, but as soon as Say'ri shows up and progressively from there the reason becomes non existent, which isn't speculation, Excellus himself confirms it. He could not have killed Say'ri whenever he wanted after she joined up with Chrom. But the story has Yen'Fay continuing to act like this reason is valid even though the story itself acknowledges that it no longer is. Awakening is, once again, breaking its own rules.

[Jotari]

Okay, Eclipse has shown up so I'll say no more on the matter least I encourage her wrath (she did post just before me and I tried to edit this into my last post but Serenes error). I'll just leave it at characters don't have to behave rationally all the time in stories, but they still need to have reasons for their actions, unless they are meant to be certifiably insane (and even then they should ideally have reasons too, just ones that aren't comprehensible to most others). Yen'Fay is not meant to be depicted as certifiably insane and has no reason to do what hdet he does given the information he should have at the time, so his actions are pretty poorly written on Awakening's part.

[Ottservia]

5 minutes ago, Jotari said:

What is Yen'Fay's actions a consequence of? At this specific moment in time when he should absolutely know that Excellus's threats are no longer possible.

This goes back to the whole theme of the arc. He made his decision out of fear. He’s loyal out of fear. Instead of trusting his sibling and fighting along side her he sided against her out of fear. The fact that it ends in tragedy was to be expected because he made the wrong decision. He took the wrong path therefore the story punishes him for it. He tried to manipulate Say’ri to hate him as a traitor instead of trusting her with the truth. He’s not fighting for Walhart because he wants to no fights for him because he’s forced to and that is where the story deems him incorrect. Thematically, I think it works.

 

10 minutes ago, Jotari said:

Oh no, you can't. If you don't find it believable you have to explain why for your argument to have merit. I've explained why his actions are unbelievable, he has no personal motivation, inclination to take them and has every motivation, inclination and encouragement to do the opposite of what he does/

You want me to list off reasons why I can buy into his actions, fine.

-he could just be stubborn and honor bound to his word. Cause if he went back on his word then he’d be no better than Excellus.

-he may not have full faith that the shepards can beat Walhart so he wants to test them.

-Or he’s simply resigned to his fate. He’s could just be suicidal like Xander in birthright.

There are a couple reasons for ya. Now these reasons are mostly speculative at best, I’ll admit. I came up with these reasons mostly based on what little we do know of Yen’fey’s personality through his design and limited dialogue. These reasons could have more weight to them if you know his character was better developed but it isn’t. Anyway, that’s all I’ll say on the matter because we were told to stop. 

[Jotari]

2 hours ago, Ottservia said:

This goes back to the whole theme of the arc. He made his decision out of fear. He’s loyal out of fear. Instead of trusting his sibling and fighting along side her he sided against her out of fear. The fact that it ends in tragedy was to be expected because he made the wrong decision. He took the wrong path therefore the story punishes him for it. He tried to manipulate Say’ri to hate him as a traitor instead of trusting her with the truth. He’s not fighting for Walhart because he wants to no fights for him because he’s forced to and that is where the story deems him incorrect. Thematically, I think it works.

 

You want me to list off reasons why I can buy into his actions, fine.

-he could just be stubborn and honor bound to his word. Cause if he went back on his word then he’d be no better than Excellus.

-he may not have full faith that the shepards can beat Walhart so he wants to test them.

-Or he’s simply resigned to his fate. He’s could just be suicidal like Xander in birthright.

There are a couple reasons for ya. Now these reasons are mostly speculative at best, I’ll admit. I came up with these reasons mostly based on what little we do know of Yen’fey’s personality through his design and limited dialogue. These reasons could have more weight to them if you know his character was better developed but it isn’t. Anyway, that’s all I’ll say on the matter because we were told to stop. 

Well I could continue to explain the fault in your arguments while you harp on the same points, but

3 hours ago, Jotari said:

Okay, Eclipse has shown up so I'll say no more on the matter least I encourage her wrath (she did post just before me and I tried to edit this into my last post but Serenes error). I'll just leave it at characters don't have to behave rationally all the time in stories, but they still need to have reasons for their actions, unless they are meant to be certifiably insane (and even then they should ideally have reasons too, just ones that aren't comprehensible to most others). Yen'Fay is not meant to be depicted as certifiably insane and has no reason to do what hdet he does given the information he should have at the time, so his actions are pretty poorly written on Awakening's part.

 

[ping]

7 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

Yeah the mood of that scene was that we're supposed to feel Yen'fay died a hero. But all I see is him dying an idiot.

To be fair, those two things are often the same.

Apologies, I just saw the opportunity to be a smartass and just had to take it.

[Axie]

14 hours ago, Shadow Mir said:

Tomes are almost as bad in Fates, though most of that can be due to the fact that most of the mages you get just suck.

tomes aren't quite tellius horrible in fates but it's a bit of the same problems of tellius - weak units that use it right off the bat, and enemies having much more res than in other games. they even created ninjas with their huge res stats to make life harder for mages as if it was easy to begin with lol. at least the tomes themselves aren't bad, specially the special effect ones.

[Ottservia]

6 hours ago, ping said:

To be fair, those two things are often the same.

Apologies, I just saw the opportunity to be a smartass and just had to take it.

To an extent you ain’t wrong though 

 

7 hours ago, Jotari said:

Well I could continue to explain the fault in your arguments while you harp on the same points, but

I mean that should go without saying.

Edited January 4, 2021 by Ottservia

[Alastor15243]

Awakening Day 16: Chapter 21

Alright, let's start what I hope to be the final week of this game.

...This cutscene seems to depict Lucina drawing her sword again. Isn't this supposed to be a continuation of the scene before where she saved that soldier woman and sliced a Risen in half with her already-drawn sword?

…AND WHY THE FUCK DID CHROM GO TO THAT EPIC BATTLE OF DESTINY WITHOUT BRINGING FALCHION WITH HIM ANYWAY!?

...WAIT, HE DID! HE WAS USING IT IN THE PREMONITION CUTSCENE!

WHAT THE FUCK IS GOING ON HERE!?

...Moving on...

Now, this is scary as fuck, but it's also annoying as hell that they leave it to the drama CDs, which didn't even get localized, to explain how the fuck Lucina survived getting lunged at by Grima while staring at him like a screaming deer in the headlights. For those of you who don't know, apparently Gerome, Cynthia and Noire come in and save her at the last second. Which would've made a badass call-back to when Chrom saved Sumia by swooping in her pegasus if we saw it as a cutscene, though in fairness, ending it here better suits the tone of horror that was the reason Lucina flashed back at all. Still though, exhibit 87x for why we should've gotten to actually play the bad future, as the “children from the brink”.

Lucina says she's not sure if the giant skull outside of Plegia castle is actually Grima or just an effigy. But judging by the fact that it's still there on the world map marker for this place and in the Chapter 9 map after Grima revives, I think we can safely say it's an effigy with the power of hindsight.

Validar pretends to regard Chrom's impatience to get the Gemstone as “concerning” because the Gemstones and the Fire Emblem can be:

“treacherous artifacts. A fact Plegia and the Grimleal sadly know all too well...”

...Which just makes it obvious how much of a farce this is. It's utterly comical that the Grimleal would even pretend to want to give Chrom the Gemstone, because they worship the guy it was used to destroy and regard his death as a tragedy.

Yeah this scene is just... so dumb. The second Lucina speaks up, Validar instantly calls her an “intruder” (referring to her having gone back in time and interfered with time's course) and just starts attacking them. This... uuuuuuugh. This scene just goes from 0 to 100 so quickly with no sense of pacing or tension.

Anyway, the map.

...Yeah, this is the map I've been saving my chest keys for. We have just barely enough door keys and chest keys that we don't need Gaius or Anna to get any treasure. Which is a good thing, because they might die. Because this map...

...Well, you'll see when it happens.

Buckle up, this one's gonna be messy.

I'm bringing a full party just to demonstrate how fucked up this map is.

I don't even have enough good units to make a full party anymore. I'm bringing Cynthia and Frederick, and Cynthia, while great for her level, is absolutely unusable here. As is Frederick, obviously, as anything but an okay pair-up partner.

Now, this game technically warns you about the ambush spawns, but... hoo boy. Yeah, no. “Signal the men in hiding” is not a proper warning for the shit this chapter pulls.

Basically it's an “escape” chapter in feel, but since this game only has “rout” and “defeat boss” as victory conditions, it's not an actual escape chapter even though it really should have been. It's a “defeat boss” chapter, which is good, because this map has reinforcements that are basically all but impossible to kill.

See, in addition to the ones on the stairs indoors that I know are going to show up soon, this chapter has sorcerers show up on staircases... outside the building... all equipped with mire.

The fucking siege tome.

On turn two.

They don't move, but they show up every turn, starting with the outer staircases close to the starting point, steadily consuming the map with their attack range. Needless to say we need to get out of here at lightning speed, because anyone who doesn't see regular combat is going to be obliterated if more than one attacks them and hits.

Case in point: Cynthia is instantly killed during the evac operation by two mires because they show up every turn and I wanted to guard the stairs to protect my staff users while they got everyone out. You know, just in case this map was enough of a piece of shit to summon ambush spawns on turn three right where the bulk of my units would be at that time.

And so far has Frederick fallen from his glory days that he's instantly one-hit killed by the remaining mire user, because they expect you to pass through this corridor in the crossfire of multiple siege tome users.

Thankfully, I managed to get out of the first hallway before the reinforcements had a chance to spawn. Unless of course they spawned right when I blocked the stairs, there was never any realistic time to get out of the way of them, and my entire group of staffbots is about to get slaughtered because the second wave in the next hallway is gonna happen on the very next turn.

Well, thankfully that didn't happen. I managed to get the chests despite the incoming mire users (who are thankfully immobile and stand on the spot they appear) by using rescue staves. And now all the chests are obtained, with the fourth and hardest one secured by Alexandria. So I'm just gonna have Morgan and Lucina galeforce their way to the boss and end the battle this turn so we can get a move on. No sense in treating these maps with any more dignity than they've given me.

And now we get to the scene where Validar uses his villain teleportation that seriously calls into question why the fuck he even lured Chrom there to begin with with such a transparently stupid plan when he could have just teleported there, and then he needlessly orders Alexandria to take the Fire Emblem from Chrom while he's stunned from an attack just to flex on everyone that he can boss Alexandria around with his evil magic...

...and Lucina, who is present in this cutscene, watches and does nothing. Way to go, Lucina.

And of course it would be the Darksphere that the Plegians seized. Was Validar corrupted by the evil of the Darksphere? No! What are you, stupid? It's not like this is a sequel to Mystery of the Emblem or anything!

...Why are we still in Plegia castle while discussing the aftermath of this with relatively calm music playing? Or does the Ylissean palace just happen to have the exact same shade of purple rug in it?

...Nope, we're still in Plegia castle. Why!? Why are we just standing around and having a conversation like this is a calm moment when we're still in enemy territory!?

Ah yes. And then we get to the scene where Lucina decides she has to kill Alexandria in order to save Chrom, because she's just seen the reason why Alexandria killed Chrom in the future. This is one of the few scenes that changes depending on your relationship with Lucina. If you're male and her husband, or female and her mother, the scene gets more emotional and Lucina becomes far more conflicted and ultimately can't bring herself to do it.

But I always thought this scene was... weird when the avatar is Lucina's mother. Lemme see if the phrasing is like I remember.

...Yet again the game is flip-flopping on when Chrom died. Now Lucina says she only has memories of him from when she was little. Which explains the whole “having Falchion” thing, but not the “it is also your turn to die” and the shock that her parents are dead and the fact that she said she started to fight back under the name of Marth as soon as Grima returned, which couldn't have been when she was little.

...And notice, no mention of memories of Alexandria. Her mother.

...Yeah. That's the issue with this scene. Too few changes in the leadup. The focus is still on the fact that Chrom needs to live, and not that Grima has to be stopped. This isn't what she's willing to do to save the world. This is what she's willing to do to save her father. Meaning she's blatantly playing favorites with her parents and the game doesn't even acknowledge it.

Yes, she does eventually talk about what must be done to save the world, but it's almost an afterthought. The main focus, and the exclusive focus of what she talks about before drawing her blade to kill the avatar, is on saving Chrom. And that... makes this scene really fucked up.

Also, I always thought it would be super interesting if Chrom hadn't been the one to show up, but Morgan was. I wrote this short little skit about it that in hindsight was super cringey, but I still think it would've been cool.

But anyway, you get to “choose” whether or not to “accept Lucina's judgment”, and obviously you don't die either way. I'll go with “yes” because that's the game's bigger attempt at drama.

...Yeah needless to say I'm not feeling it like I think I might have once.

On a positive note though, one thing I haven't gotten a chance to talk about is that I like how the avatar has a theme that plays in multiple variations throughout the story, culminating in... well, we'll talk about that when it happens. The use of an accordion is fascinating and inspired as well.

I honestly wish other avatars got their own theme. Granted, I don't think the other avatars deserved their own theme, as they're outrageously terrible whereas Robin at least surpasses the bare minimum of what qualifies as an interesting character for me, but in an alternate reality where Corrin and Byleth are actually cool characters, it would've been really cool to give them themes like this. I imagined one for Corrin that was this trio between a violin, a koto, and a piano, similar in attitude to “Contest of Pride”, but where it would lose either the violin, the koto, or both depending on where you are in the story and who's on your side, which could really make the sad variations interesting. Especially in Revelation when a sad moment happens but all three instruments are still there, a metaphor for all the people Corrin has to support them no matter what might happen.

...Right, let's just move on.

Yeah anyway, if you let Lucina do it, she realizes she can't, and Chrom doesn't have to stop her. Same thing happens if you let her do it when you're her husband. If you have no relation at all, then no matter what you say, Chrom comes in and yells at Lucina to stand down.

And apparently Chrom was watching the whole time, judging by the “Are you done?” he says.

Right, let's keep moving.

 

Day 16 Bonus: Chapter 22

And the sky looks absolutely fucked up, with this freaky misshapen crucifix in the background consumed by a pillar of red light. Fucked up image... which makes it amusing that nobody seems to comment on it.

Aaaanywho, in comes one of the big endgame chapters where we fight a bunch of elite risen, most of them wielding legendary weapons. None of them are anyone we know, though. Mostly because all of the really big-name enemies we've killed are actually still alive waiting to be recruited once we unlock the final chapter. They all have extremely high stats, some of them capped, and it's become increasingly obvious that nobody but Alexandria, Morgan and Lucina has any business fighting anyone. Not that it'll be hard to keep them out of the fray. There are only 13 enemies, counting the boss. This will be over with comical speed.

Begin.

Aversa: Don't worry. I'll take extra care with daddy's special little girl.

Makes me wonder what she says when the avatar is male. Lemme check.

...Apparently the exact same thing except for girl changed to boy. Really? That felt like a line specifically written for her to sarcastically say about the female avatar. You know, “Daddy's little girl”? They didn't make that “Mommy's little boy” with male Morgan, they replaced it with “strapping young lad”. So I figured it would be different here too.

The visual effect here, waves and patterns rushing across the ground, is pretty cool. At first you might think it's a sandstorm, but then you get inside in the next chapter and see it's still there... and it's actually tortured souls.

Also, I don't think we actually stop the Grimleal from offering their souls to Grima. So... what... is Plegia just a nearly-empty wasteland once all the Grimleal die? What happens to Plegia?

An why do they talk like Gangrel's death would drive the people of Plegia into despair when they abandoned him to die in the end because he was a piece of shit? Are they saying they knew for a fact that Chrom would do nothing to help the rebuilding process?

And this is where Alexandria's offense is really starting to suffer without a strong pair-up partner. She's depending on crits to get kills even when using Mjölnir, and she doesn't have ignis yet to help with that.

Oh yeah, by the way, since it was cheap, I forged the Leif's Blade with +5 might and +9 crit, renaming it Fortuna like in my first Lunatic+ run. Forgot to mention that. Figured it made sense since he uses it a ton. Probably should've done it sooner though.

...Yeah this was pretty uneventful. Only issue is that high enemy resistance finally forced me to remember that Alexandria can use swords again and give her Mercurius and Balmung. Ah yes, that's another thing: some of these enemies were really hard to double even with my elite units, so Alexandria needed Balmung to double a few.

Yeah, and when Alexandria fights Aversa, she weirdly brings up Excellus just so we can have some closure to that whole “deal with Plegia” thing, which Alexandria apparently guessed at on her own after like one second-hand conversation with the guy. And also Aversa insinuates that Excellus was a eunuch. Classy, game.

Anyway, we're done, let's move on.

 

Day 16 Bonus Bonus: Chapter 23

...I just realized the Dragon's Table is on the opposite side of the country from where it's supposed to be. It's supposed to be around the Midmire, AKA Chapter 10. To the northwest of what used to be the Macedonia/Dolhr continent. Instead it's to the southeast of it.

Sure, game. Why not? And speaking of...

...the game now has Validar talk about the second part of the titanic horseshit that is the Fire Emblem retcon. Apparently not only is the completed Fire Emblem used for powering up Falchion (something Falchion never actually needed before, may I remind you), but it can also be used to resurrect Grima. Something it obviously would have never been built with the intention of doing.

Fuck this. I hate this. I just want this to be over to I can have some fun playing Fates. Anything would be more fun than this. Probably even Revelation!

...Apparently Validar carries “the blood of the fell dragon” inside him, just like Alexandria does. Is this some sort of Genealogy-style holy blood thing?

...Validar reminding me that the avatar had a life before losing her memory suddenly made me realize that despite being so close to the prince of a nation, Chrom never made any effort to try to gather any information of who Alexandria once was. Never even offered, and Alexandria never even asked. That feels like the sort of thing that would've happened in other amnesia stories.

But now she says “My life did not begin with you. It began the day Chrom found me in that field.” So she clearly doesn't care. Should've been a topic of discussion before now. Like, in Advance Wars: Days of Ruin, another Intelligent Systems game (a great one, by the way), the topic of finding out who Isabella is at least comes up in discussion before it becomes a plot point. And Isabella at least says that she doesn't need to know who she used to be, because she's happy with the life she has.

And now we have ridiculously powerful enemies absolutely everywhere, meaning that yeah, no way in hell I'm bringing anyone but the royal family. Sorry. It's just gonna be a total slaughterfest with all of these enemies and all of these stairs, and I don't even know what I'm trying to prove anymore.

...Validar seems to be no stronger than he was in the premonition, which is kinda laughable and makes it obvious this isn't over.

Oh yeah, so basically, there's a huge barrier across the map, like when Ike fought the Black Knight in Radiant Dawn. On one side there's Chrom, Alexandria and Validar, and on the other side there's the rest of my army (read: Morgan and Lucina) and a huuuuuuge fuckton of enemies, some of them with attack power in the seventies. Thankfully none of them are warriors, so no counter, but still...

...yeah. Okay. This might be scary. Let's get this over with.

Let's tonic up and get started. I've also got a ton of elixirs with Morgan and Lucina because we aren't bringing any healers.

Begin.

...Okay, turn one, so far so good. Morgan and Lucina aren't taking much damage, and they have 2-3 shots to take out the big threats depending on where they want to end their turn and if they need to heal.

...HAHAHAHAHA!

VALIDAR'S SO WEAK THAT CHROM CAN ONE-ROUND HIM!

FUCK IT! LET'S DO IT!

…

…

…

…

…

...That... may not have been wise.

...How far away are the enemies from the barrier again?

...Well, the premonition cutscene repeats, and then the reveal happens that Basilio's still alive, that the Fire Emblem stones are fake, and that Alexandria faked Chrom's death in the cutscene (all of which would have been really satisfying if the plan weren't blatant nonsense; how exactly did Alexandria communicate with Basilio while she was being watched?). And Basilio and Flavia finally become playable.

And the battle continues.

Right where it left off.

...With Chrom still in the front row of the Alexandria-Chrom pair, having just ended his move for the turn.

That's what I was talking about when I said that might not have been wise.

...Thankfully nobody's in range. Really, the ones I'm most scared for are Basilio and Flavia, who just do not have endgame stats. That's the big problem of making higher-difficulty stat inflation this ridiculous. Units you get later stop being as useful as they're supposed to be. But thankfully there are no stairs on the top half of the map, so they should never have to get anywhere near danger.

Nothing really happens after that, Morgan and Lucina just fight through a massive horde of enemies while Alexandria barely has a chance to join the fray. I think Validar might be tricky though. Let's check him out.

...Yeah, he's got dragonskin, rightful god and vengeance. So naturally we don't want to give him too many opportunities to attack us when low on HP. Thankfully his attack isn't strong enough to be nearly lethal even with vengeance, so finishing him off on player-phase after weakening him on enemy phase (so that he attacks before he has a chance to be wounded) should do the trick.

We kill him, sure enough, but it's a rout map so I have to kill the last straggler that didn't make it to Alexandria when she finally made it to the southwest side.

So.

Grima shows up and confirms that those dreams Alexandria has are Bad Future Alexandria's memories.

Meaning that if Lucina did in fact reach teenage years by the time Chrom died like half of the game is insinuating, then... well remember, Chrom's roughly 21 after the timeskip. Meaning that in the bad future, Chrom is something like 36 at the youngest when he dies, and yet in that premonition at the beginning of the game, he looks fucking identical to now.

...Also, Grima claims that he'll cease to exist if Lucina changed the future, but... the existence of multiple timelines kinda makes that blatantly wrong, no?

And apparently Alexandria was supposed to “choose godhood”? Was bad future Alexandria not mind controlled, and was genuinely tempted to become Grima? Then what was that red veiny shit in the POV shot of killing Chrom?

And also, Grima reveals that literally the bad guys' entire plan so far has been pointless, because Grima could have been revived with human sacrifice without the Fire Emblem's help, and he never told Validar.

HOOOOOOOOLY SHIT.

...Well I think that's quite enough bullshit for today.

Stay safe, everyone.

Fuck it, I don't even care enough to name-drop the dead.

Edited January 5, 2021 by Alastor15243

[Samz707]

53 minutes ago, Alastor15243 said:

Awakening Day 16: Chapter 21

Alright, let's start what I hope to be the final week of this game.

...This cutscene seems to depict Lucina drawing her sword again. Isn't this supposed to be a continuation of the scene before where she saved that soldier woman and sliced a Risen in half with her already-drawn sword?

…AND WHY THE FUCK DID CHROM GO TO THAT EPIC BATTLE OF DESTINY WITHOUT BRINGING FALCHION WITH HIM ANYWAY!?

...WAIT, HE DID! HE WAS USING IT IN THE PREMONITION CUTSCENE!

WHAT THE FUCK IS GOING ON HERE!?

Meaning that if Lucina did in fact reach teenage years by the time Chrom died like half of the game is insinuating, then... well remember, Chrom's roughly 21 after the timeskip. Meaning that in the bad future, Chrom is something like 36 at the youngest when he dies, and yet in that premonition at the beginning of the game, he looks fucking identical to now.

...Also, Grima claims that he'll cease to exist if Lucina changed the future, but... the existence of multiple timelines kinda makes that blatantly wrong, no?

And apparently Alexandria was supposed to “choose godhood”? Was bad future Alexandria not mind controlled, and was genuinely tempted to become Grima? Then what was that red veiny shit in the POV shot of killing Chrom?

And also, Grima reveals that literally the bad guys' entire plan so far has been pointless, because Grima could have been revived with human sacrifice without the Fire Emblem's help, and he never told Validar.

Yeah the entire alternative timeline nonesense with Awakening is kinda just screwed up in everyway, I don't think the writers thought about it, at all.

I also like how the premonition/Chrom's "death" literally use the exact same cutscene.

Quite frankly this entire bit of the story is plot-hole after plot-hole to just have Robin be cool with a BS plan yet still have Grima be the final boss.

When did Robin/Bassilo speak? how did they get convincing fakes in seemingly short notice? and why does the entire situation surrounding Falchion make absolutely no sense? 

If Lucina was going to try to stab Robin, why not do so BEFORE THEY GIVE THE BAD GUY THE FIRE EMBLEM, just gut Robin there and then.

And if they're gonna fake the choice, at least do something interesting with it, like a mock-cutscene battle between Robin/Lucina, with the victor depending on who actually has better stats, Chrom could still interrupt before they actually kill each other but then it'd at least be kinda cool and make it distinctive to just accepting it.

It's just one, massive gaping plot hole, bigger than when Eliwood impaled Ninian on his Durundal.

Can't wait for the next battle, aka "If Grima just did a barrel roll, he'd have won."

Honestly, I wish there was a "side with Grima" option, I'd take it, it'd be the only choice in this game that isn't fake. (Closest you get is letting Chrom kill Grima so that he comes back and kills everyone.)

 

 

Edited January 4, 2021 by Samz707

[Interdimensional Observer]

4 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

..And notice, no mention of memories of Alexandria. Her mother.

...Yeah. That's the issue with this scene. Too few changes in the leadup. The focus is still on the fact that Chrom needs to live, and not that Grima has to be stopped. This isn't what she's willing to do to save the world. This is what she's willing to do to save her father. Meaning she's blatantly playing favorites with her parents and the game doesn't even acknowledge it.

I never actually noticed this (nor the "when did Chrom die?" wobbliness), thanks for pointing it out, it'd change everything. Even if Robin isn't wed to Chrom, you'd think the little princess would see her father's closest advisor on more than a few occasions.

 

4 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

Meaning that if Lucina did in fact reach teenage years by the time Chrom died like half of the game is insinuating, then... well remember, Chrom's roughly 21 after the timeskip. Meaning that in the bad future, Chrom is something like 36 at the youngest when he dies, and yet in that premonition at the beginning of the game, he looks fucking identical to now.

Never played a Dynasty/Samurai Warriors have you? Toyotomi Hideyoshi looks exactly the same at 21 at the Battle of Okehzama as he does at the Siege of Odawara at age 43. Liu Bei fighting the Yellow Turbans at age 23 looks the same at the Battle of Yiling at the age of 61. Not to mention those whose glories came later in the Three Kingdoms/Sengoku eras often look young even if they were old during their big moment- Sanada Yukimura was 48 when he died at the Siege of Osaka Castle, not in his early 20s.

Awakening wasn't sure if it could have feet, including an older Chrom (who, provided he looks sufficiently not-Chrom could go by the name "???" to hide his identity and meaning of this vision, and provided Validar is cloaked so his inhuman body isn't seen) for one-time cutscene wasn't worth putting the money into.

 

4 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

Basically it's an “escape” chapter in feel, but since this game only has “rout” and “defeat boss” as victory conditions, it's not an actual escape chapter even though it really should have been. It's a “defeat boss” chapter, which is good, because this map has reinforcements that are basically all but impossible to kill.

See, in addition to the ones on the stairs indoors that I know are going to show up soon, this chapter has sorcerers show up on staircases... outside the building... all equipped with mire.

The fucking siege tome.

On turn two.

 

Still, I like the premise of this map, too soon yes means bad execution, but with some more restraint? Maybe it wouldn't be so bad. 

 

4 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

And this is where Alexandria's offense is really starting to suffer without a strong pair-up partner. She's depending on crits to get kills even when using Mjölnir, and she doesn't have ignis yet to help with that.

Would Celica's Gale be better? It's an accurate Brave tome, though 15 less Crit and 14 less Mt unless you forge it to decrease the gap.

 

4 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

Like, in Advance Wars: Days of Ruin, another Intelligent Systems game (a great one, by the way)

Sorry Lucina, an old man beat you to your punchline!

I've gone back and played a bunch of Days of Ruin in the past couple weeks. I can beat the AI to a pulp no problems (it isn't entirely incompetent, it mostly needs better understanding of strategy, not tactics- it needs to prioritize key properties on a given map more, and build more naval units on a sea-heavy map, not just Landers dumping sporadic land troops I destroy with ease using my captured Factories on those islands and Battleships, also build fewer Recons please, they're practically junk outside of FoW), but it's still fun and light strategy. I loves the game, shame the franchise is dead dead dead.

FYI, the game might have been the first case of egregious localization on Nintendo of America's part regarding games by Intelligent System. The European Dark Conflict script is different, and closer to the Japanese original script, despite Japan not getting the game for many years and even then only as a Club Nintendo promotion. Besides every CO except Lin having a name change, there is less humor overall compared to the North American I'm told. And Penny's whole "Mr. Bear" mind-shattered side effect talk doesn't exist, not that it made much sense in the first place when you realize Penny is actually holding two bears in her artwork, yet only one "Mr. Bear" does she refer to in the NA localization.

[Alastor15243]

5 minutes ago, Interdimensional Observer said:

FYI, the game might have been the first case of egregious localization on Nintendo of America's part regarding games by Intelligent System. The European Dark Conflict script is different, and closer to the Japanese original script, despite Japan not getting the game for many years and even then only as a Club Nintendo promotion. Besides every CO except Lin having a name change, there is less humor overall compared to the North American I'm told. And Penny's whole "Mr. Bear" mind-shattered side effect talk doesn't exist, not that it made much sense in the first place when you realize Penny is actually holding two bears in her artwork, yet only one "Mr. Bear" does she refer to in the NA localization.

I've heard that, and I've been meaning to watch a Dark Conflict let's play. I seem to remember there not being any in English on YouTube for the longest time. But I have to say... the English localization team did a great job with the script. The end result is a game that kept its darker subject matter and tone while simultaneously making it funnier than the games that were all about being wacky and ridiculous.

[Sunwoo]

I remember hating that scene with Lucina a lot. Just ... it really rubbed me the wrong way that Lucina's all too happy to kill the avatar when it was someone else's spouse or parent, but the moment it's her mother or her husband she can't do it. All that spiel about "I must save the world no matter what" and she crumbles -- but only when it's someone close to her.

And that would've been nice if it were presented as an actual flaw of Lucina's, but it's not ever brought up again afterwards. So ...

[Emperor Hardin]

5 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

...I just realized the Dragon's Table is on the opposite side of the country from where it's supposed to be. It's supposed to be around the Midmire, AKA Chapter 10. To the northwest of what used to be the Macedonia/Dolhr continent. Instead it's to the southeast of it.

The Dragon's Table not being the Dragon's Altar would actually make things make more sense

5 hours ago, Alastor15243 said:

Yeah, and when Alexandria fights Aversa, she weirdly brings up Excellus just so we can have some closure to that whole “deal with Plegia” thing, which Alexandria apparently guessed at on her own after like one second-hand conversation with the guy. And also Aversa insinuates that Excellus was a eunuch. Classy, game.

I believe Excellus is called an Okama in the equivalent Japanese scene, but going from trans/homophobic to ableist isn't really a step forward.

That reminds we get different/possibly conflicting info on Excellus elsewhere.

[Alastor15243]

3 minutes ago, Emperor Hardin said:

The Dragon's Table not being the Dragon's Altar would actually make things make more sense

I hear they were called the same thing in Japanese. Is that incorrect?

Also, what's the conflicting Excellus info?

Edited January 5, 2021 by Alastor15243