FE Pairings

[Dr. Tarrasque]

And yeah, maybe you could argue she should talk to the kids, too. However, I suspect they are at least being cautious and appear careful in battle. Geoffrey seems to recklessly endanger himself to give Elincia protection she doesn't even need. I'm sure Geoffrey is more likely to live than they are if he's not "needlessly jeopardizing" his life. But you do need people to fight and she's aware of this. she wants to win but wants minimal casualties. And certainly doesn't want her childhood friend dying needlessly.

@Bold1: Based on what and how would Elincia know this?

@Italics1: Based on Elincia's opinion, who's inexperienced in combat.

@Underlined1: What's this based on? She joins the battle on a pegsaus the chapter after Geoffrey does. If anything, she needs more protection around this time than when she's outside of combat doing nothing.

@Bold2: Again, Elincia's opinion, who's inexperience in combat does not dictate sound judgment.

@Italics2: Yet she only makes this evident when it comes to Geoffrey and again, doesn't talk to the kids who are less experienced and combat would logically be the ones to be more concerned about.

Edited May 19, 2010 by Speedwagon

[Narga_Rocks]

And yeah, maybe you could argue she should talk to the kids, too. However, I suspect they are at least being cautious and appear careful in battle. Geoffrey seems to recklessly endanger himself to give Elincia protection she doesn't even need. I'm sure Geoffrey is more likely to live than they are if he's not "needlessly jeopardizing" his life. But you do need people to fight and she's aware of this. she wants to win but wants minimal casualties. And certainly doesn't want her childhood friend dying needlessly.

@Bold1: Based on what and how would Elincia know this?

@Italics1: Based on Elincia's opinion, who's inexperienced in combat.

@Underlined1: What's this based on? She joins the battle on a pegsaus the chapter after Geoffrey does. If anything, she needs more protection around this time than when she's outside of combat doing nothing.

@Bold2: Again, Elincia's opinion, who's inexperience in combat does not dictate sound judgment.

@Italics2: Yet she only makes this evident when it comes to Geoffrey and again, doesn't talk to the kids who are less experienced and combat would logically be the ones to be more concerned about.

Okay, let's post it again.

Elincia: You fight too hard and take too many risks to protect me in combat.

Geoffrey: Is that not what a knight is sworn to do?

Elincia: But you put yourself at grave risk!

Geoffrey: It is true. I have felt the bite of steel several times while protecting you... But I would do so again without a thought!

Elincia: You promised me long ago that you wouldn't needlessly jeopardize your life for my sake. I guess you don't value your life after all.

Okay, so for bold1, two things:

1: they aren't gaga for her and thus are less likely to needlessly jeopardize their lives for her sake

2: well she didn't talk to them, did she?

for italics 1:

Um, what???? Elincia is the one deciding to tell him not to fight anymore. The reasons she does that would obviously be based on her perceptions of reality. Elincia's opinion is the only thing that matters. so whether he actually is taking too many risks or not isn't relevant. If she believes he is then she will base her decisions on her beliefs. Hence, if she asks him to stop fighting, it is because of that fact.

for underlined:

It's based on what I underlined. "needlessly". Hence, she doesn't even need. Remember, Elincia is the one telling him to stop protecting her so she'll tell him stuff based on her perceptions of reality. As far as Elincia is concerned, Geoffrey is needlessly jeopardizing his life. And since he is doing so while protecting her, that implies that she thinks his risk accomplishes nothing. The only way for that to be true is if she would be fine without him doing so. Otherwise it wouldn't be needless. The conclusion, therefore, is that she doesn't need that protection. In her opinion. Which is all that matters when she tells him to stop doing it.

for bold 2:

Again, Elincia's opinion is all that matters. If Elincia tells him something, what do you think she is basing it on? Nasir's opinion? I'm using Elincia's beliefs to explain why Elincia would do something. Why else would Elincia do certain things?

for italics 2:

she wants everyone fighting as best they can. she doesn't want them to stop. she needs them to fight. What's she going to say to the kids?

Elincia: "Hey, fight better! I don't want you dying on me!"

Kid: "I'm fighting as well as I can"

Elincia: "Oh, good. Keep it up. Let's win this"

Um, no. But with Geoffrey she can say:

Elincia: "Hey, stop being reckless! I don't want you dying."

see the distinction?

[JudgmentLeek]

GatrieXTree

[Narga_Rocks]

GatrieXTree

I do like this one. Of course, he might lose in a fight against Treebeard if he finds out, but oh well.

[Anacybele]

Where's the evidence of this? Geoffrey liking Elincia is not openly discussed among other characters (save the runors comment at the beginning of RD). Perhaps Lucia and/or Renning really dislike the idea, we really don't know. To cite them as reasons for Elincia marrying Geoffrey as non-love reasons is pure speculation. Besides, even I they were to "recommend' Geoffrey, Elincia is clearly able to make her own decisions. The beginning of Part 2 of RD suggests that a relationship between Geoffrey and Elincia might be somewhat scandalous and unpopular with the nobles, but lo and behold she marriages him regardless. I'm not seeing how marrying Geoffrey is somehow a politically better move than marryign the Hero of Tellius.

Uh, the damned paired ending states it? It says that all of Crimea supported their marriage. That's the evidence that there were few to no people who rejected the idea of Geoffrey and Elincia marrying. I doubt Elincia would go against a wish her entire country is making.

[Dr. Tarrasque]

Uh, the damned paired ending states it? It says that all of Crimea supported their marriage. That's the evidence that there were few to no people who rejected the idea of Geoffrey and Elincia marrying. I doubt Elincia would go against a wish her entire country is making.

This does not state that it was supported before Elincia decided. In the game there's mention of rumors of a secret romance between Elincia and Geoffrey but no talk of them marrying or that many people support it.

The only thing this undeniably says is that Elincia decided to marry Geoffrey, did it and "all of Crimea" supported this decision because they believe Geoffrey is a good man.

[-Cynthia-]

They supported it isn't the same as they wanted her to/encouraged her to do it. Support implies that she made a decision and they're like "oh that sounds nice."

Ninja'd

Edited May 19, 2010 by -Cynthia-

[Anacybele]

I didn't say it directly stated it. I said it hints that all those people supported the marriage. And supporting something usually means you want it to happen. And if all those people supported the marriage, they wanted the two to marry.

Edited May 19, 2010 by Eternal Bond

[Narga_Rocks]

They supported it isn't the same as they wanted her to/encouraged her to do it. Support implies that she made a decision and they're like "oh that sounds nice."

Ninja'd

That's certainly one possible explanation. There are different ways to use "support", though.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&rlz=1B3GGGL_enCA294CA294&defl=en&q=define:support&ei=b0nzS6_3OoSKlwfXurn4DA&sa=X&oi=glossary_definition&ct=title&ved=0CBYQkAE

Now, many of these work for your interpretation. However,

back: be behind; approve of; "He plumped for the Labor Party"; "I backed Kennedy in 1960"

defend: argue or speak in defense of; "She supported the motion to strike"

Also, there is no indication of the chronology. That's left open to interpretation as well. Did they support the marriage like you support a politician before he is elected? Granted the decision needs to be made to "run" before support is given, but the statement in the ending doesn't specify that the question was brought up by Elincia or Geoffrey.

Basically, it's open to interpretation. Anyone seeking to prove Elincia loves Geoffrey will obviously choose to interpret it this way:

They got married and nobody objected.

Can you see the other interpretation? Or do you refuse to accept even the possibility?

[Anacybele]

Narga, you said everything I was trying to think of but couldn't. THANK YOU.

Now I really want to end this debate. It's going in circles and obviously neither side is going to give in. Honestly. Narga and I believe in Ike/Elincia, you all don't. End of story. New pairing topic.

I ought to play FE7 and 8 more and see how many other pairings in those games I end up liking. I only chose a few so far in each. xP

[Dr. Tarrasque]

I didn't say it directly stated it. I said it hints that all those people supported the marriage. And supporting something usually means you want it to happen. And if all those people supported the marriage, they wanted the two to marry.

Yes, the people did support the marriage but it is not to the degree that you implied earlier.

You're implying that people openly suggested that Elincia should marry Geoffrey and that her decision was heavily based on that. There is no evidence, only rumors of a secret romance between them which Elincia didn't pay mind to as shown in the base conversation where she wants to take Geoffrey's Brave Lance so he doesn't use it against the people of Crimea.

You 2 are reading into stuff that isn't there.

Edited May 19, 2010 by Speedwagon

[-Cynthia-]

Can you see the other interpretation? Or do you refuse to accept even the possibility?

Your other interpretation (that support means argue in favor of) makes no sense given the context. "Ensured that all of Crimea supported their marriage." First off, I doubt the public is making pleas to the queen about who she should or should not marry. There aren't people with signs outside the palace saying "Marry Geoffrey!"

Second, it's the phrasing, "their marriage" implies that the marriage actually exists. If it would be arguing for Geoffrey taking Elincia's hand in marriage it would be something like "Renning supported the idea of Geoffrey and Elincia being married". For example, people supported Barack Obama running for president, not the presidency of Barack Obama.

Edited May 19, 2010 by -Cynthia-

[PenandPaper71]

There really isn't anything that I've seen that states outright that Elincia was forced into marriage against her will and without some outside evidence to that effect, I'm uncomfortable interpreting it that way.

I won't overrule the possibility that Elincia might have decided to marry someone she didn't love over she someone she did if it was in her country's best interest. A king or queen doesn't necessarily get to choose his or her spouse. I think Marth phrased it best in Shadow Dragon. "I don't see what my wants have to do with anything." If, for example, Elincia truly believed that Ike would be a poor king or that it would throw the country into unrest to marry him (Although considering the fact that he's their great hero, that strikes me as unlikely), then she might have opted not to marry him.

Now, I'm still unconvinced that she doesn't love Geoffrey romantically, but I won't argue the point. You have a right to your opinion and I won't infringe upon that. But I will say that I think it's unfair to tear Geoffrey down simply because you don't like the pairing. Even if you don't read her feeling for him as romantic, she does love him. Perhaps it's platonic love, but it's love nonetheless and to say that she doesn't care about him or that she thinks he's just silly or incapable strikes me as somewhat offensive (The "slave" comment and the implications that she was in Nyna's situation with the marriage in particular got to me).

Edited for a grammar issue.

Edited May 19, 2010 by Spring

[Narga_Rocks]

Your other interpretation (that support means argue in favor of) makes no sense given the context. "Ensured that all of Crimea supported their marriage." First off, I doubt the public is making pleas to the queen about who she should or should not marry. There aren't people with signs outside the palace saying "Marry Geoffrey!"

Second, it's the phrasing, "their marriage" implies that the marriage actually exists. If it would be arguing for Geoffrey taking Elincia's hand in marriage it would be something like "Renning supported the idea of Geoffrey and Elincia being married". For example, people supported Barack Obama running for president, not the presidency of Barack Obama.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/marriage

#3

the legal or religious ceremony that formalizes the decision of two people to live as a married couple, including the accompanying social festivities: to officiate at a marriage.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/netdict/marriage

#2

an act of marrying or the rite by which the married status is effected; especially : the wedding ceremony and attendant festivities or formalities

support the marriage. That doesn't imply the marriage actually exists at all. There are definitions for which it would mean the marriage exists, and there are definitions for which the marriage does not exist. Now, granted, the English language is an interesting thing that way. Maybe the Japanese is more specific? But as it stands, your interpretation works just as well as mine.

Granted a thousand picketers holding "marry Geoffrey" signs is ludicrous. However, that's not the only way to support having that ceremony.

Anyway, you are clearly predisposed to interpret anything and everything in the "Elincia loves Geoffrey" way, so there appears to be little point in continuing this.

[Loki Laufeyson]

SorenxIke is canon. The End.

;)

Srsly though guys, its just a pairing. No need to get your wands all in a knot.

[-Cynthia-]

Anyway, you are clearly predisposed to interpret anything and everything in the "Elincia loves Geoffrey" way, so there appears to be little point in continuing this.

Ah yes, accursed biased Cynthia, not viewing "their marriage was supported by the people of Crimea" as "Elincia was forced into marrying Geoffrey instead of her true love Ike". Clearly I am looking far too into this.

[Dr. Tarrasque]

Ah yes, accursed biased Cynthia, not viewing "their marriage was supported by the people of Crimea" as "Elincia was forced into marrying Geoffrey instead of her true love Ike". Clearly I am looking far too into this.

Agreed. This pairing seems to be Narga's Achilles Heel.

I was thinking of replying that other post but I changed my mind. Way too much interpretation involved.

Anyway, Ishtar x Julius or Ishtar x Reinhardt? I'd prefer if the latter happened. Screw Julius.

[Icon of Sin]

Anyway, Ishtar x Julius or Ishtar x Reinhardt? I'd prefer if the latter happened. Screw Julius.

Gee I wonder why.

This said, the Ishtar x Julius relation was for one highly praised by Hilda considering it would put her family in higher esteem.

As for that other...topic at hand, I don't want to go too much into that yet, but to me there is more evidence with Geoffrey than with Ike as shown by Cynthia and Sirius.

[BEST TRYNDAMERE PLAYER]

How did this thread gain 15 pages in such a short time by just debating who Elincia's canon pairing is? Jesus.

[shadowofchaos]

How did this thread gain 15 pages in such a short time by just debating who Elincia's canon pairing is? Jesus.

IKNORITE?

Anyways, looking at Florina up there...

For FE7, I don't know who I should pair Hector up with...

My initial instinct was Florina... but then again I know someone who has convinced me a little bit to lean for Lyn and Hector pairing, due to the little "Talk" scenes you can see if they have an A Support...

Anyone want to sway me on this?

Ninian x Eliwood is canon... end of story... I'm happy if she's happy... even if it isn't with me... Beside I won't accept her ending as being alone on the other side... If the Fire Dragon was that much of a savage beast, and she didn't find anyone for a thousand years, those dragons over there MUST BE JERKS ._.

[Narga_Rocks]

Ah yes, accursed biased Cynthia, not viewing "their marriage was supported by the people of Crimea" as "Elincia was forced into marrying Geoffrey instead of her true love Ike". Clearly I am looking far too into this.

I'm not asking you to assume she was forced. I'm accusing you of that because apparently marriage can only be used in one way: Marriage can only be interpreted as the existing union rather than the act of their joining.

Edited May 19, 2010 by Narga_Rocks

[PenandPaper71]

Anyway, this seems a good time to list my favorite Tellius pairings, since I recently finished PoR and I've read through the script for RD (And that will be played as soon as I can get my brother to lend me his game). I actually didn't add many pairings to my list with these games, which kind of surprised me. I'm still making up my mind on a few and all are subject to change if, for some reason, playing FE10 alters my opinions.

Anyway, I like Marcia/Kieran, Mist/Boyd, and Oscar/Tanith (kind of). I've also read through a few fics that almost have me convinced of Oscar/Astrid. O_O

For whatever reason, this was not a good game for me as far as pairings go.

@ shadowofchaos- I've always liked Hector/Florina, but I also have a bit of a fondness for Hector/Lyn. Both are fun, in my own opinion. My biggest issue with Hector/Lyn is that I have a difficult time seeing Lyn happy away from the plains, especially considering the fact that her default ending takes her back there and she brings it up in the game that she misses her home. But I have a couple issues with Florina/Hector as well, even if it is my preferred pairings for both characters. In the end, pairings are a matter of personal opinion. Which dynamic did you like best? :)

Speaking of FE7, I've been finding a fair amount of Florina/Will fanart recently. This kind of surprises me, although maybe it shouldn't.

Edit: I fixed something that was oddly phrased.

Edited May 19, 2010 by Spring

[shadowofchaos]

For the Lyn/Hector pairing, it's the same with you...

Seeing her away from the plains is kind of... eh for me...

[JudgmentLeek]

yea but I still like LyreXRanulf the best

[ReformBlade]

I'm still very biased towards Farina and Hector.

I just love that pairing.