Good units you avoid using

[dondon151]

neimi can chip at a wall while amelia does nothing so neimi wins the battle of the losers

[Carmine Sword]

Excellent. Can we return to discussing good units instead of bad ones now?

[Draco]

Why does it matter which one is better between Amelia and Neimi, they're both terrible.

Agreed.

Amelia was one of my worst units. I dunno why I made her a paladin since I had Franz. Should've made her a general.

...And I just straight up never used Neimi.

[Zerosabers]

Is Artur considered good? I've always benched him for Lute.

recruiting Amelia means you don't have to deploy Colm to steal her Speedwing.

After recruitment she does nothing. Neimi can at least contribute chip damage without fear of getting killed.

[Draco]

Artur is pretty solid but Lute is, of course, better.

[Tragonight]

Is Artur considered good? I've always benched him for Lute.

Lute is indeed better, but Bishops have Slayer so Artur will be very useful after he promotes.

Amelia was one of my worst units. I dunno why I made her a paladin since I had Franz. Should've made her a general.

There's also the fact that you have four other possible Paladins, if I'm not forgetting any.

[Draco]

Excellent. Can we return to discussing good units instead of bad ones now?

Oops, missed this.

Yeah, Artur is pretty solid imo. With the anbundance of monsters in this game, Slayer is pretty helpful.

[Zerosabers]

I never used FE7 Marcus. I heard prepromotes all suck and benched him.

Same with Pent, I'd trained up Lucius and thought he'd just suck up exp.

I will die for my sins.

[Tamanoir]

I never used FE7 Marcus. I heard prepromotes all suck and benched him.

Same with Pent, I'd trained up Lucius and thought he'd just suck up exp.

I will die for my sins.

Depending on when it was, I'm sure you can be forgiven.

I actually used the prepromote in my first playthrough.

Then everyone sad they were awfull, Jagens were the worse and Arena Abusing was the best way to play, so I believed them.

And now I can't get out of those old habits...

You made me become a monster.

[Zerosabers]

It was when I first started playing Fire Emblem, like 2 years ago.

It was all thanks to my friend who wasn't very good and arena abused endlessly.

Now we're both much better, except he still Arena Grinds in every game.

[Carmine Sword]

Artur is better than Lute because he joins at a higher level and his higher speed base along with the fact that he doesn't lose attack speed from Lightning (unlike Lute who loses attack speed from every tome before promotion) lets him start doubling earlier than Lute. Being able to provide meaningful contribution in Chapter 4 also causes the level gap between him and Lute to widen even further.

[Mark the Tactician]

The only units I don't use at all are Pre-Promotes (because their stats are typically not as good as those that are fully trained before promotion, I only use them to get support convos.) and manaketes (because their weapon is usually something that is in VERY short supply and can't be repaired by any means, which kills any reason for me to use them until near the end).

[Elieson]

but fe13 mamkutes/.....

[Mark the Tactician]

but fe13 mamkutes/.....

They're the exception.

[Sasori]

I'm usually not very picky, but I refused to use Shinnon in Radiant Dawn because I thought he was a horrible character. Pieri would likely be the second person that I would refuse to use.

I haven't used every character, but thats usually because my team is already full.

[FrostyFireMage]

Artur is superior to Lute in every area that matters

[Tamanoir]

Artur is superior to Lute in every area that matters

I'm not sure it's as clear cut.

Lute can become a Sage and have amazing raw power over most ennemy units (Bishop!Arthur still have the advantage against monster), or be a Mage Knight and have higher move.

They're both excellent units, and you don't have to chose one over the other. Your team will benfits greatly with both.

[Anouleth]

I'm not sure it's as clear cut.

Lute can become a Sage and have amazing raw power over most ennemy units (Bishop!Arthur still have the advantage against monster), or be a Mage Knight and have higher move.

They're both excellent units, and you don't have to chose one over the other. Your team will benfits greatly with both.

Sage!Lute is generally bad, Light magic is quite weak in FE8. Mage Knight is always preferred for the extra movement.

[Nobody]

Sage!Lute is generally bad, Light magic is quite weak in FE8. Mage Knight is always preferred for the extra movement.

Sage Lute is better than Mage Knight Lute if you're on a draft and didn't get Artur or Saleh (and I honestly don't see someone picking both Lute and Artur or Saleh).

But yeah, I agree with everyone saying Artur > Lute

Edited August 28, 2015 by Nobody

[Anouleth]

Sage Lute is better than Mage Knight Lute if you're on a draft and didn't get Artur or Saleh (and I honestly don't see someone picking both Lute and Artur or Saleh).

The only advantage I can see of Sage is that you can eventually build enough rank to use Purge. But is that really worth giving up 1 move, canto, better Magic, better CON, and the ability to contribute to rescue-drops?

[Nobody]

The only advantage I can see of Sage is that you can eventually build enough rank to use Purge. But is that really worth giving up 1 move, canto, better Magic, better CON, and the ability to contribute to rescue-drops?

yeah, because of warp. The sage magic cap is higher than mage knight's and that's the difference between 2 and 1 turning at least one map, while mage knight doesn't really help you save any turn anywhere else. Sage Lute is also way better in the desert chapter.

Edited August 28, 2015 by Nobody

[Anouleth]

yeah, because of warp. The sage magic cap is higher than mage knight's and that's the difference between 2 and 1 turning at least one map, while mage knight doesn't really help you save any turn anywhere else. Sage Lute is also way better in the desert chapter.

Lute doesn't realistically hit her magic cap in a draft. In order for her to have the staff rank to use Warp in relevant chapters (all of them after C15), she needs to promote at level 10, but whether she promotes to Sage or Mage Knight, she has 25 magic either way at level 10/20. I guess Sage Lute has the potential to get higher magic, but Mage Knight Lute is less likely to fail to reach 25 magic at that point too. And that's proceeding under the questionable assumption that Lute can even hit level 10/20 in a reasonable timeframe. If she doesn't then she won't get close to the Mage Knight cap.

I don't know much about saving specific turns, but I find it a little hard to believe that less movement in the desert is more significant than having less move in literally every other chapter from Chapter 10 onwards.

[Nobody]

Lute doesn't realistically hit her magic cap in a draft. In order for her to have the staff rank to use Warp in relevant chapters (all of them after C15), she needs to promote at level 10, but whether she promotes to Sage or Mage Knight, she has 25 magic either way at level 10/20. I guess Sage Lute has the potential to get higher magic, but Mage Knight Lute is less likely to fail to reach 25 magic at that point too. And that's proceeding under the questionable assumption that Lute can even hit level 10/20 in a reasonable timeframe. If she doesn't then she won't get close to the Mage Knight cap.

I don't know much about saving specific turns, but I find it a little hard to believe that less movement in the desert is more significant than having less move in literally every other chapter from Chapter 10 onwards.

There are 3 energy rings in SS, and 2 of them are easily obtainable in a draft, and the amount of mag you need in order to shave the turn is only 26, one point above mage knight's cap so Lute can reach it. Plus it's a draft, you can always reset short chapters for level ups. I've been there and done that. There's also the fact that every chapter after the desert is warp skipped, so it wouldn't make a difference. Lute, like artur is generally promoted just before chapter 11 so they can spam torch there, and it's possible to get them to level 13 or 14 by then, even with another unit that takes a lot of exp like Vanessa and Franz. Your future warper is generally the second most important unit in a FE8 draft, so you should get them as many kills as possible as long as it doesn't cost turns.

I'll try to analize the chapters starting on 9 to show you that promoting Lute to Mage Knight doesn't really save any turns if you have either Franz or Vanessa.

9 - If you have franz, you rush to the boss with a ranged weapons, with other units finishing off what he left behind. Maybe in that scenario Mage Knight lute could help, but it will take a lot of time to beat the chapter anyway.

If you have Vanessa, she'll promote and take care of the boss are and would kill every thing there and then go to the left before a 7 move mount could even reach that place. The rest of the map can be dealt by anyone with at least decent combat.

10 - If you have Vanessa, she flies with Eirika to the boss and that's it. With Franz this take a bit longer but just rush to the boss with Eirika rescued. The low move combat units can clear the things in the way without losing any turns.

11 - The biggest issue are the enemies on the lower left and in the room. The enemies on the right aren't that far and will go towards you. Sage lute can kill most of them. A 7 move mount won't be able to go to the lower left that fast because of the forests, but for Vanessa that's trivial. A longbow user is actually more helpful than a mage knight in this chapter. Franz can deal with it as well because 8 move isn't that terrible on the forest, but I think he'll beat this map slower than Vanessa.

12 - Maybe a mage knight could be helpful in this map, but there are plenty of enemies that won't leave the mountains in a while, so a flier is better. Vanessa can clear most of the northern half of the map and I think Franz might do it as well. There's also the fact that Lute has to spam barrier almost every turn this map twice, so you can't get her that far from Tethys if you want to get A Staff by chapter 16.

13 - Even Sage Lute can 1 turn this map so you literally can't improve it with a mage knight

14 - Again, a mage knight might help in this map, but rescuing Eirika with Vanessa or Franz should be enough.

15 - No one except a sage/bishop, Vanessa or Tana (or Cormag, but lol cormag in a draft on eirika's route) can deal with the bottom on the map quickly. A mage is probably the best option, because if you have a peg. knight as well you probably don't have franz, and that peg will be your other strong unit who will deal with the upper enemies including Caelagh.

After that the game turns into a warp staff spam, so a mage knight won't make any difference.

I suggest watching Espinosa's female only LTC run. He promoted Lute to a Sage for the better staff range and I don't really see any place there in which a mage knight Lute could save turns

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLbSv8zSDR9c2VdVndTU7TIfvaqNzut1ZQ

Edited August 28, 2015 by Nobody

[wgjvjavgjvfewgjevfagjwvxsg]

Seth and units like him.

[Loki Laufeyson]

Artur is superior to Lute in every area that matters

Lute gets a horse. Thats one area that can matter that Lute has one over on Artur. Im of the opinion the two are about equal because they are both ridiculously useful. Shes spams and can horsie, and he can Bishop in a game where those are broken af.