Corrin/Kamui in Smash

[Sunwoo]

As I (think I've) stated earlier in this topic, I hate Kamui because they're Kamui. Not because they're "another sword user" or "a sixth FE representative" or anything. They could've released some insignificant chump like Darros (sorry Darros) as a sixth FE rep and I'd be way less salty about it than Kamui. I just really hate Kamui. But I'm not going to go around ruining anyone else's enjoyment of Kamui over it. Just keep in mind that some people hate Kamui as a character and have played their game, and a fun move set won't stop them from being an unlikable character as a character.

[Sunwoo]

Shit, double post. Sorry.

Edited December 16, 2015 by Sunwoo

[Loki Laufeyson]

It's not different, and therein lies the problem. It treats male as the "default" gender and female as the "alternate," like they aren't as important. I could look past it when it was just Robin, but both of them being like this is dumb, especially with the high concentration of male characters compared to female characters already in the game. And to add salt to the wound, the other avatar character in the game with gender alternates, Villager, is also male default. Not cool. Some Nintendo games - notably Pokemon and Splatoon - have been avoiding this problem lately by not having a default gender option, just presenting both and letting the player pick. That may not really be an option for Smash, but at this point, they should have just used female Corrin as default.

I care about amiibo. I want a female Robin amiibo. I would want a female Corrin amiibo.

There is a time and place to pick your battles. This...sorry, as a feminist, i disagree with this because of how nitpicky it is. Femui is there. (and without her thigh holes praise Freyja!) I think we'd all find a Femui amiibo pretty awesome, but honestly? Is this really the cause here? Also, if Inkling got the slot, the female one often appears as the promo. So, by that logic, if Inkling got the slot, your complaint would be null.

[Florete]

There is a time and place to pick your battles. This...sorry, as a feminist, i disagree with this because of how nitpicky it is. Femui is there. (and without her thigh holes praise Freyja!) I think we'd all find a Femui amiibo pretty awesome, but honestly? Is this really the cause here? Also, if Inkling got the slot, the female one often appears as the promo. So, by that logic, if Inkling got the slot, your complaint would be null.

If Inkling had gotten the slot (and was female default as expected), my complaint wouldn't exist. Because I wouldn't be complaining.

I don't have anything to say to the rest of your post that I haven't already said in other posts in this thread.

[NekoKnight]

The only other Fire Emblem characters who I think had a ghost of a chance would be Tiki or maybe Anna. Lyn and Ephraim are so 'old news', it's not even funny. I will give Kamui two things, he's recent and he is unique among FE protagonists. There's no better choice than him if you simply must have another FE character.

[Acacia Sgt]

If Inkling had gotten the slot (and was female default as expected), my complaint wouldn't exist. Because I wouldn't be complaining.

I don't have anything to say to the rest of your post that I haven't already said in other posts in this thread.

But wouldn't having a female default be the same problem just swapping which is the "target" and which isn't? Or you mean that it would not be problematic as it would create a balance with the same amount defaulting to male as defaulting to female?

[twice]

I love how much unnecessary hate Kamui is getting lol, like that will change anything. All I know is when Kamui and Bayonetta is released I'm downloading both of them asap!

Edited December 17, 2015 by Ukero

[Florete]

But wouldn't having a female default be the same problem just swapping which is the "target" and which isn't? Or you mean that it would not be problematic as it would create a balance with the same amount defaulting to male as defaulting to female?

Two things:

-One, as you mentioned, it would better even the distribution.

-Two, Inkling isn't really an avatar character like Villager, Robin, and Corrin in the first place, so having a default at all isn't as much of an issue.

[Loki Laufeyson]

If Inkling had gotten the slot (and was female default as expected), my complaint wouldn't exist. Because I wouldn't be complaining.

I don't have anything to say to the rest of your post that I haven't already said in other posts in this thread.

And im saying as a feminist, its tiring to see very petty battles being waged in the name of "equality." You wouldnt be complaining because Inkling would be a girl and thats it. Saying things like "you wouldnt understand cuz you arent a female gamer" is lazy. This isnt at all like the battle fought over female superhero toys being marketed. And its not really a representation argument when you can literally play as Femui.

But wouldn't having a female default be the same problem just swapping which is the "target" and which isn't? Or you mean that it would not be problematic as it would create a balance with the same amount defaulting to male as defaulting to female?

I think that is what shes trying to say, only doing a really bad job of it. Considering its such a small thing. And who the hell is to say that we arent getting a Femui amiibo? Kamui now has two games that amiibo can be made for and marketed separately for. A Kamui could be made for Smash, a Femui could be made for Fates.

Two things:

-One, as you mentioned, it would better even the distribution.

-Two, Inkling isn't really an avatar character like Villager, Robin, and Corrin in the first place, so having a default at all isn't as much of an issue.

lmao what? Of course Inkling is an avatar character! You literally play as them in Splatoon! You get to choose their gender and accessories!

[Sunwoo]

Two things:

-One, as you mentioned, it would better even the distribution.

-Two, Inkling isn't really an avatar character like Villager, Robin, and Corrin in the first place, so having a default at all isn't as much of an issue.

?????

What else is it supposed to be if not an "avatar" for the player? Aren't they functionally the same as the villager?

[Tryhard]

I kinda think that people are equating people who are disappointed as being salty/hating, which isn't the case tbh.

I hope the distinguishing is just not specified.

Edited December 16, 2015 by Tryhard

[Florete]

And im saying as a feminist, its tiring to see very petty battles being waged in the name of "equality." You wouldnt be complaining because Inkling would be a girl and thats it. Saying things like "you wouldnt understand cuz you arent a female gamer" is lazy. This isnt at all like the battle fought over female superhero toys being marketed. And its not really a representation argument when you can literally play as Femui.

You think I'm more angry about this than I actually am. I'm mildly annoyed. That's about it. Corrin's case is also a bigger deal for me, personally, because it's Fire Emblem, and Fire Emblem is a series that is very close to me. If it had been someone from a series I don't play, I still would be mildly annoyed, but I probably wouldn't have even mentioned it.

For the record, I don't give a damn about you and whatever your feminist agenda is. Don't equate me to that.

I also never said "you wouldnt understand cuz you arent a female gamer." I said it's more difficult to understand. "More difficult" because it's entirely possible - and I personally know at least one - for male gamers to understand. It's just not as easy.

lmao what? Of course Inkling is an avatar character! You literally play as them in Splatoon! You get to choose their gender and accessories!

?????

What else is it supposed to be if not an "avatar" for the player? Aren't they functionally the same as the villager?

The most important thing I consider for a character to be considered an avatar is being able to use your own name. You can't do this for Inklings. They are close, but the way they are marketed and used in game edges them away from it for me.

You literally play as them in Splatoon! This means literally nothing.

I kinda think that people are equating people who are disappointed as being salty/hating, which isn't the case tbh.

Thankfully someone gets it.

[Sunwoo]

The most important thing I consider for a character to be considered an avatar is being able to use your own name. You can't do this for Inklings. They are close, but the way they are marketed and used in game edges them away from it for me.

You literally play as them in Splatoon! This means literally nothing.

This honestly feels really nitpick-y. Other than that, they are functionally an avatar. By your logic, Tidus from FFX would possibly be an avatar since you can change his name.

Also, let me present a question to you. I get that you're disappointed about male Kamui being the default since that possibly means that female Kamui wouldn't be getting an amiibo. But what if the reveal had made female Kamui the default, with her obviously getting an amiibo and all that stuff and male Kamui possibly not? Would you care then?

[Sweet_Basil]

Corrin looks very fun but i'm only saddened by massive hate-wagon Fire Emblem has now from other Nintendo fans. I think it could have been partially avoided by not splitting Marth and Lucina into separate characters and probably picking another veteran instead of Roy.

[Florete]

This honestly feels really nitpick-y. Other than that, they are functionally an avatar. By your logic, Tidus from FFX would possibly be an avatar since you can change his name.

Also, let me present a question to you. I get that you're disappointed about male Kamui being the default since that possibly means that female Kamui wouldn't be getting an amiibo. But what if the reveal had made female Kamui the default, with her obviously getting an amiibo and all that stuff and male Kamui possibly not? Would you care then?

There's no clear definition of what makes an avatar and what doesn't. That's why I put it the way I did: close, but not quite in my eyes. They certainly aren't as much of an avatar character as Robin and Corrin are meant to be.

I would be happy, for myself personality and for knowing that Sakurai cares about gender equality at least to some extent.

I mean, I still support the idea of the gender alts getting amiibos. I've always thought they should, including male WFT, so I would still think there should be amiibos for both Corrins.

[Loki Laufeyson]

You think I'm more angry about this than I actually am. I'm mildly annoyed. That's about it. Corrin's case is also a bigger deal for me, personally, because it's Fire Emblem, and Fire Emblem is a series that is very close to me. If it had been someone from a series I don't play, I still would be mildly annoyed, but I probably wouldn't have even mentioned it.

For the record, I don't give a damn about you and whatever your feminist agenda is. Don't equate me to that.

I also never said "you wouldnt understand cuz you arent a female gamer." I said it's more difficult to understand. "More difficult" because it's entirely possible - and I personally know at least one - for male gamers to understand. It's just not as easy.

The most important thing I consider for a character to be considered an avatar is being able to use your own name. You can't do this for Inklings. They are close, but the way they are marketed and used in game edges them away from it for me.

You literally play as them in Splatoon! This means literally nothing.

Thankfully someone gets it.

What are you trying to say then if you arent making a feminist argument omg. If you dont want to be equated to a feminist, why are you trying to form a feminist argument? You jumped to the conclusion that we are only getting Kamui defaulted a dude as an amiibo. We literally do not know that. We could wind up with a Kamui set like the Inklings for Splatoon, because why not milk the cash cow.

If you do not want me or anyone to equate you to feminism, thats ALL on you. People are going to assume you are feminist when you try to make that kind of argument.

You are cherry picking what is an avatar character and what isnt. Inklings dont have names, they are supposed to represent us the player.

[Tryhard]

Thankfully someone gets it.

Actually I don't think anyone was viewing you as salty/hating, considering you seem to like the character otherwise. I was more referring to people who seem to equate any negative reaction or disappointment as the equivalent of wanting to pull out Sakurai's toenails and throw a temper tantrem. Such as me, who doesn't like the Corrin reveal but ain't gonna get pissy over it.

Still, frankly I really don't agree with your criticism and the justification of such, and I don't think I find it harder to understand as a male gamer (though it would be natural for me to think that) but it's whatever.

Edited December 17, 2015 by Tryhard

[Loki Laufeyson]

Actually I don't think anyone was viewing you as salty/hating, considering you seem to like the character otherwise. I was more referring to people who seem to equate any negative reaction or disappointment as the equivalent of wanting to pull out Sakurai's toenails and throw a temper tantrem. Such as me, who doesn't like the Corrin reveal but ain't gonna get pissy over it.

Still, frankly I really don't agree with your criticism and the justification of such, and I don't think I find it harder to understand as a male gamer (though it would be natural for me to think that) but it's whatever.

No joke. People getting nasty about Sakurai is really...ew. Lots of people arent big on Kamui being a thing in Smash. Hell, i wasnt sure what to think at first. We arent even discussing salt and hating on that level.

[Florete]

What are you trying to say then if you arent making a feminist argument omg. If you dont want to be equated to a feminist, why are you trying to form a feminist argument? You jumped to the conclusion that we are only getting Kamui defaulted a dude as an amiibo. We literally do not know that. We could wind up with a Kamui set like the Inklings for Splatoon, because why not milk the cash cow.

If you do not want me or anyone to equate you to feminism, thats ALL on you. People are going to assume you are feminist when you try to make that kind of argument.

You are cherry picking what is an avatar character and what isnt. Inklings dont have names, they are supposed to represent us the player.

This is not a conversation I am going to have here. Especially not with you.

I'll look forward to a female Corrin amiibo when amiibos for female Robin and male WFT are announced.

Actually I don't think anyone was viewing you as salty/hating, considering you seem to like the character otherwise. I was more referring to people who seem to equate any negative reaction or disappointment as the equivalent of wanting to pull out Sakurai's toenails and throw a temper tantrem. Such as me, who doesn't like the Corrin reveal but ain't gonna get pissy over it.

Still, frankly I really don't agree with your criticism and the justification of such, and I don't think I find it harder to understand as a male gamer (though it would be natural for me to think that) but it's whatever.

To be fair, it's not really about "being a male gamer." It's about the difference between being part of the group who has their side represented all the time and being part of the other group who gets very little representation in comparison.

[Busterman64]

Corrin looks very fun but i'm only saddened by massive hate-wagon Fire Emblem has now from other Nintendo fans. I think it could have been partially avoided by not splitting Marth and Lucina into separate characters and probably picking another veteran instead of Roy.

I doubt it, especially since a lot of people wanted Roy back (Fire Emblem fan or not) and Corrin was planned ahead of time (and because I personally love Lucina in Smash...:3 ). People would be saying the same thing with only 5 characters. Maybe not as hard, but still very noticeable. The issue is that they all use swords (some more than others) and they are from a franchise not played by most of the smash bros fans (heck, the same can be said for bayonetta, no matter how good the game is). Not to mention how salty a lot of people are right now about the final characters and...some people don't like Corrin as a character. There are probably more reasons, but I can't think of much more right now. Edited December 17, 2015 by Busterman64

[SSbardock84]

Uh, I'd say no. Not a big fan of the new avatar.

[twice]

since a lot of people wanted Roy back (Fire Emblem fan or not)

Yeah, he had mixed reactions as well, but it got better in time (I think?) I know at first I wasn't too excited for him but when I bought his DLC I really liked him so he became one of my mains. Maybe some will experience this with Kamui? Kamui's moveset looks pretty diverse, and I think people who aren't quite sure about it might enjoy it once they use Kamui.

Hopefully future smash games(?) can try please more of a wider audience with some other characters, Sakurai does his best and I am grateful for that.

Edited December 17, 2015 by Ukero

[Busterman64]

Yeah, he had mixed reactions as well, but it got better in time (I think?) I know at first I wasn't too excited for him but when I bought his DLC I really liked him so he became one of my mains. Maybe some will experience this with Kamui? Kamui's moveset looks pretty diverse, and I think people who aren't quite sure about it might enjoy it once they use Kamui.

It helped that Roy was veteran that was not in Brawl and was desired by fans for his return like Mewtwo(not as bad, but still highly requested). Corrin is a newcomer, so the flames are towards him more so. Poor Corrin...

[IceBuster573]

So...does anybody think Sakurai (or localization) is going to slightly alter Corrin's personality in Smash? Like with Roy and Lucina?

[PuffPuff]

Having Corrin barefoot does make sense with Azure/Aqua being his/her cousion. They barefooted him/her to give an Azure look kind of ring to it! Even though they haven't been barefoot in the game which would have been hardcore more if they were! This is as best as it gets since Azure, Ryoma, Avatar or Kid and Xandar had any chance at being in.

R.I.P. Ice Climbers

R.I.P. Ivysaur

R.I.P. Pichu

P.I.P. Pokemon Trainer

R.I.P. Snake

R.I.P. Squirtle

R.I.P. Wolf

R.I.P. Young Link

But...will go back to the older titles if to use them. :)

Nice seeing positive reactions towards Corrin and Bayonetta. Since she was in an M rated game with Smash being E10+.

Edited December 17, 2015 by eclipse
Spoiler tags, and if I have to edit them in, I put the entire post in 'em