Reclass Mafia! Postgames are too much effort

[Randa]

Cam: makes some valid points. i don't really even know why im looking into him. nothing strikes as odd.

Bear: see above.

well this describes me perfectly right now.

[Randa]

I 'm probably just talknig to myself but, i'm heading for a bit so ill be back in like an hour.

[Green Poet]

Catching up now. After a skim, Belisarius pings me the most.

lol yeah okay, I didn't realize asking a legitimate question and ignoring the baseless accusations about not posting (aka not being online) would make everyone think I'm mafia 5 hours into the game. I'm not going to respond every time someone says my name just for the sake of getting "called out." I wasn't going to give my opinion until tomorrow when I saw more posts from everyone because this is a 72 hour phase regardless of what happens, but I may as well give it now.

This comes off as extremely defensive. Darros hadn't voted you nor even called you scummy for your post, yet you say that "everyone thinks you're mafia" because of his post?

##Vote: Builder Darros

He's overeager to find a mark so early in a 72 hour phase when most people haven't made many posts. He's also playing off of some other members who are posting for the sake of looking active.

How is being conspicuous scummy? If you have a problem with the content of his posts rather than their frequency, present them, because what you've said here is subjective enough that I can't see the same way just by reading it. Your reasoning for voting looks insubstantial to me, and overly defensive against someone who'd made a comparatively far less threatening observation of your post.

##Unvote

##Vote: Belisarius

More to come shortly.

[Blitz]

@Ace, you shouldn't think of quitting the game just yet, you should try to talk about what you think is going on, anything related to the game is fine. See who you think is fluff posting (basically saying a lot, but not having any real content), agree or disagree with cases presented by the other players and if you like the way someone posts you could try to copy the format (not the content and don't follow the crowd, follow what you think is right). Until the lynch this phase, we won't really know what is actually going on, we can just assume, so, no pressure as of yet.

okay, here are a few thoughts of mine,

Kinumi has been active lurking in ED1 and her(?) only post regarding reads is this one

http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=48810&view=findpost&p=3228378

which was posted after SB asked for reads. Could be trying to be active lurking unless called out or could be that doesn't realize what to post when

I am actually thinking the latter, meaning Kinumi should post thoughts regarding the game every now and then.

Koneko hasn't done anything yet and I especially don't like this post

http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=48810&view=findpost&p=3229496

where he(?) says he doesn't know who to lynch. For now, what we are trying to look for are weird responses and interactions based on others thoughts and votes and Koneko isn't helping, He should really get in here and post some stuff about what he thinks of this game and the day's activities

PKL also feels like someone who doesn't know when to say and what to say and thus would like to recommend that she(?) also comes here and drop some thoughts regarding what she(?) thinks is going on (like whose case seems stupid, whose seems agreeable and who should be pressured (place a vote on that person)

and my own personal thoughts, I like the cases on Darros (by Bear, Cam and Kirsche which are all good, Beli's isn't the best but I think Beli was trying to decipher what Darros may have been doing which was better effort than a lot of other players)

also, I don't get the decisive conclusion he was supposed to have brought out by rereading the Randa wagon and he really hasn't been using his vote either

however, scum SB should be lynched first

[Darros]

Wasn't trying to reach a decisive conclusion. I wanted to read up on more people who may have been less on my radar. I have reads on you and FFM now so I got something from it.

[Green Poet]

His (Lucas') reasoning for abstaining from making posts sounds too blatantly anti-town to be scummy.

This relies entirely on WIFOM. Better to consider Lucas' words directly rather than guess "would Lucas still be saying this if he were town/scum"?

Also, this post by kirsche seems pretty damn obvtown, specifically the bit on self-meta.

Some qualms with Randa's reads list. Apart from his reads on Ace and FFM, it's noncommittal:

Ace: Starts stating suspicion of me and SB on page 7, however never states why he's suspicious of SB, and doesn't follow through with her suspicions until page 10. Strikes me as looking set one of us up of the other flips town. Might be overthinking here. Also never really states why he changes his mind on SB.

FFM: Possible White Knight? Seems to be willing to wave off all of Ace's mistakes as newb plays, even to a higher degree than the rest of us. If Ace flips scum I would feel very confident that FFM is scum.

Asserts that FFM and Ace are possible scumbuddies. Those two cases are solid enough, but the rest. . .

Poly: He seems the same as usual to me. And for bizzare I always think Poly's scum. I don't know why. Sorry dude.

Belisauris: Really seems very aggressive in his few content post. Like really aggressive. That's more null to me, but not sure what others thing.

Not willing to offer a real read on either Poly or Belisarius? "I always think Poly's scum for some reason" means nothing in the context of this game, doesn't tell us what you actually think of Poly now, and avoids accountability for future Poly reads/lack thereof.

Likewise, observing that Belisarius is acting aggressive but not telling us whether or not you think this, or the content of his posts, is scummy, means little. That you ask what others think reinforces my impression that you're simply waiting for others' reads on him to safely present one yourself.

All that being said. ##unvote

##Vote Ace Striker

I'd like to hear why you dropped your suspicions on GP and SB.

But what do you think of SB and myself?

Belisarius > Randa.

[Randa]

This relies entirely on WIFOM. Better to consider Lucas' words directly rather than guess "would Lucas still be saying this if he were town/scum"?

Also, this post by kirsche seems pretty damn obvtown, specifically the bit on self-meta.

Some qualms with Randa's reads list. Apart from his reads on Ace and FFM, it's noncommittal:

Asserts that FFM and Ace are possible scumbuddies. Those two cases are solid enough, but the rest. . .

Not willing to offer a real read on either Poly or Belisarius? "I always think Poly's scum for some reason" means nothing in the context of this game, doesn't tell us what you actually think of Poly now, and avoids accountability for future Poly reads/lack thereof.

Likewise, observing that Belisarius is acting aggressive but not telling us whether or not you think this, or the content of his posts, is scummy, means little. That you ask what others think reinforces my impression that you're simply waiting for others' reads on him to safely present one yourself.

But what do you think of SB and myself?

Belisarius > Randa.

I never really had any opinion on you. And I have stated that I am not suspicious of SB.

And for the record I stated earlier I was suspicious of Poly in the same post as my BS case on SB, get it. Ha I'm so funny. I was/kinda still am suspicious of Poly, and more null on Blitz. I think blitz is still catching up, and if not then why are you voting SB blitz?

[Ace Tactician]

Darros: Tunnel vision? Maybe. i still dont see the case on him. maybe active lurking? maybe.

Ace: A lot of fluff. Gonna go back to the point about her vote on me for a minute. Between the time where she first expressed suspicion, a time at which her vote was doing nothing, and the time she voted me, she made nine post. Thats more than some of the game has made overall. And strangely enough none of really seemed to be scum hunting. before you complain that you have, i would like see a post in that time where you did actually partake in scum hunting.

Now the part that strikes me funny, was that her vote on me came the post directly after FFM, who i have stated seems to be giving her more leeway than i do or that most do.

so FFM/Ace buddying maybe. if one flips scum i definitely think the other will.

I'll get to cam/bear later.

But just to try and get some discussion going blitz what do you think so far. any reads of note, or any comment on mine and darros's wagons.

and to the people who have sort of just park voted since RVS any opinions on who might actually be scum.

I'd lynch FFM if he starts posts suspicious content.

After reading all of this, I realize how complicated this can be.

God, who to choose to lynch. ;;''

@Ace, you shouldn't think of quitting the game just yet, you should try to talk about what you think is going on, anything related to the game is fine. See who you think is fluff posting (basically saying a lot, but not having any real content), agree or disagree with cases presented by the other players and if you like the way someone posts you could try to copy the format (not the content and don't follow the crowd, follow what you think is right). Until the lynch this phase, we won't really know what is actually going on, we can just assume, so, no pressure as of yet.

Okay, back from work so tossing out all my reads.

[Zkirsche]

SB...the thought of him flipping scum crossed my mind at the getgo.

Heh, can I ask what do you make of my points against him? Do you think a member of the mafia is likely to back down from his reads so oddly?

At this point I'm strongly considering quitting. All this game has done is make me cry and get all upset.

Hey now, noone means anything personal by all this, it's just a game and we're meant to have fun. If someone says you're suspicious you shouldn't take it as any personal failing.

"if you drink alcohol you win at life"

Fixed.

Town doing this isn't doing themselves any favors, so I would think so.

So what? Town can make misplays too and write off people they shouldn't. I'm really not seeing any scum intent in going "this guy is new so I'm going to give him a break".

I thought Beli would get the hint, it wasn't really secretive of what I was trying to indicate.

I guess, but going "you should post more" isn't really helpful, because they're likely not posting because they can't get a grip on what to post (see: Koneko by the sounds of it).

But I think anyone could play against their meta to try and screw town.

Yes they could but are they? You're looking at the former and ringing the alarm bells, when you should actually be considering the latter more.

Sure looks like it.

Ok, I disagree but is PKL still scummy then?

Lets see i think i already did what you wanted me to do in post 194. Which unless i read wrong was to give reads which i was already working on. so i assume thats not the post i was "avoiding". i already said i would be out of my house for a while and could not make a meaningful response for a couple of hours, so not really avoiding just timing problems from the looks of it.

Apologies I just assumed since you posted again that you dodged my stuff.

i would've preferred to have held on to that for later, with more backing it, as such i did not want to voluntarily release it. however i only had one logical read, and a very easy one at that, would not have accomplished anything when SB asked, especially considering that the case had already been pointed out.

Ok, this is pretty reasonable and at least you stuck to your guns, even if we had to prod you into doing it. I do think the intent you presented yourself with was misleading but I can see the effort more now.

but i do have to point out that fact the though people state that the case was scummy, there was no benefit for me to post that as scum. if anything its a null.

But there is a perceived benefit as by making that case you believe yourself to be satisfying the people who were asking for it.

i dont know why i put this in here.

If you mean you don't know why I posted that then that's because some of the criticisms in my previous post were outdated thanks to being cut.

SB was not somebody that i was convinced was scum to begin with. a little bit of real life frustration led to me voting him over Poly, and so when none of my suspicions looked to be true i simply was not suspicious.

I feel like there might be a language barrier here, but if you mean your points were well refuted then acceptable. What do you make of my case on SB?

Speaking of which he's avoiding this game which makes me even more confident he's dirty scum as he hates being mafia. People should actually address this, I feel like a broken record.

GP is fine. Just fine. I don't really agree with her Beli case (I think the defensiveness can come from either alignment), and any Randa case at this point is pretty easy to make, but the effort is there at attempting to contribute. Blitz also falls under this category but is a bit worse for going "these guys are lurking!" when that isn't really helpful.

Koneko/Kinumi/Beli/PkL/anyone else struggling to get reads on people, I've just asked Scorri to add links to ISOs to the main post (they're currently on page 4), an ISO being a list of that user's posts in the game. If you find following the game hard, pick a player and just focus on them one at a time, it will definitely make it easier for you to reread specific people. I'd suggest starting with Randa/Darros/SB but if you see something fishy just go with it.

Randa > Darros = SB

Changed my mind on Ace already, partly because it feels like she's trying but isn't as familiar with mafia as some of us. Hopefully ISOs help.

[Ace Tactician]

Heh, can I ask what do you make of my points against him? Do you think a member of the mafia is likely to back down from his reads so oddly?

SB backing down from his read on Randa when it did seem solid seems funny. He sounded sure in his case against Randa so I find the unvote he did and the case he brought up against FFM odd. FFM feels like he's more townie than scum so far. And the fact that he stated his dislike for the Randa wagon that popped up when he first brought up a decent case against Randa/Janus.

@SB: If Randa/Janus isn't your scummiest read anymore, than who are your current scum suspicions?

[SB.]

fuck cam beat me to the wii u joke

Blitz: I was asking because his actions didn't match up with his words; his vote didn't make any sense when he seemed to think I looking better and he had a Poly case to go off of too so it wasn't like he didn't have any other suspects. (Also as another thing, town DO care about how they look like but this is probably not a discussion for here)

kirsche: I'm less sure on Randa now; his recent posts have read more like the dude who got wagoned than scum and I do feel like there's opportunists on his wagon. I'm not sure about people other than FFM because I can see newbies going for it regardless of alignment but I feel like FFM should've known better than he did.

The bad thing about Darros' massive quotewall (or the first apparently) is I can barely tell who he thinks is scum from it and it's mostly just defense. It also sounds like he's going to look further into the Randa wagon without any particular reason /why/ he's looking there and he only seems to bother looking at FFM despite implying that he is going to look into more of them, which I don't like.

I feel like GP's last two posts are worse than Darros though. The Belarius read feels really surface level for me and it doesn't really look like she's going after things with scum intent so much as disagreeable content. Her follow-up post is even worse in that regard, the unexplained kirsche townread just seems kind of arbitrary for me, and the part about PKLucas not being townie seems like she's not actually looking into the intent of the player and just looks at the post.

Her comments about Randa's reads are also kind of shoddy because if you look at his post before that it he had reads on those players and it makes sense that he would update them if they changed when he reread? The last thing she quotes also feels like a blatant attempt to make something that isn't scummy look like it is: why is it bad that Randa hasn't given reads on us? Him inquiring as to why Ace dropped her reads makes sense but the way you present it makes it look like he's scummy for not giving reads on him. I'm also pretty sure that Randa said what his read was on me as well, so there's that too.

##Unvote

##Vote: Green Poet

FFM still needs to show up and respond to my case.

[Koneko]

Koneko hasn't done anything yet and I especially don't like this post

http://serenesforest.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=48810&view=findpost&p=3229496

where he(?) says he doesn't know who to lynch. For now, what we are trying to look for are weird responses and interactions based on others thoughts and votes and Koneko isn't helping, He should really get in here and post some stuff about what he thinks of this game and the day's activities

Going off to what kirsche said, this is the first NOC game I'm playing in so I'm not really sure what else to say to contribute if what's said has already been said really. ;;'' My apologies on the late arrival and lack of posting, but I'll try to contribute after I finish some other things and ACT prep homework.

Koneko/Kinumi/Beli/PkL/anyone else struggling to get reads on people, I've just asked Scorri to add links to ISOs to the main post (they're currently on page 4), an ISO being a list of that user's posts in the game. If you find following the game hard, pick a player and just focus on them one at a time, it will definitely make it easier for you to reread specific people. I'd suggest starting with Randa/Darros/SB but if you see something fishy just go with it.

I'll go check that later on then, thanks for the advice o7

[Green Poet]

GP is fine. Just fine. I don't really agree with her Beli case (I think the defensiveness can come from either alignment), and any Randa case at this point is pretty easy to make, but the effort is there at attempting to contribute.

Randa cases being in abundance/not too valuable is something I can agree with, sure.

I don't believe that town has reason to be as defensive as Belisarius was, though. He'd made the suspicion against him seem much greater and popular than what it was, and shows more concern with not getting lynched than actually lynching scum (his Darros case is subjective enough that I could've used the same words to justify a vote on anyone who'd been fairly active).

I feel like GP's last two posts are worse than Darros though. The Belarius read feels really surface level for me and it doesn't really look like she's going after things with scum intent so much as disagreeable content. Her follow-up post is even worse in that regard, the unexplained kirsche townread just seems kind of arbitrary for me, and the part about PKLucas not being townie seems like she's not actually looking into the intent of the player and just looks at the post.

1. I think it's both disagreeable and scummy. My above explanation to kirsche may help to clarify.

2. Is it? I remember you calling me obvtown in P3M because of my "reaction to the votals" and nothing else, so I'd think that you would consider this gut feeling more valuable to state than not.

3. No one should be clearing someone off of WIFOM interpretation alone.

Elaborating on my kirsche townread -

1. Man, it isn't actually scummy but this attitude has been bugging me for a while: what does this do to contribute to anything? Either you say the meta is wrong or you have done nothing to alleviate the problem. Saying "oh you're biased" doesn't actually tell us if his bias actually came into play.

2. This is all scummy because by keeping his vote to himself he gives himself flexibility to vote the most convenient wagon later on if he so chooses.

3. Isn't this a huge contradiction?

1. I like this approach towards someone when they uses self-meta. It considers the post rather than dismissing it with "you used self-meta; that's bad/scummy play and we shouldn't take it seriously, end of story."

2. I agreed with this and it's the same issue I took with Randa's reads on everyone but FFM and Ace.

3. It is. The "newb=/=town" discussion focused more on how a role PM would influence a player, rather than if they player's posts themselves had scum intent.

While simply agreeing with many of someone's points doesn't necessitate that they're town, I think I would find more leaps of logic and assertions to dissuade more conversation rather than encouraging it (like with 1.) if they were scum. kirsche's post does the opposite.

If you find this read excessive or too superficial, then just feel free to ignore it. I'm giving out my thoughts on the playerlist for those that are concerned, and for if they become relevant in associative reads later on.

The last thing she quotes also feels like a blatant attempt to make something that isn't scummy look like it is: why is it bad that Randa hasn't given reads on us?

It's scummy because the way he words his cases waits for others to make cases instead, playing it safe to avoid his cases being considered by others:

Not willing to offer a real read on either Poly or Belisarius? "I always think Poly's scum for some reason" means nothing in the context of this game, doesn't tell us what you actually think of Poly now, and avoids accountability for future Poly reads/lack thereof.

Likewise, observing that Belisarius is acting aggressive but not telling us whether or not you think this, or the content of his posts, is scummy, means little. That you ask what others think reinforces my impression that you're simply waiting for others' reads on him to safely present one yourself.

At this time, I still think Belisarius' overreaction to Darros' post is the scummiest thing this game has seen so far, so that's where my vote will stay.

[Randa]

Can we have votals before I fall asleep? Please.

[Koneko]

and another note; with 48 missed calls and a giant text, kinumi wanted me to inform you guys that the reason she's not posting is because her internet's having problems and will be back by tomorrow around noon.

[scorri]

ISOs are in the OP, I'll do votals after I eat or something.

[FrostyFireMage]

Darros/Cam: What I meant was that Randa didn't find PK/Ace scummy despite making a statement beforehand that suggested the opposite. Felt contradictory and unnecessary to what he was saying at the time, particularly to his read on Ace. And my read on PK wasn't a free pass - he wasn't even trying to appear pro-town and freely admitted it himself. Scum would be less blatant about that.

It could be WIFOM, but I'll wait until he posts more before continuing my read on him.

SB: Again, it was still early in the game and there was very little to go on.

now for dem READS

btw Randa do you still find me scummy? Your posts kind of imply you don't but your vote is still there.

This post sounds self-conscious, especially since SB was hardly in danger of being lynched and his vote on Randa seemed a little like an OMGUS reaction. The unexplained un-vote on Randa only makes it look worse.

Okay I'm still half playing it while I make this post but still.

@Cam, OMGUS is "you voted me you must be scum" without looking at the post itself. I'm not gonna give someone immunity from suspicion just because they vote me. It also seems kinda weird how your vote was on Darros considering the amount you ripped into Randa.

@Beli: what makes Darros' attempts to find scum any different to the rest of the game doing it? And how does scum benefit from appearing to be active? Your suspicion just looks highly reactionary.


Uh, what? How does me playing a lot of games stop me from being scum? Also kirsche has been playing longer than me but idk about the number of games.


What's off about my interactions with Randa and why have you not addressed them anywhere else?

bear's Darros case is actually pretty good. 8/10 would sheep, hopefully Rein subs in and rages at this.


Having reads D1 is good. Nothing stops you from changing your mind over time, does it?

I don't like how quickly the wagon on Randa has built up tbh, it feels like a lot of people are just jumping on the wagon to look productive without actually looking at Randa's posts now. FFM is the person who looks the worst from doing it imo, I can't really tell /why/ he's voting Randa unless he's blatantly sheeping my case, the only one of his posts he addressed was corrected later but he ignored it which makes me feel like he's not really reading Randa too closely. The only other reads he has are townreads echoed from other people, and filler comments like "kirsche" is being antagoinstic. This was never even brought up by anyone so what was the point of it? Feels like scum padding their post up imo.

##Unvote
##Vote: FFM

kirsche where are you halp ;_;

GP's Beli vote seemed really lazy - not really like her at all, if you'll excuse the meta. Doesn't help that Beli is an easy target right now.

Darros says a lot without actually posting anything of consequence. It feels as if he's merely feigning being active by berating the new players and posting surface-level reads and filler while defending himself.

Koneko, Kinumi and PK are null because inactivity. A vote on them would basically be a prod vote.

Poly seemed to be somewhat guilty of the same thing as Darros - targeting newbies, giving shallow reads, etc (also that self-meta thing was odd) but he subbed out so I'll give his sub a chance to improve his standing.

WOAH the kneejerk reaction from Beli. Like I said, he's an easy target right now (also over-defensiveness isn't really indicative of alignment for a newbie) so I'll see if he can post something constructive.

bearclaw is focusing a lot on Darros and Beli but otherwise there's nothing really scummy about him.

Also how close is Randa to being hammered? Not sure I want this day to get cut short.

[FrostyFireMage]

also forgive the odd position of quotes in my previous post

[Belisarius]

Okay so first RE: Coming across as angry. A couple people have said I'm coming across as aggressive or angry and I don't see where they're getting that from. Aside from my responses to Candel who was purposely being a douche about my name, I didn't intend to have any anger/annoyance come across in my posts. I realize you can't see my adorable face but I am not angry. They're just words on a page and if you decide to interpret a non emotional thing as emotional then there is nothing I can do to affect that.

Second RE: My name. If you can't handle the 10 letters please just abbreviate it to Bel or Beli. The butchering of my name is annoying me more so than anything else has.

@Beli: what makes Darros' attempts to find scum any different to the rest of the game doing it? And how does scum benefit from appearing to be active? Your suspicion just looks highly reactionary.


Having reads D1 is good. Nothing stops you from changing your mind over time, does it?

Not sure to what specifically you are asking but I'll try to answer anyway. Mafia benefits by appearing to contribute (if I said active somewhere I just couldn't think of the word). "Calling out" is exactly that, appearing to contribute in a positive way without actually contributing. My suspicion is somewhat reactionary. I thought some of his posting habits were odd but once he jumped on me after 5 hours of game time I just thought he'd be a decent place to start.

That's jumping to conclusions. Not everyone thinks your mafia, calm down. And I know it was early into the phase, but you should probably read the thread fully before you bother posting, or at least make a note that you haven't read it and are going to continue reading it. Where you posted it looked like you just completely ignored everything or chose to not post. And that's scummy. If you don't think that's scummy please read up on mafia.

I don't think I'm being overeager, having small reads is better than nothing at all. Not saying anything is towns biggest weakness. I've said it before and I'm going to say it again. If you're feeling unsure of people, you should say it. What you did wasn't a townie move and I wanted to call it out.

And sorry about that, I'll correct my spelling in the future.

It's an exaggeration. You weren't the only one to point out I hadn't posted in the first 5 hours so I tried to emphasize that. I did read the thread, there was nothing worth replying to. So yes I did ignore everything. If you think ignoring filler votes and reads I can't agree with 5 hours into the phase is scummy, I can't help you.

Oh I agree if you have a read you think is anywhere decent you can share it to see what others think, but jumping on the callout bandwagon is not one of them.

I appreciate it.

Next off, while reading the thread, it seemed to me like Poly attacked Beli in a personal level (which is why IMO Beli countered with aggression), and I would like to apologize to Beli for it and anyone else who might have been offended by Poly

However, I do agree with Poly that Beli shouldn't try to sit in the sidelines cause if everyone was sitting in the sidelines for content to appear, it never will. However, I do agree that Darros has been posting a lot and trying to look like someone who does a lot without actually doing anything productive (more on Bear's point that Beli's, but Beli was the first to point suspicions on Darros)

Thank you.

I'm not trying to sit on the sidelines, I'm trying to get more information before I make a read I share. I guess it's something like quality over quantity though I'm not specifically going for that. I can't play in the cookie cutter mafiascum way that some of you can, I'm not built like that. I will contribute what I can in the best way I can, and if that gets me lynched in this game or any other game then so be it.

This comes off as extremely defensive. Darros hadn't voted you nor even called you scummy for your post, yet you say that "everyone thinks you're mafia" because of his post?

How is being conspicuous scummy? If you have a problem with the content of his posts rather than their frequency, present them, because what you've said here is subjective enough that I can't see the same way just by reading it. Your reasoning for voting looks insubstantial to me, and overly defensive against someone who'd made a comparatively far less threatening observation of your post.

##Unvote

##Vote: Belisarius

More to come shortly.

Again, it's an exaggeration. I'm not positive what exactly you are referring to with conspicuous, but I'm assuming you're asking the same question I quoted from Smug Brit earlier in this post. If my response to him doesn't answer your question you may clarify and I will answer.

[Randa]

What I meant was that Randa didn't find PK/Ace scummy despite making a statement beforehand that suggested the opposite. Felt contradictory and unnecessary to what he was saying at the time, particularly to his read on Ace. And my read on PK wasn't a free pass - he wasn't even trying to appear pro-town and freely admitted it himself. Scum would be less blatant about that. 1

Can you just show me the post where I suggested the opposite? I really do not wanna go searching for it.

[Randa]

I just wanna shut my brain off for the night but something just about beli's post sits wrong with me.

Okay so first RE: Coming across as angry. A couple people have said I'm coming across as aggressive or angry and I don't see where they're getting that from. Aside from my responses to Candel who was purposely being a douche about my name, I didn't intend to have any anger/annoyance come across in my posts. I realize you can't see my adorable face but I am not angry. They're just words on a page and if you decide to interpret a non emotional thing as emotional then there is nothing I can do to affect that.

Second RE: My name. If you can't handle the 10 letters please just abbreviate it to Bel or Beli. The butchering of my name is annoying me more so than anything else has.

As much as you might wanna deny it you still come off as really aggressive in this portion. And also kinda condescending. Null if anything from this.

Not sure to what specifically you are asking but I'll try to answer anyway. Mafia benefits by appearing to contribute (if I said active somewhere I just couldn't think of the word). "Calling out" is exactly that, appearing to contribute in a positive way without actually contributing. My suspicion is somewhat reactionary. I thought some of his posting habits were odd but once he jumped on me after 5 hours of game time I just thought he'd be a decent place to start.

Your vote wasn't just reactionary. It was flat OMGUS. He brought up a case on you and the only way you respond is to build, if I can be blunt, a relatively poor, case. I'd say this is null on alignment.

It's an exaggeration. You weren't the only one to point out I hadn't posted in the first 5 hours so I tried to emphasize that. I did read the thread, there was nothing worth replying to. So yes I did ignore everything. If you think ignoring filler votes and reads I can't agree with 5 hours into the phase is scummy, I can't help you.

This just strikes me as not wanting the game to develop. It's nice and all to be the smart, cool who is never wrong. But that ain't happening in this game. The only way you can get a good read is to react to bad reads, to have good cases we must first have bad cases. Not wanting to participate in the early stage is one thing and is null IMO. However the bolded part is what strikes me as scummy. If you ignore the poor parts what the hell are we supposed to work with. The only people who can have the leisure to ignore the shitty votes/posts/reads are scum, because they have information to work with.

I'm not trying to sit on the sidelines, I'm trying to get more information before I make a read I share. I guess it's something like quality over quantity though I'm not specifically going for that. I can't play in the cookie cutter mafiascum way that some of you can, I'm not built like that. I will contribute what I can in the best way I can, and if that gets me lynched in this game or any other game then so be it.

Am I just overtired or did you just soft claim scum? (Bolded portion)

Either way this post just seems wrong to me.

##Unvote

[Belisarius]

Am I just overtired or did you just soft claim scum? (Bolded portion)

mafiascum is the popular forum mafia website. I italicized it purposely so people would not get the impression that you did but oh well.

[scorri]

Votals

Randa (4): kirsche, Darros, FFM, ACE
Darros (3): CT075, Belisarius, Bearclaw
Koneko (1): Kinumi
SB (1): Blitz
Kinumi (1): PKLucas
Belisarius (1): GP
Green Poet (1): SB

Not Voting (2): Koneko, Randa

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to hammer. You have 45 hours left in the day. PKLucas and Kinumi have been prodded

Edited July 22, 2014 by scorri

[Randa]

Ugh Scorri, I I voted SB and ace.

[Randa]

Unvoted not I voted.