Refa Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 that was the best role tho so there's nowai mancer would be upset at getting that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SB. Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 BEST UNINTENTIONAL SCUMKILL Really I need to see Mancer's claim before I make my mind up on him. I can see parts of his play where he does things from Adventures but at the same time I can see reasons why he would play in the way he is as town? Mafia is hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BT. Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Reading Mancer's ISO is toxic. I can't get around how scummy his play is. Mancer hasn't seriously suspected Randa's slot since the original case - updates to the suspicion have been "I still lean scum on him" and "he is now lurking, so scum". No real confrontation of Randa or his play, just narration on how his cult post must be because he reached that conclusion as scum and not because he reached it as town. Seriously, every time I brought it up to him he brushes it aside as "yeah I know it's risky but he must be scum for it" which... ignores what I was saying. On the query of "why is Randa scum" I get nothing. His suspicions henceforth are plain bad and the way he slaps them onto his posts reeks. Yeah, "flailing" is the right word. Not sure how it's town flailing though. He has all of these attempts at getting something on someone and the only coherent attempt at piecing it all together is "I really believe that a Randa/BBM/Gorf scum team might exist." What makes you "really believe" that? That just seems like a lie; what's flailing town!Mancer's goal in conjuring ill-thought-out scumteams? What motive does flailing town!Mancer have for saying SB "might not be town" for "voting the next person that town has their attention on"? What the fuck does that even mean, and why would a flailing town!Mancer both pick it up and leave it as vague as that? Why isn't flailing town!Mancer pushing someone off a cliff right now? When he said he'd want Randa lynched after his death it made sense, but now I'm not sure what Mancer even wants. If it's a Randa flip, he hasn't torn through Randa's posts to show us Randa is scum. He's just been collecting scumreads on people aimlessly. Every time he posts about finding someone scummy I feel like it's because he's obliged to do so. Reading Mancer's ISO is toxic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BT. Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 still don`t agree with Prims wagon; don`t see how he hasn`t been proactive. He started the J wagon and kept on it and kept backing his stance up when J came back and started refuting it. Yeah he hasn`t done that so much for Mancer but it`s not like people don`t understand the Mancer case. I think it comes down to how I'm generally unimpressed. Unimpressed by the J suspicion, unimpressed by his coverage of anyone else, unimpressed with his reads too? Maybe. Unimpressed by his jabs at other player which haven't really been helpful? This is all memory works. I'm also operating under the assumption that I'm competent at reading town!Prims, so when I don't like what I see it's usually because it's scum!Prims. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Refa Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 SB/BT (SBT?), what do you think of this (Prims) post? I thought this did a pretty good job of refuting the arguments against him (which beforehand I was fully willing to sheep), and I don't remember either of you addressing it (if you actually did, then well, uh...I blame BBM). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SB. Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 I took it into account in my last post about him, I just view it differently to you, basically. After rechecking Adventures myself I'm actual more inclined to go for Mancer's lynch considering the similarities in his play (defensiveness, generally attacking everyone he gets the chance to, stuff like that) but I think voting him puts him at L-1. If anything else lynching him removes a huge question mark in later day phases, so meh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BT. Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 SB/BT (SBT?), what do you think of this (Prims) post? I thought this did a pretty good job of refuting the arguments against him (which beforehand I was fully willing to sheep), and I don't remember either of you addressing it (if you actually did, then well, uh...I blame BBM). I've addressed it in a bunch of roundabout ways but sure, I'll bring the microscope. RE: Gorf: my problem with J isn't "not posting about something that's relevant", it's him finding something relevant, stating he did so and then doing nothing about it. I've said this 1000 times but town!J should be looking into Randa/Refa if they're odd to him but he just lets it go. This isn't lazy but actually scummy for a vet to do. Comparatively, Mancer is scumhunting. It's not just a case of "J was too busy" because he was posting about problems he had but not doing anything about them. The problem here is that Prims is talking about, what, three J posts? Why is Prims taking this post-RVS passiveness so seriously? Gorf agrees that it's not an issue and I agree with Gorf. But look at how much weight it's being given here. RE: BT: There were definitely examples of J "not liking a bunch of things/finding them odd" that he could have found himself by going through his own posts. If this was like the middle of Day 2 I'd be more willing to see this as town frustration but there's not a very big sample size so it's just nitpicking at how I presented the case. Also disliked him bringing Randa disagreeing with me into his case for support, it's propping up his case with something ultimately irrelevant and if we're going to assume Randa not agreeing with me makes my case worse then you'd think BBM agreeing with me would make me more reasonable. But BBM just doesn't exist to him in his post, even though BBM is agreeing with a case that J seems to consider falsified. I told Prims I think J's saying that what he's suspected of can't be found in his posts. Like, that's the point. I don't think it's "nitpicking". And when I read the case the first time I found no fault in bringing up the Randa thing. I don't think these points are actually relevant. Let's say BBM is less relevant to J. Why does that make J scum? I don't see how it's a mark against his case. Also I can't tell why Mancer is town to you. It's not really hard for scum to post a sob story and also if he's mafia he'd probably have a fakeclaim in mind as well. imo people going on about Mancer being badtown are just WIFOMing themselves, meta research says overdramatics in response to being called out can indeed be scum!Mancer (lol pokemon adventures was a game that happened), so yeah it's scummy sorry. tbh I'm probably just going to be on him by the end of the day since there's not much interest in lynching J at this point. I don't like that all Prims does here is try and open up the Mancer option for me. I have a slightly different perspective now, but I still think it's a bit manipulative to just shut down the Mancer defense like this. Yeah it's scummy, but I did say I found town motivation in his suspects (back then), so why won't Prims look into it more instead of redundantly saying "it's scummy sorry"? agree most active posters here are town, though with BBM/BT on the nuller side. SB isn't going hard enough to be scum!SB and I don't think I'd support the Randa wagon ever. I still think Elie is scummy too but none of my scumreads are actively posting. This post ended up being a dumb train of consciousness post, whoops. Not very insightful stuff. And that's it. It's not really train of consciousness because that's usually imply you're talking freely about your suspects, not talking freely about responses to people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rapier Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Okay, enough reading, this is too much for a mere mortal like me. From what I managed to read (I stopped on page 11), both J and Mancer look bad. The former nitpicks on Prims' argument, saying that he is being vague (not really, he just didn't bother quoting his posts to show that he was being vague, is all. Just by ISOing him we can see this is the case), and uses this as a defense. Okay, this is not inherently scummy even though this rhetoric is very evasive and useful for scum, but his tone certainly was, when he labelled Prims as scum trying to "use everything you possibly can scrounge [McDuck. Duck Tales is so fun!] as a reason to join my wagon and also paint me in an overtly negative light." This overreaction plus his lack of content other than what I just sumed makes me feel safe for lynching him. It is also worth to mention that he only bothered to read the players who voted him, which seems like selective scumhunting at best. "The prosecution rests, Your Honor". -- Now, it's time to dissect Mancer (run mancer run he's mad!). His overall gameplay has been the same as always: Firing machinegun shots in the form of questions and arguments until one hits scum. I really don't like his case on Randa because he was voting him over alignment spec, which is a dumb thing to discuss on D1 imo and even worse to lynch someone over it, and I don't like his case on me because he's blaming me for something that can't be judged as true or false in the present, since it depends on what I'd do in the future (votepark on Randa and see if it will be profitable later on). Again, my problem is with his tone, not with his cases (which are bad, but not inherently scummy imo). "Go after Randa after I flip [town] please" looks very bad and implies that Mancer himself is town. I'd rather lynch J over Mancer since the former is producing zero contents while the latter is at least producing something, but iirc we have around 15 hours left and a J lynch seems more unlikely. ##Vote: HBC J Voting Mister Jay anyway, since he's the best choice. If it becomes impossible to lynch him, then I'll switch to Mancer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#HBC Larsa Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 I'm gonna say this and don't judge me for it, but I have a bias with settling for a lynch on J today. J can be one of the best mafia players I've ever played with, rn I'm def not seeing it. But if he comes back in and turns it up...I'm wiling to give him that shot. I don't see anything inherently wrong with him other than people claiming evasiveness, which I don't really see either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rapier Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Prims argued that he was being too passive-aggressive and refusing to actively scumhunt. Jay countered with evasive rhetoric, saying that Prims was being too vague (Prims just didn't quote the times where J was passive-aggressive, is all), that it was all made up by him and that he wanted to intentionally portray him in a negative light. Don't like his answer at all, nor his lack of content. Are the players who voted him the only ones worthwhile of reading? Because he was pretty quick to judge the wagon on him as scummy and then focus his attention on them. Also I just noticed how Mancer is acting so adamantly toward his reads, like how he says he is pretty positive that BBM is scum, or how he's pretty positive that there are scum on his wagon (who, and why?), or how he's positive that Randa is scum. He shows confidence on them and pushes them until he finds another potential wagon to hop on. I'm seeing a pattern over here... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flamy Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 (edited) Before I forget... ##Vote: MancerNecro Edited November 1, 2014 by ScarletFlame Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rapier Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 I don't ever remember you saying anything about Mancer or this game, ScarletFlame. Your thoughts on it, please? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted November 1, 2014 Author Share Posted November 1, 2014 (edited) The "clipsey shamelessly stole this from Kaoz" votals! Mancer (6): Randa, BBM, #HBC Gorf, #HBC Larsa, Prims, ScarletFlame Prims (4): #HBC J, BT., SB BBM (1): Mancer Randa (1): Poly #HBC J (1): Rapier Not voting: Shinori, Refa, Elieson Day 1 ends in a little under nine hours. There's a slight chance that I'll be out come phase end time. Please stop posting regardless - I'll get to the thread as soon as possible! If I am missing your vote, says something! Edited November 1, 2014 by eclipse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BT. Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Just making sure the Mancer wagon has 6 votes not 5. I'll be back in 7 hours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Refa Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 I'll be back in a few hours myself. I've got like other things to do and stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted November 1, 2014 Author Share Posted November 1, 2014 Check and check, thanks~! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randa Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Okay I have access to my ipad now so I can bang out a couple post but I won't be iso'ng people till I can get on my laptop. But before I actually start reading through what's happened I have a couple quick questions for scarlet flame. Before I forget...##Vote: MancerNecro1. Why mancer instead literally anybody else?2. What are you thoughts on literally anybody in this game? 3. Why did you not exist until, what I guess was a mod warning? 4. Not really a question but please do not edit posts it can result in a Modkill in NOC games. Okay time to get to work on the rest of the thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prims Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 so instead of seriously considering lynching me can we just hammer mancer j is, actually, still scum btw. good to know Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randa Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 so instead of seriously considering lynching me can we just hammer mancerj is, actually, still scum btw. good to know I vote no to hammer as we only need 1/3 to lynch(which we've already achieved), and I'd rather post about recent content before phase end as its kinda likely I'll be the night kill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prims Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 like i could argue this out but everybody wants to lynch mancer anyway. bt wrote an entire post about how scummy mancer is but he's on record saying mancer and i don't make sense as buddies. "?_?" - bt even though rapier is voting j i don't really want to try and push that again, mancer's scum too and there's just not enough interest to get j lynched today and not tomorrow, sorry dude Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randa Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Can we just wait until I make my post then. Also please nobody vote mancer until I post because there's a good chance he would just quick hammer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prims Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 i am so confused where do you guys get all these new players who pop up late in the day to vote the biggest wagon and then flake Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prims Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 i am not serious about wanting to quickhammer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randa Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 I think this one has something to do with elidon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randa Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 i am not serious about wanting to quickhammer. Also sorry I didn't clarify I was talking about mancer self hammering. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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