Periodic Table of Elements ~Game Thread~ Game Over

[Refa]

I was just trying too mislynch you further on. :p

[SB.]

bbm and prims obviously weren't scum/scum ever since bbm tried to 1v1 him on d2

[Prims]

In the future: seriously, please don't make posts like #558 and #583 which just exist to say "waaah you're shit" unless you're going to actually address the issue; they just fuel the fire. kirsche is right about the circlejerking.

Granted my initial post wasn't much better but it wasn't incendiary.

I think BBM was Town MVP. Grass for best overall player, though. Sorry we dicked you over, but it did end up being the right decision for us in the end.

[Grassbridger]

bbm and prims obviously weren't scum/scum ever since bbm tried to 1v1 him on d2

I wouldn't put it past Prims, or BBM especially when he's on a team with Prims

[Percivalé]

oh sorry i didn't mean that i was just really surprised at the reaction sorry i'll delete it

[Grassbridger]

Sorry we dicked you over, but it did end up being the right decision for us in the end.

Yeah I guess... No hard feelings. I thought it was better play for Mei to leave me alive and idle the kill, but clearly it worked out for her.

I'm also really surprised no one even mentioned the fact that everyone who died to me began their day with a significant interaction with me.

[Prims]

I wouldn't put it past Prims, or BBM especially when he's on a team with Prims

Theatre Mafia lol

imo while it wouldn't be impossible for BBM and I to formulate those interactions the way we committed to our arguments made it obvious we weren't buddies. Also if I was BBM's scumbuddy I would just try to lead town with him instead of bussing since we're both aggressive / active players, don't know if he'd feel the same.

[Percivalé]

.

Edited November 13, 2013 by The Best SK

[Refa]

don't do that :(

[Percivalé]

/

Edited November 13, 2013 by The Best SK

[Baldrick]

Prims what have you done.

You monster.

[Percivalé]

k

Edited November 13, 2013 by The Best SK

[Prims]

._.

You should probably talk to a therapist or close friend or Hetnix about that, not a mafia thread.

[Percivalé]

sorry i'm feeling better onow

Edited November 13, 2013 by The Best SK

[Baldrick]

Levity you should step away from the computer and do something else for a while.

[Balcerzak]

Locking this temporarily, scorri knows where to find me.

[scorri]

~Postgame~

Town

SB

Role stuff: Pretty standard masons with the only difference being after death they could choose if they wanted to avoid the graveyard and continue talking to the alive partner.

Player Analysis (Elie): SB played well, and had good post-game reads after Troll left the game. TBH I think he played better after he died. Good reads overall. People should listen to Mini-Manix more often. Don’t crumb mason so fricken hard. Your very first post gave away your mason-status.

Player Analysis (scorri): SB played decently. Honestly his reads were better after he died, but that happens sometimes. Did a good job talking with Troll and was right to tell Troll to claim as soon as he died. Actually called out both Grass and Refa in his “death post” which most people proceeded to ignore.

Troll

Role stuff: see mason stuff above

Player Analysis (Elie): Ditto on the SB thing, only subtract activity.

Player Analysis (scorri): Troll was pretty inactive but played the “partner of a dead mason” role pretty well. Died N2 due to being confirmed town with both doctors dead. RIP

Eurykins

Role stuff: Doctor! Only thing that this role could stop was the scum kill, but that should’ve been enough.

Player Analysis (Elie): Decent reads, but sadly, that quicklynch. I don’t have much advice for you honestly, since you died so quickly.

Player Analysis (scorri): Decent play. Thought Grass was scummy and was right, and actually thought mei was scum too. Has the misfortune to be scanned by the mafia N1 and was was quicklynched into oblivion. RIP

Manix

Role stuff: Nurse aka backup doctor. Had Eury died before him, his role PM would have changed and he would’ve been essentially the same role as Eury was. Basically meant to give an extra layer in case of unfortunate circumstances like doc being scanned N1.

Player Analysis (Elie): Lol@that BBM thing early on. That wasn’t really solid. The rest of your cases were good in motive, so your town intent was strong. Did not read as scummy even with host bias.

Player Analysis (scorri): Was dead on wrt Grass even if his reasons weren’t perfect. Besides that his game was ok but not perfect. Was pretty clearly town and harping on Grass, so was picked as the first target of the curse. Died too soon, rip.

kirsche

Role stuff: Question Asker! Essentially meant to be a nerfed cop, and that’s basically how it worked out. Did try and ask a few questions that were shot down but basically the questions couldn’t find out the alignment or role of a specific person.

Player Analysis (Elie): Claiming hooked is what did him in, but for some reason, mafia never wanted to kill him. I think you laid low enough with your cases to not look worth shooting at night. Why you idle’d during the final night, I’ll never know. You also could’ve argued your innocence to shmobum better during the final day (or the day prior even), but that’s not your style I know. Also, why on earth did you quickhammer? That’s what made you look scummy in the beginning, and it’s not something that could be let go by anyone.

Player Analysis (scorri): kirsche played pretty well. He stayed off the radar for the most part and just had the unfortunate luck of getting hooked N1. He was pretty obvitown after Refa flipped, a fact which he didn’t mention in 3-man lylo. His questions were solid but he should have explained more why he was clear based on interactions of role, not role alone. One thing I don’t approve of is how hard he pushed BBM D1. There are lines, and you crossed them. If someone has said that they need to leave the game because of emotional stuff, *you stop pushing on their emotions* Emotions are a null tell. Also that quick hammer of Poly. I don’t care how much it seems like someone’s given up, you don’t need to quickhammer them.

BBM

Role stuff: vanilla, whee!

Player Analysis (Elie): Don’t be a crybabyjkjk. That 1v1 on D2, and later again in D3 was pretty easy for you, but you were pretty obvitown all game afaiac.

Player Analysis (scorri): Got a bit emotional D1 but after that had fairly townie play. Reads were eh, but quickly got forced into a 1v1 vs Prims on D3. And then got quick lynched after Refa died and no one stopped to question things.

Polydeuces

Role stuff: vanilla, whee!

Player Analysis (Elie): Read scorri for a summary of my thoughts on you. Also, reread people and quote stuff as you build your cases on them. You got discouraged I think because you were having trouble building cases, but utilizing the ISO feature works well. Quote and respond to arguments against yourself a bit more and you’ll do better at looking town.

Player Analysis (scorri): Don’t self hammer, don’t self hammer, *don’t self hammer ever* You weren’t the scummiest player around and there was still plenty of time left in the day. You could have argued your way out of the lynch without just giving up.

Boron

Role stuff: vanilla, whee!

Player Analysis (Elie):

Player Analysis (scorri): Decent play until she had to sub out due to health stuff. Good read on BBM.

eclipse

Role stuff: vanilla, whee!

Player Analysis (Elie): So fricken town, but removed because well, she was obviously obvitown.

Player Analysis (scorri): Eclipse was great. Even though she only posted twice, that had nothing to do with her and everything to do with short day phases. Her scum reads were dead on by the end and had people paid attention to that, town might have won. Got killed because she was clearly town.

shmobum

Role stuff: vanilla, whee!

Player Analysis (Elie): Your inactivity was pretty sucky IMO. You never explained that you were playing catchup, or that you’d be gone, which was not a kind move to the hosts in general. You also just hopped on wagons using borrowed reasoning from other players, which it didn’t even seem like you read properly/thoroughly. Rereading is your friend, especially in moments like the end of the game when there’s three days worth of time to overlook the entirety of the game. You didn’t compare actions to players’ claims, and you didn’t really look at cases too much. All I can suggest is that you sit down and find some time to dedicate to reading through this, as if it were like an Economics test or something (but with a search function). Your end game vote was pretty bad. The justification behind it was bad because you didn’t give kirsche an opportunity to defend himself. I don’t understand why you were so certain that kirsche was scum on the final day, and i would honestly like it if you could share your thoughts behind that final post of yours.

Player Analysis (scorri): Basically completely inactive til the final day at which point you didn’t even bother trying to figure things out, just went “lol, why should I believe you ##Vote:kirsche” Had you actually bothered to read back and look over things, you would have noticed that kirsche claimed roleblocked twice and that a scum roleblock had flipped. That basically cleared kirsche since there’s no way scum would have roleblocked one of their buddies. Instead you basically threw the game after having put in basically no effort the rest of the game.

Mafia

meibum

Role stuff: vanilla, whee~

Player Analysis (Elie): The activity was a liiiiitle on the slow side, but it got worse and didn’t help her at all. Fortunately, her mild activity helped her not look bad (by comparison), but that’s not a fun way to play. It makes our job as hosts rather lame because we’re spent counting the minutes until we have to prod you to post, then potentially look for a substitute for you, which makes our job even less fun. scorri has a good analysis on your cases which were present, but a little weak. Remember, town doesn’t know what you know, so you have to act like you don’t know what you know.

Player Analysis (scorri): Pretty inactive at the start, and once she started being more inactive it didn’t improve. Started off accusing Boron of being overly hostile. If you think someone is violating a rule (in this case Rule 0) you bring it to the mod. You don’t start yelling at them for yelling at you. That’s called appeal to emotion and is super scummy. After that, play was ok, but nothing great. Made a couple of fairly bad scum slips, the worst of which was knowing exactly how the executioner role worked which, if anyone had bothered to reread, would’ve made her being scum even clearer.

Prims

Role stuff: 1-shot role cop (scanned doc N1), 1-shot safeguard (unused), 1-shot executioner (forces the lynch of a player who is halfway to hammer) If I could go back, I would change the executioner into a Gov shot instead, making it a no lynch instead of a force lynch, but ~oh well~

Player Analysis (Elie): Good calls all game. Called SB out on the mason crumb mere minutes after his debut post, and read Grass to the T. He pulled the only play that mafia could use to win, after Refa bit the dust and that tough 1v1. It was a gutsy move and normally would’ve been a bit more tight, but it did help his team win given the circumstances. Sluggish first day though.

Player Analysis (scorri): Prims played a solid game. The one issue I had with his play was how early he forced himself into a 1v1 with BBM. Since he knew there was a SK about, I personally think he should have waited another day, but I guess in the end mafia won so *shrug*

Refa

Role stuff: Roleblock, fairly standard one. Could block QA as well as doc and SK.

Player Analysis (Elie): Lol that MYLO crumb. You sorta dropped scumslips here and there as the game went on, but your claim on Grass was the worst possible guess you could’ve made.

Player Analysis (scorri): Refa’s play was ok. His cop claim was decent but had the misfortune of claiming an inno on the SK. He crumbed cop a bit too obviously which made him the target for Grass. Took him forever to say scummy, but he eventually did and died for it.

Third Party

Grassbridger

Role stuff: This role was intended to be an interesting twist on a SK. Insomniac for a fake claim that wasn’t just “BPV” since everyone knows that’s super scummy. By making it not just a straight shot it required a little more thought put into the role without having the risk of a doctor saving their target. The only two things that could have blocked this role were the roleblock and the safeguard which were both scum roles. This was because the role is weaker than a normal SK. If I used this in the future, I would probably disallow common mafia terms like scummy and lynch. But overall I’m happy with how this worked out. (Also, it deactivated after his death so there was no need for kirsche to be talking like he did)

Player Analysis (Elie): Probably a better player overall. Played his role darn well. Reread stuff and built decent cases (well, after D1 anyway). Got shafted by the mafia, but that was out of your control. You argued your innocence well enough and lasted longer than prims, which was a job in itself.

Player Analysis (scorri): Although you were off to a rocky start, you recovered extremely well. Pretty solid word choices and good targets for the most part. Targeting eclipse D4 was a bit of a stretch since it probably would’ve been better to target scum, but overall it worked out fine for you. Good job figuring out who the final scum was by actually backreading and figuring some things out. Remember though, in the future, if someone claims cop inno on you and you’re not town with no godfather modifier mentioned, they’re probably lying.

Scum MVP: Prims

Town MVP: No one. You all lose. (eclipse is the closest since she actually figured out the remaining three scum before she died)

Overall MVP: Grass

Overall, this game wasn’t great tbh. Town didn’t deserve the win, but neither did scum really. I think the only reasons scum did as well as they did was because of the lack of rereading and looking at dead people’s ISOs and the speed of the phases. Let me put this into perspective. Days were 72 hours, nights were 24. Not a single day was cut short. Discounting Day 5, the game took a week. Four of those days were nights. Which means the four days? Yeah, they lasted ~72 hours total. You guys are rushing around, not paying attention to what other people have said and not caring about how long the days take. You need to stop, pay attention, and take time to actually develop reads.

Scorri here: Ok, so, done with stuff in game. Moving onto conduct after the game. Boron talked to me about making a post after the game to try and talk with meibum about why she was so offended by what meibum was accusing her of during the game. I read the post beforehand and approved it as being both fair and also respectful. Meibum’s and Shmobum’s response to that was not only rude, but out of line. Boron was honestly trying to help figure out the issues between the two of you, and you not only refused, but continued insulting her. This was not mature or civil and even if it was intended as an attempt to halt such discussion, all it was really doing was being hostile and rude towards Boron. The argument that followed was not much better. Everyone that continued the argument was just feeding the fire and regardless of what side you were on, you were at least partially in the wrong for continuing the argument. Mafia is a game of high emotions and a lot of people here take it very seriously. Arguments like the one that happened here (and yes, after One Shot as well, I’m guilty of things like this too) do nothing but hurt people’s enjoyment of the game. Boron attempted to try and figure things out and you spat in her face.

Elie time: Activity gais, seriously. Mei/Shmo, if you’re going to be away for a whole day at a time, please let the mods know. Take hostilities as if you were in a bubble, and just don’t take anything personally here. We are all friends in this community, and while we scream at eachother from time to time, there’s yelling and there’s insulting. If you’re hurt, just say “I’m emotionally uncomfortable with this, may I please sub out?”, especially if you’re new. Not everyone has self confidence levels that rival that of a military officer, but it’s ok to share how you feel without striking a match against the other party. ADVICE: Reread. Everyone, please. Look back. Just run ISOs. They take 5 minutes generally and you can just skim for details. If you need to, keep a .txt file or fill your RolePM with information like “D1 important stuff: X claimed hooked, Y claimed doctor, Z had a weird case on X”. You don’t have to go into huge detail, but it’s what seperates cases from hunches, and helps you improve immensely.

[Prims]

Good postgame write-up.

That said, I don't agree that my team didn't deserve the win.

[scorri]

And that's your opinion and you're allowed to have it.

[BBM]

@Kirsche- I didn't push about you being an ass after your explanation because there wasn't a point to it, but that doesn't mean I was okay with it. This is a game, not srs bsns. You shouldn't make anyone mad to win. And your conclusion after provoking me when I was already mad was still that I was scum, which was wrong. I honestly have never seen an instance of making someone mad actually help town win, and even if it can, making the game unfun for someone else isn't worth it (IMO).

Also, yes, I had objectively better arguments than Prims in that it's standard and agreed upon play for a JoaT to use their investigation abilities before any other ones, especially a hook. Whether or not I was scummier than Prims without taking his claimed actions into account is debatable, but that's not the point.

This wasn't an undeserved win for mafia. They didn't play that well, and arguably worse than Grass, but they played better than town and killed the greatest threats in good order. Town self-voted D1, lynched me for terrible reasons on D3, and then threw the game at LYLO.

[BBM]

The only undeserved wins I've seen are ICBINSFMM2 and FFM. I think if town had won this game it could have joined this list, because they only got to a LYLO state due to crossfire.

[Prims]

that's a passive aggressive response :(

I'm not trying to like, contest you, I just hate it when people are defeatist and say "maaan my team sucked" and want to make it clear I disagree that's the case! We made some mistakes (me making up that fakeclaim because I thought BBM was SK lol) but we didn't play horrendously badly and we definitely outplayed town. That's enough to deserve a win in my book.

[Prims]

Also, yes, I had objectively better arguments than Prims in that it's standard and agreed upon play for a JoaT to use their investigation abilities before any other ones, especially a hook. Whether or not I was scummier than Prims without taking his claimed actions into account is debatable, but that's not the point.

As town I would've probably used my safeguard N1. But maybe my ego is small enough that I wouldn't expect to die.

e: literally typed "to die" as "today" wtf

Edited November 14, 2013 by Professional PantsWrestler

[scorri]

Just because town played poorly, doesn't mean scum played well. If people had back read, both Refa and mei would have been extremely obvious. Prims was mafia MVP because he played so much better than the other two. And the questionable 1v1 choice kinda sealed the deal for me not thinking that scum deserved win.

*shrug*

[Sunwoo]

I subbed out because I was sick, so no comment there. But those quickhammers on D1 and D3 really hurt town from my PoV. This game was a bad one for town partly because the day phases were so SHORT there was no discussion that could be done.