Jedi Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 I still remember Ice Sages and my Ike vs Mac matches. I managed to meteor his Mac too :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 Yay, way to kick some butt, Ike. ^^ That was pretty lolzy too. XD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florete Posted November 11, 2014 Share Posted November 11, 2014 Yeah, Little Mac is way too easy to gimp. I killed one in 7.5 seconds in a For Glory match once with ROB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jave Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 The best way to kill a Little Mac is to use Mario or Doc and use the Cape on him while he's trying to recover with Side+B. Sooooooooo satisfying when you pull it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Raven Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 lol my favorite way is an Ike eruption or tempest. I also poke the f out of him with dtilt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 i need to start using dtilt more then Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anacybele Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 Oh yes, I often combo Ike's d-tilt with his jab now. Works great. ^^ I love wrecking shit with Close Combat too. Oh so fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 The best way to kill a Little Mac is to use Mario or Doc and use the Cape on him while he's trying to recover with Side+B. Sooooooooo satisfying when you pull it. I used to do this to Fox's in the older games before you know. His side b didn't make him prone haha. lol my favorite way is an Ike eruption or tempest. I also poke the f out of him with dtilt. I still remember you tempesting me when I was Zelda, I ko'ed you with Farores and you blew me away with tempest at the exact moment. If I recall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elieson Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 Finally managed a Utilt spike with Samus last night in 4Glorie, and I pulled it twice. Holy satisfaction batman! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 Finally managed a Utilt spike with Samus last night in 4Glorie, and I pulled it twice. Holy satisfaction batman! Horace managed to hit me with Falcons similar utilt the other day. I was a little thrown off haha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Raven Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 (edited) I still remember you tempesting me when I was Zelda, I ko'ed you with Farores and you blew me away with tempest at the exact moment. If I recall Nope I still lived I just timed it perfectly and made you helpless. Edited November 12, 2014 by Lord Raven Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Florete Posted November 12, 2014 Share Posted November 12, 2014 So we know about Ike. But why Samus? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knife Posted November 13, 2014 Author Share Posted November 13, 2014 (edited) Well, first page people disagree thinking that she's mid tier, but I still disagree. I can't think of any character that's worse than Samus other than Ike. MegaMan, Luigi, and Jigglypuff are pretty close to bottom tier, I think Ganon is too (he may be lower-mid though with most of his attacks dealing 15%+ damage). Tiers are relative though. Just because Samus could handle a top tier character a lot better than she could in Brawl doesn't really change her placement when compared to other characters. Many other characters in this game could brag about the same thing. She's also outclassed by a lot projectile users, which is what she used to be known for. Link, Wii Fit Trainer, Lucario, DHD, Mii Gunner all do the job better than her. Lucario and Wii Fit trainer can charge in the air, something Samus wishes could do with her neutral B. When Mewtwo comes out... sorry Samus. Edited November 13, 2014 by Knife Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knight Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Well, first people page disagree thinking that she's mid tier, but I still disagree. I can't think of any character that's worse than Samus other than Ike. MegaMan, Luigi, and Jigglypuff are pretty close to bottom tier, I think Ganon is too (he may be lower-mid though with most of his attacks dealing 15%+ damage). Tiers are relative though. Just because Samus could handle a top tier character a lot better than she could in Brawl doesn't really change her placement when compared to other characters. Many other characters in this game could brag about the same thing. She's also outclassed by a lot projectile users, which is what she used to be known for. Link, Wii Fit Trainer, Lucario, DHD, Mii Gunner all do the job better than her. Lucario and Wii Fit trainer can charge in the air, something Samus wishes could do with her neutral B. When Mewtwo comes out... sorry Samus. Charge Beam has much more KO potential than most anyone else's projectiles though and I don't usually have a problem getting it to full charge even without using it on the air. Samus' aerial combat is also much better with her much stronger screw attack and aerials, which is something the other projectile-focused fighters don't have as good as her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 I'd say Olimar is cemented at bottom personally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knife Posted November 13, 2014 Author Share Posted November 13, 2014 (edited) Charge Beam has much more KO potential than most anyone else's projectiles though and I don't usually have a problem getting it to full charge even without using it on the air. Samus' aerial combat is also much better with her much stronger screw attack and aerials, which is something the other projectile-focused fighters don't have as good as her. Screw attack is still risky cause of lag if it whiffs. Nair got nerfed and dair is harder to sweet spot meteor, what do you mean stronger aerials? I don't think any of them still kill (maybe u-air but that's high high percents). Okay, so it's stronger than Wii Fit Trainer's, but Aura Lucario is still stronger and faster. It's not really that had to get to Aura percents in this game either. I'd say Olimar is cemented at bottom personally. Despite losing his Pikmin every 3 attacks or having to call them, he's still kinda good. His tether grab is pretty fast, he has more options without Pikmin, and his recovery is a lot better (though its not the best). He pulls Pikmin in a set order which can be helpful to someone who really knows how to use Olimar. His Pikmin hitboxes did get smaller, which is most of why he's nerfed, in addition to the less Pikmin thing. He's also still a good pick against projectile users since he's so damn small and his Pikmin often absorb the hit, letting him counterattack if he's an aggressive Olimar. Edited November 13, 2014 by Knife Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jedi Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 His Pikmin attacks outside of grabs however to my knowledge all count as projectile attacks now. Massive massive disadvantage Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knife Posted November 13, 2014 Author Share Posted November 13, 2014 Really? Never bothered reflecting them to check. And I don't play any reflector characters except Fox. Would that mean Villager can pocket a Pikmin? Damn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ema Skye Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Yeah, Olimar's smashes can get reflected. Rosalina also pulls them in with grav pull. Haven't tested Pocket vs. Olimar smashes yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiseki Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 Well, first page people disagree thinking that she's mid tier, but I still disagree. I can't think of any character that's worse than Samus other than Ike. MegaMan, Luigi, and Jigglypuff are pretty close to bottom tier, I think Ganon is too (he may be lower-mid though with most of his attacks dealing 15%+ damage). Tiers are relative though. Just because Samus could handle a top tier character a lot better than she could in Brawl doesn't really change her placement when compared to other characters. Many other characters in this game could brag about the same thing. She's also outclassed by a lot projectile users, which is what she used to be known for. Link, Wii Fit Trainer, Lucario, DHD, Mii Gunner all do the job better than her. Lucario and Wii Fit trainer can charge in the air, something Samus wishes could do with her neutral B. When Mewtwo comes out... sorry Samus. You're making it sound like the thread's title is your opinion alone. As a Ganon main, I think his amazing punishment game is enough to cement him a high position on the tier list. Judging from what you've said, you seem to ignore Samus's Fair, Bair, and Zair, all of which are very useful in their own right. The only flaw I see with Samus is lack of a reliable finisher with not-so-limited range and a predictable approach.Just saying, you don't really speak for everyone, especially those who make what you consider low-tier into god-tier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knife Posted November 13, 2014 Author Share Posted November 13, 2014 Oh yeah Bair kills. But Fair does now? I don't think its killed me yet. Everyone can punish like Ganon, that's not special. I mean his punishes hurt more, but he can't reliably punish without good reads, kinda like Ike. Zair got worse from what I've seen though, less hitstun and can be punished. I never really claimed the second paragraph, but ok. It is my opinion, only tournament results will actually mean something in the actual tier list. I got surprised on how well a Charizard beat a pro Sheik. Flareblitz superarmor through needles or projectiles in general fucks shit up. Before that he was low to mid tier in my mind. Posts link 2nd time here: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samias Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 (edited) Screw attack is still risky cause of lag if it whiffs. Nair got nerfed and dair is harder to sweet spot meteor, what do you mean stronger aerials? I don't think any of them still kill (maybe u-air but that's high high percents). Okay, so it's stronger than Wii Fit Trainer's, but Aura Lucario is still stronger and faster. It's not really that had to get to Aura percents in this game either. I agree that Screw Attack is risky and rarely worth it (though you can use it out of shield), but I disagree that nair was straight-up nerfed. It still comes out fast and actually covers behind Samus, not by a huge amount but calling it horrible is a bit of an exaggeration. I'd just argue it's changed and has slightly different application. Also, while her dair is harder to land, it's still a strong gimp move to secure early KOs. The charge beam is an excellent finisher when charged on the ground and used to pick off launched foes off-stage or to punish a bad read. She also still has crazy recovery with her tether and wall jump, making her vertical recovery on stages with walls something to not underestimate and somewhat difficult to gimp as Samus is not too bad at covering the space above her. Hardcore Samus mains will say that Samus isn't as good as Melee (because Samus has crazy movement options in Melee and now she can't cancel the animation on her missiles in Sm4sh), and she also plays differently from Brawl as well. She can only have one super missile out too. But most of her ground game is faster (especially that great ftilt and fsmash), grabs are faster and her kill options are more spread out. A fully charged Charge Shot outprioritizes pretty much every other projectile now. She can still have three missiles out at once to pressure someone into making a mistake and eating a charge beam, and regular missiles can't really be punished by a reflect because they lose momentum so fast. Her fair also chains hits on connect and has KO potential making it a decent approach tool. Utilt is still pretty good too. From a Samus main: http://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/2l2xh4/samus_can_do_more_than_spam_projectiles_heres_my/clr3v7w And the video from said poster of Samus's mixups: Of course, these are just from For Glory and we won't really know of Samus's worth until 1. the Wii U version and patch 1.0.4 is out and 2. there are a whole bunch more tournaments, though Samus isn't really a popular main among the top North American Smashers and REALLY unpopular as a main in Japan so for all we know she's got a whole bunch of untapped potential. Unfortunately her whole spacing game is very demanding and read-heavy which is her biggest downfall but I don't think she's garbage either. Except her jab. Her jab is so bad, I hope 1.0.4 does something about how it never chains into jab 2, either by sucking horribly at low %s with no hitstun or too much knockback at high %s. Her defensive air game is also not particularly strong. I guess Ike and Ganondorf both have the same issue as read heavy characters but I honestly think their potential is still existent. Even if the consensus is that these characters are bottom tier, currently it doesn't seem like the death sentence being bottom tier was in Brawl. Time will tell as competitive players transition to the Wii U where inputs will be more precise and without latency. Edited November 13, 2014 by Samias Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carmine Sword Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 (edited) Ok, I'm really starting to like Samus now. Missiles are so nice for blocking opposing projectiles and keeping your opponents at a distance, and her tilts are really good. EDIT: Whoops, I posted this comment in the wrong forum. Embarrassing. Edited November 13, 2014 by Carmine Sword Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DreadFighter Posted November 13, 2014 Share Posted November 13, 2014 If you read the opponent correctly then Ike can even compete with Rosalina. It is extremely difficult but tiers are closer this time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vajra Posted November 16, 2014 Share Posted November 16, 2014 Now that I think of it, I'm actually surprised Ike's Down Taunt wasn't able to do this. I guess it remains a trait exclusive to Luigi. ^-^ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8kXnF0t8Sk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.