We Need Serenes Forest Mafia Mafia 5 After All! - GAME OVER

[SatsumaFSoysoy]

2 minutes ago, Fable said:

Really not understanding pushes on mack though because wolves have pushed that slot super hard this game, I'm not seeing it at all.

Did you read the stuff that Snike and I talked about with the Empower item Kaoz received last night?

[Mackc2]

8 minutes ago, Snike said:

Put your vote where your mouth is then.

That's always an option, but:

-I was being townread by most of the game d1; If I was thought to be protown after that phase I probably would've been killed by strongman next night.

-I already said I redirected to kirsche because I thought he would die to the nightkill. I was scumreading BBM hard so letting that kill happen would look superbad on me. And there is reason to think that; Kirsche just got a lynch swung off of him and onto scum; he was IMO clear off of that.

-I took the you off of kaoz because I decided to gamble; I also wasn't 100% certain he was clear because the roleblocker just flipped.

-You're implying that scum would let me claim godfather D1 on a slot that wasn't being heavily suspected instead of speculate about a framer. And that I'd announce an item and that I'd announce my hijack immediately upon both day starts.

-WIFOM. The strongman wouldn't be able to be messed with that night and they could always just use eury to block me and perform the nightkill if they thought I would meddle. I think Shinori very well could have given the item to me  for later towncred if he had to claim.

The fact that you cased elsewhere and only responded with this once I cased you does not reflect well IMO. But @Vi-astra @Refa @Omega I'd like to ask your opinions.

I just woke up, I was going to vote JB cause no one would follow me, but I just realised after this post that he got shot so yeah I am claiming based on night actions and votes that I believe you and Kirsche are the two remaining scum. 

##Vote: Snike/SatsumaFSoySoy

On to your points, you where not town read or maybe you where but most people expressed that they thought Satsuma was not, leaving your slot at a net neutral to most.  

What about Zkirsche made them a more valuable asset to town than Kaoz? Why did you decide to risk the jailer dying to protect another town that you thought might die, seems mighty convenient that the Jailer happened to get an item same night. 

The Jailer getting an item today is exactly why I know you are scum because there are three options here (because why waste a strongman on me) and the only options that make sense for scum team is either I am scum or you are scum. Thus in my eyes your argument is the important one (plus I haven't seen these other arguments) because yours is the one that looks like a scum trying to push a mislynch. 

 

 

[Percivalé]

meh i don't think mack is scum. i went back and forth on it but i don't think he's scum.

[SullyMcGully]

TBH, there is one thing that kinda rubs me the wrong way about Kirsche: He subbed out after a lynch which would have had him being generally townread. If he was demotivated because he was being scumread or ignored by Junko, then that should all be at an end now. Instead, he left. TBH, I would rather have unmotivated Kirsche now than Kill. He's... a character... I don't like his play so far and if it weren't for all of the reasons to townread Kirsche's slot, I would scumread Kill. He's the most anti-town we've gotten since Zeus left.

Not liking Mack in the Mack/Snike interactions. Mack drops a weak post, Snike responds with a detailed read... I'd say, with all the shade Snike has been casting on Mack's slot throughout the game, if we lynch Mack and he flips scum, then we get Snike cleared. I can't be of much use with all of this role madness going on.

OK, I'm going to confess something. If it looks like my reads are getting lazy/weak, it's because they probably are. While I would love to devote more time to this game over the next few days, due to IRL circumstances, I can't. I should still be able to check in and keep this slot from being the victim of yet another sub, but I'm going to be less informed and probably less helpful from here on out. 

Yeah, my vote's on Walrein because he's being scummy and ignoring us. Um... I'm checking out for the night, so I guess that's not a good reason. 

##Vote: Mackc2

I have yet to hear a compelling reason for the change in your playstyle, Duke. If you continue to low-effort this game and ignore the arguments on you, I really won't mind lynching you.

Arcanite, LG, and Walrein are also OK lynches with me. Somebody should ping @Arcanite though so they can show some effort before we lynch them.

[SullyMcGully]

OK, I didn't see that Mack post when I posted my post. Still didn't address my case though.

Goodnight!

[🔥YOLOSWAG🔥]

##Vote: Lord Gaius

I'll have to read over the claim stuff another time. We can't get complacent.

[🔥YOLOSWAG🔥]

Snike, if you're village, a wolf may have gone at you today. But some villas are probably shitting on you too. So I'm just saying if you're innocent be aware that you're being set up to be mislynched off claim/tunneling/spec stuff, that's what I'd do as wolf right now.

[Snike]

I'm aware I'm being set up. Like 2 subs in a row and now this sudden push by Mack.

But like I think the two subs are both town? And while mack looks good by associations, see below.

I still don't like how the mack case just popped up after I brought that up. It reeks of OMGUS.

@Mackc2 Zkirsche is networker so provides oc contact to townies. He was also cleared by association

What does that even mean? If your case is based off of that maybe you should go back and point at it d1. "Maybe you weren't or maybe you where" isn't a valid response.

Yeah I brought up that jailor got an item. That's the whole reason the whole speculation about you even came to light.

I understand the pov there but you just dropped your other cases for this. Like I didn't say you were 100% scum either; I specifically said that you could've been the target of a pocket by shinori. Sats elaborated on the other scenarios because I spoke with him in our chat.

You still haven't addressed my claims yet.

This case isn't based on scum intent, it is based on your questioning my play.

actually, how do you know that there's only two remaining scum?

[🔥YOLOSWAG🔥]

Fable, any opinion on Kill's entrance?

[Mackc2]

@SullyMcGully You must be mis-remembering my play because during Kemono friends I was active N1, and I just sat my vote on beep for the rest of the game, changing to consolidate and only responding when somebody accused me of being scummy, the comments from the mod that game where, don't remember what you did but your night play was good. This game I am playing literally exactly the same, hell I even have a protective roll like I did in Kemono friends. P5 is a bad example because I just really didn't want to be lynched or fuck up because paper blade relied on me. 

 

[🔥YOLOSWAG🔥]

Refa, you still feeling Snike as wolf? I admit, I haven't thought too deeply about his slot in a while because I've been looking elsewhere.

[Makaze]

2 hours ago, Makaze said:

What exactly looks bad on me?

@Snike

59 minutes ago, Snike said:

Put your vote where your mouth is then.

That's always an option, but:

-I was being townread by most of the game d1; If I was thought to be protown after that phase I probably would've been killed by strongman next night.

-I already said I redirected to kirsche because I thought he would die to the nightkill. I was scumreading BBM hard so letting that kill happen would look superbad on me. And there is reason to think that; Kirsche just got a lynch swung off of him and onto scum; he was IMO clear off of that.

-I took the you off of kaoz because I decided to gamble; I also wasn't 100% certain he was clear because the roleblocker just flipped.

-You're implying that scum would let me claim godfather D1 on a slot that wasn't being heavily suspected instead of speculate about a framer. And that I'd announce an item and that I'd announce my hijack immediately upon both day starts.

-WIFOM. The strongman wouldn't be able to be messed with that night and they could always just use eury to block me and perform the nightkill if they thought I would meddle. I think Shinori very well could have given the item to me  for later towncred if he had to claim.

The fact that you cased elsewhere and only responded with this once I cased you does not reflect well IMO. But @Vi-astra @Refa @Omega I'd like to ask your opinions.

I like the argument but I am getting bad feelings because the tone of this argument is bothering me. I don't understand how it would look bad on you, can you explain that?

Also, how do you reconcile the idea that they would kill Kirsche in this scenario?

39 minutes ago, Fable said:

I don't know how much I like an arcanite lynch. 

It's not bad per se more like it's a coin flip IMO because I didn't see anything super damning against weapons in any of the wolf ISOs from what I could tell. I mean if arcanite never does anything today I guess yeah go for it cuz it's not an unreasonable lynch and we have the breathing room, like I think we always win this game because I don't think the PoE is very big atp. I guess I'm fine as long as we keep the lynch in Walrein, LG, Arcanite.  

Really not understanding pushes on mack though because wolves have pushed that slot super hard this game, I'm not seeing it at all. 

Can you point out where the wolves have pushed him hard?

33 minutes ago, Mackc2 said:

I just woke up, I was going to vote JB cause no one would follow me, but I just realised after this post that he got shot so yeah I am claiming based on night actions and votes that I believe you and Kirsche are the two remaining scum. 

##Vote: Snike/SatsumaFSoySoy

On to your points, you where not town read or maybe you where but most people expressed that they thought Satsuma was not, leaving your slot at a net neutral to most.  

What about Zkirsche made them a more valuable asset to town than Kaoz? Why did you decide to risk the jailer dying to protect another town that you thought might die, seems mighty convenient that the Jailer happened to get an item same night. 

The Jailer getting an item today is exactly why I know you are scum because there are three options here (because why waste a strongman on me) and the only options that make sense for scum team is either I am scum or you are scum. Thus in my eyes your argument is the important one (plus I haven't seen these other arguments) because yours is the one that looks like a scum trying to push a mislynch. 

There is just one thing that I noticed with these interactions, and it is that Mack has completely and unreservedly cleared Kaoz, despite it possibly making sense that Kaoz got the empower because Mafia wanted him to get the Empower because he is scum.

This definitely does not look like someone who is actually thinking or having their reads challenged.

Mack, why did you target Kaoz?

[Mackc2]

4 minutes ago, Snike said:

actually, how do you know that there's only two remaining scum?

Everyone has said 5-6 scum and 1 SK or 6-7 scum as the likely number I have just run with that. Interesting you have backed off a bit perhaps you are scared that when I flip town it will dig your grave. 

As for Zkirsche he doesn't necessarily have to be your scum buddy, that was just based on my beginning on N1 read because frankly I am sick of this game, I wanted to die N2 

[Snike]

2 hours ago, Snike said:

It goes back to the associations zeus had w/ confirmed scum d1 and my misgivings about the whole thread shift in the last third of Day 2 which had me think something unnatural was afoot. And you were hard pushing the eclipse slot at that point of time along with JB (who flipped scum) and BBM (who flipped town) and gaius?

Last point, which is not your fault by any means, is that you're in poe range.

@Makaze

As for why it would look bad; I called the last minute turbo + BBM got janned and my strong townread flipped scum; I could be viewed as opportunistic af.

[Mackc2]

3 minutes ago, Makaze said:

Mack, why did you target Kaoz?

He claimed Jailer, Scum want the Jailer dead, I want to be dead thus I protect the Jailer 

[Refa]

One thing I don't get: If Mackc2 is mafia, why would he claim to have gotten an item and like...mafia would be clearly intending to not give that item to Kaoz to begin with.

[Mackc2]

Also Makaze your option simply does not make sense, why would mafia give the item to a member they knew full well would probably be protected by me (thus give me the item) instead of just giving it to another mafia member? 

[Mackc2]

1 minute ago, Refa said:

One thing I don't get: If Mackc2 is mafia, why would he claim to have gotten an item and like...mafia would be clearly intending to not give that item to Kaoz to begin with.

I never claimed to have got an item, Kaoz did. 

[Refa]

1 minute ago, Mackc2 said:

I never claimed to have got an item, Kaoz did. 

Yeah, I mean like...why wouldn't Shinori just give Mafia!You the item?  Considering they were clearly intending on you getting it if you were mafia.

[Makaze]

1 minute ago, Mackc2 said:

Also Makaze your option simply does not make sense, why would mafia give the item to a member they knew full well would probably be protected by me (thus give me the item) instead of just giving it to another mafia member? 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it would also make the jail stronger?

Anyway you have a point. And quotes incoming re: the supposed scum pushes on Nightmare/Mackc2.

[Refa]

Also I did fuck up on who got the item, whoops.

[Makaze]

Just now, Refa said:

Yeah, I mean like...why wouldn't Shinori just give Mafia!You the item?  Considering they were clearly intending on you getting it if you were mafia.

This is an incredibly good point.

[Baldrick]

A lot to digest here.

If mafia!Walrein came in to the thread and saw he and his buddy jb the leading wagons, I don't think he'd be wishy-washy about casing jb. He'd either commit to the bus or look for a counterwagon. So I think he's town.

@snike
You meant investigation as in cop? OK, fair enough.

Your gaius analysis makes sense, and I like that you looked at his claim without confirmation bias. Your tone towards me has been pretty even, as well.

##unvote

That said, I still like you less than refa/omega/makaze/via, the others of the wagon swing towards kirsche. Unless kirsche flips mafia, you're still in my PoE pool.

I believe the consensus is that everyone is comfortable with an Arcanite lynch. Is there anyone who's not? From Arcanite's last post, they may not be able to catch up in time, so I feel there needs to be a devil's advocate.

pedit:

Can someone explain what the mack/snike thing is about? What I've got is that snike redirected mack to kirsche, and kaoz got a strongman item so mack thinks there's some intent in that redirect?

[Arcanite]

38 minutes ago, SullyMcGully said:

Arcanite, LG, and Walrein are also OK lynches with me. Somebody should ping @Arcanite though so they can show some effort before we lynch them.

I AM TRYING

BUT

THERE'S LIKE

so much to catch up on lol
Anyway I'll have a post with thoughts up to page 30
If you want me to read through and give thoughts on the other 60 pages then I'll do that too if you can find me the time
You guys would be completely wasting yout time lynching me, and I'd rather you dont kill me and find out that way
 

 

Spoiler

Can I go a single mafia game without being up for a lynch?

 

 

 

1 minute ago, Refa said:

Also I did fuck up on who got the item, whoops.

Take a sip of that misread juice?

[Refa]

1 minute ago, Arcanite said:

You guys would be completely wasting yout time lynching me, and I'd rather you dont kill me and find out that way

  Hide contents

Can I go a single mafia game without being up for a lynch?

 

Take a sip of that misread juice?

1) Arcanite, are you scum?

2) If so, who's your buddy?  If not, who are the other 2 scum?

3) I'm BBM, I'm known for misreading.