Serenes Forest Mafia Mafia 4 - Game Over

[riariadne]

"rein post in this game" "rein host your game" "rein post in other things" "rein give me a million dollars" "rein buy engagement rings already" "rein go to class"

Not a fan of Beli's logical leaps, even if they're only for D1 apparently, and saying stuff makes "perfect sense" when a lot of people clearly don't seem to agree seems be pushing reads pretty aggressively. Comes off as pretty obstructive.

Fine with my vote on Elie still, nothing he's said since the last time he's posted has pushed me away from finding him scummy and his BBM vote didn't spontaneously improve, so I'll be leaving it there for now. Still alright with a Blitz lynch since apparently that's a wagon now but I would prefer Elie at this stage. Slightly townreading BBM a bit because both of their votes are on him and aren't great. Null on Mitsuki.

I have three hours of class sorta soon and I want to eat because food is good for you, but I'll be around for phase end and might say stuff later if we have a big development. Otherwise I don't really have a ton to say that I don't think is superfluous so I'm not going to spend forever thinking of every small comment I could make, so compact post is go.

[Elieson]

Yeah i don't think the eli claim is a fake and i'd rather lynch blitz/mits over the 3 main wagons today.

Mits calling me scummy for my easy vote on her reminds me of what scum me did to blitz in tyne wear. Its hilarious that i'm in her lynch priority just bcuz of that and nothing else.

There's also her eli vote which i didn't like bcuz it was an opportunistic shift from her kay vote(cmiiw reading on phone is hard)

@eli: stance on refa is he isn't giving town vibes but also isn't scummy but i could settle

Tyne Wear was madness and should be as reliable of a source of info as TrainWreck would be Therefore, surprisingly good for scum!Shin meta

That makes sense then. Settling on a Refa nullread is a least a position.

Don't insult me by dismissing my reasoning as bad logic. You don't have to agree with it but it's my reasoning and makes perfect sense. I could go through a lot of this topic and say "lol this is bad logic facepalm" but I don't because that's a shitty thing to say.

##Vote Blitz

I agree enough with Bluedoom and Rein's thoughts about Blitz. He's been unnaturally aggressive with things that aren't of much consequence which also clashes with what I remember of him from the past two games I've played with him. His vote on BBM doesn't really fit (and I'm not even sure I know who Bizz is), and after complaining a bunch about what he perceived as inactivity, he hasn't shown up for two days.

His activity is typically questionable due to is lifestyle/environment. I'm not justifying it as ok, but ask anyone, Blitz isn't known for activity.

Regardless, I support this statement, especially since Blitz continued to harp on Quote (aka Bizz), and even as his scumread on BBM diminishes, blitz didn't vote anywhere else. He primarily scumread BBM for townreading Quote [and defending Quote from bear-interactions, which were mildly millllllllldly scummy at worst]. It feels mainly like Blitz's votepark is just that, a votepark.

I'm doubting my BBM read a bit because frustrations and I slept on it. I'm not as devoted to BBscuM being a thing because tempers et al. I can see Blitz pushing an easy ride and just trying to keep his vote on someone likely to be lynched.

##Unvote

##Vote Blitz

[Mitsuki]

So when I push my scumreads I'm scummy for not answering and when I answer I'm scummy for not pushing my scumreads. Sigh.

People who are saying I'm scum for the same stuff I've already answered should go and consider my answers.

It's scummy for Bearclaw to shoot down Via townreads because he wasn't giving a reason to stay at "default" as you put it. Several people were like "I think Bizz is town" and insteadof saying like "nah that's not a towntell here's why (which isn't calling her scummy either btw)" he was just like "nah Via isn't town" and then when people questioned him about it he was just like "no I stand by what I said" without saying why at all. Like I said earlier, Blitz actually gave a REASON against what others said; Bear just refused for no reason at all.

But he just said that he didn't agree, not that the townreads were bad or that people should stop them. He never said "Via isn't town" nor anything similar, he just expressed disagreement. It's null.

Also I never said Psych was scum off that logic, I was giving it as a reason for why his roleclaim wasn't obvtown as several people were claiming. To tie it back to what I said about Bearclaw, that's kind of what I was expecting from Bearclaw. A reason for not agreeing. The reason I thought Psych might also be scum is because his Weapons vote made no sense and sucked, as I explain somewhere.

I agree that Psych's claim was not obvtown, but what? You gave a reason why town would not claim the existance of a cult, not a reason why claiming it wasn't townie. If you think town could go either way about claiming it that's not proof of anything from your point of view.

I actually agree with what you said about my Refa vote. I forgot to say so but it was a reason I switched to Elie- I realized that Refa sticking with Weapons rather than voting me was suboptimal play rather than scummy play.

Fair enough.

I still think BBM is scum, but I don't think he's going to be lynched today and I prefer to give him more time based on the last things he said anyways.

##Unvote

##Vote: Marth

Basically voting him on what I previously explained and also I feel like SB brings up some very good points about him (one of them is what I previously said but yeah).

Mits calling me scummy for my easy vote on her reminds me of what scum me did to blitz in tyne wear. Its hilarious that i'm in her lynch priority just bcuz of that and nothing else.

I didn't vote you for making a weak vote, I voted you for placing a vote on stuff that can't even be seen as scummy no matter how you look at it.

I don't like how Marth is trying to pass my vote here as weak while not answering what was scummy about what he cased me on and comparing what I've done to something someone else has done as scum, it feels like an attempt on discrediting cases on him. Also, I expect town would at least point out how what they've said is scummy from their perspective or stop considering their logic as relevant if they see it doesn't hold.

I've just noticed that Bearclaw hasn't even made a single case. Is he usually like that? I recall poor activity from him in other games but I don't think it reached these levels.

With regards to Iris, Weapons, SB/Kay and Via, I prefer to wait and see what they do D2 since what I said on them isn't very strong anyways.

I'll ISO Blitz and Boron, but from what I've read so far they're null to me.

[Blitz]

I am not one bit caught up on the game cause real life is being a pain and since this is the last week of the semester, I doubt I will be able to do much for this phase (I actually do not want a sub cause I will be free after another 2 days)

anyways, I don't think I am up for catching up with 10 pages of the thread and getting anything real out tonight, if people are very interested in lynching me, I will claim (cause I see 4 votes on me)

[Refa]

Remember when I said I would reread people? I didn't.

Elie is locked into a Neighbour 0-shot Driver claim as either alignment... He can't exactly go I'M TOWN COP/HOOKER/DOCTOR/VIGILANTE when his Neighbour would chime in and CC him. If it was any other weak role I'd agree that Elie could have claimed a stronger role, but it isn't.

Fair enough.

I cannot focus on hosting a game AND playing in one on top of other stuff going on. If things don't settle down, I might have to sub out on N1.

Refa's vote on me is terrible. His argument about me going after "obviously scummy things" is analogous to what people attacked me over in British mafia: going after things that were "too easy" and "obviously bad". Guess what the guy I had my vote on at the end of the day flipped. His statement about how I'm defending BBM without giving a read on him is false. I've stated NUMEROUS TIMES I don't agree with or see the cases on BBM, and I don't see what he's doing as scummy. His closing statement about how "her posts are fine but there's nothing that makes me feel she's town" reads like he's forcing a scum read on me.

I don't understand his read on Elieson either. Says that aside from a few scummy posts, reads townie. How and why do the rest of his posts aside from the two bad ones read townie? And yes, your Eury scum read does read biased.

Your first point about my vote on you is wrong because for that point I said that's something you've done as town. Like it's an issue I have with you but I clearly stated that it wasn't scummy. OK, that's reasonable but why didn't you make an effort to read BBM when he became a wagon? Also I like how you only really addressed one of my points (that wasn't even a point against you), does that mean you agree with the others?

Because his reads/posts are natural and there's nothing that bothers me or makes me think "oh well that could come from scum!Elieson too"?

[Refa]

I still feel really good about my current vote. People should say state their reads on Boron, but no fucking null reads.

[Refa]

I'm back to lynch scum and chew bubblegum, and I'm all out of scum.

Since my ISO of Blitz, he's only made one post saying that he's going to claim? I guess I should read peoples' cases on him but I still don't get why people are scumreading him...

So, Mitsuki. Just by skimming, I don't get what's wrong with BBM not explaining his vote on bearclaw more? Like I had issues with him too, but that wasn't one of them (because bearclaw did like fuck all). Also I don't like how she's singling Marth out for his vote on her when like half of the game said the exact same thing. Other than that nothing particularly stands out, probably another person whose cases on them I should read. *shrugs*

[Mitsuki]

@Refa: I never found BBM scummy for not explaining his Bearclaw vote more, and you should go and check what Marth voted me on because it has nothing to do with other people's votes.

[Refa]

That's my point. You SHOULD have payed attention to other peoples' votes (and cases) instead of singling out Marth for something that other people did as well. Maybe I missed something but it didn't look like you explained why he was worse than other people.

[Mitsuki]

I did... his logic didn't make sense as something scummy, while I could understand why other people found my first post scummy.

[BBM]

feeling better now

SB makes a really good point about Marf's Bearclaw switch. I might vote here; dunno if I want to vote Blitz. I don't exactly object to his lynch or anything because I agree that he's kind of been parking me but his content just doesn't feel as forced as I'd expect it to as scum.

@Mitsuki- no, I did[/] give a reason for why cult/mafia would out the existence of a cult. It makes town super paranoid. It's arguable whether or not that outweighs the benefits of keeping it hidden, but it's still definitely a reason why Psych's claim isn't all obvtown, and that was the only reason I ever went into this. It wasn't a case on Psych- that was the other part about what he said about Weapons.

And also, 'disagreement' is arguing against the townreads. It's not necessarily saying that she's scum, no, but it's still dismissing the reads, and in Bearclaw's case it's for no reason. Like if I just said 'nah Marth isn't scum' in response to your read on him and then didn't give any reason why I disagreed.

Anyways, looking at Elie's latest posts does nothing to dissuade my scumread here. His objection to SB doesn't make sense- gutreads are a thing, sure, but gutreads without even reading someone's posts? That only works if you're talking about Eury. His next few posts talk about some people's posts but I don't really get his overall feeling about them because at the end he's just like 'yeah gonna sheep Beli' (one of the people whom he cased in the preceding posts) and votes Blitz. Don't really get why he's harping on Shinori for lessening his scumread on me just because he has a bigger scumread on him either. Acknowledging that we're unlikely to be buddies makes perfect sense to me.

[BBM]

also I got a kitten fuck its eyes are creepy

out for a bit but then I should be around until phase end

[Refa]

"BBM has quoted mod cat pictures, he has been modkilled!"

What did SB say about Marth?

[Refa]

Also I still haven't gotten any cat pictures, I blame my role.

[Mitsuki]

Boron's ISO: I find that she brings up a good point on Bearclaw here with regards to his activity. I don't agree with the other points she's brought up, but I don't see those as scummy. Her latest post reads genuine as well, wouldn't vote.

Blitz's ISO: I've never seen scum claiming some PGO-like role, and while I could see them claiming it or something like miller, I think town will truthfully claim it more times than scum. I kind of agree with him here on what he says about Via not trying to generate content. His point on Beli on the same is weird though, why are you saying he's very likely to be scum if you don't want to go for him for anything else other than an inactive lynch? I could see this as an issue of how he worded it though. Overall neutral, I think it's better to wait to see what he does from D2 on since he's apparently busy right now.

[Mitsuki]

We only have 4 hours left, by the way. Wagons are something like 5:4:4 so we should decide on a lynch already.

I don't want to vote Elie or Blitz, you all should turbo Marth with me.

[Refa]

(you should turbo Boron with me)

Reading Marth, I guess.

[Refa]

Blitz's ISO: I've never seen scum claiming some PGO-like role, and while I could see them claiming it or something like miller, I think town will truthfully claim it more times than scum. I kind of agree with him here on what he says about Via not trying to generate content. His point on Beli on the same is weird though, why are you saying he's very likely to be scum if you don't want to go for him for anything else other than an inactive lynch? I could see this as an issue of how he worded it though. Overall neutral, I think it's better to wait to see what he does from D2 on since he's apparently busy right now.

Also scum has done that before (I had a similar thought process in Conspiracy lol).

[Refa]

Hi Scum Goon.

[Refa]

Ok, to clarify my earlier 'claim' , I'm informed that there's a role which can give others the hated modifier.

I dunno, I don't see this as a scum claim? 10 bucks it's a Witch, BTW.

I don't think Bluedoom is scum. All of his reads have a logical progression that I can get behind (like yeah he dropped his bearclaw vote but so did a bunch of other people so whatever). I dunno, I don't really want to turbolynch him. *sigh*

Like I can kind of get why people have issues with me since I really only have 2 scumreads, but I'm just having a hard time getting behind any of this cases.

[Refa]

Oh, just read the votals and apparently it's Elieson/BBM/Mitsuki not Elieson/BBM/Blitz. I'd vote Mitsuki over the other two because I genuinely think that Elieson is town and want to give BBM a chance to prove his claim, but it feels kind of wrong to vote someone you don't have any real read on.

[Blitz]

even though I didn't read the thread and trying to do so (while also playing SMT) and keeping an eye on the newest post, I must say Marth's initial posts lacked the scum intent that I sensed in Tyne-Wear. As for Boron, she has the same fault as everyone voting for Bear as an inactive lynch (and I still don't actually get what the Bear case actually is)

[Refa]

I don't think Boron is scum for her bearclaw case itself.

[Mitsuki]

@Refa: it's Elie/Blitz/me, actually

we should get some votals

[Blitz]

my first ever votals edited from Blade

Elieson (5): Iris, Shinori, BBM, Rein, Boron

Blitz (4): Marth, Belisarius, Elieson, Kay/SB

Mitsuki (4): Proto, Weapons, Eurykins, Levity
BBM (3): Blitz, Psych

Boron (2): FFM, Refa
Marth (1): Mitsuki

forgive me if there are errors