PAIRINGS The Pairing Thread

[Radiant head]

I assumed Yarne would be a Berserker if he was hard support.

So yeah it doesn't matter. Hit+20 renders all the breakers, quick burn, tantivy, etc. unnecessary and you might as well get AS+2 instead of Str+2. Deliverer isn't useful on hard support.

[TheSilentChloey]

What's a good ending class for Stahl!Kjelle? (I am not playing apo but I can do grinding without too much problem) I am thinking of following the suggestion that she be a paladin but I wanted to know if there were other sets that help her.

Also who is the better father option for Severa in terms of stats and classes, Gregor or Gaius? (I am looking at hair colour as well as the overall performance of Gregor!Severa and Gaius!Severa)

[Radiant head]

Stah!Kjelle can't really do much, but Deliverer Sniper is probably what I would try running.

Gregor!Severa is better because Gaius wastes the Pegasus Knight line, which is way worse than Gregor wasting the Mercenary line. He can also pass down Axefaire for Hero.

Edited December 9, 2015 by Radiant head

[Oceanbourne]

Gaius' Galeforce pass is redundant, although so are Gregor's regular skills if he just stays in his class. Gaius can pass down Locktouch/Acrobat/Lucky Seven/Movement +1 for a more utility Severa but Gregor's more stats: Barbarian is male only though so Despoil/Axefaire can go down to her.

I have been wondering the same thing since I am also trying to get Severa to her mother's hair color and I think Gregor's is closer

[Radiant head]

Might want to consider Ricken if you care about the hair thing. She can run Armsthrift Sniper, Bowfaire Bow Knight or Tomefaire Dark Flier. And Luna is there if you don't like Vengeance as a proc.

[TheSilentChloey]

Might want to consider Ricken if you care about the hair thing. She can run Armsthrift Sniper, Bowfaire Bow Knight or Tomefaire Dark Flier. And Luna is there if you don't like Vengeance as a proc.

That is one to consider if I do another run. I was leaning towards Gregor!Severa for this current playthrough and I think I might go with either Donnel!Nah or Gaius!Nah. I am thinking of doing Henry!Noire because white haired Noire is awesome...

[Zog58]

Just beat Chapter 4 on my nogrind lunatic file, and I've been pairing Stahl and Miriel to get a Sorceror Laurent with Luna and Vantage. I thought this pairing was appealing, as it was easy for Stahl to pass Luna and Vantage will help Laurent tank well later. However, then I read about Kellam!Laurent, who has more magic and res, less speed, and could trade vantage for Renewal and Pavise, the latter of which is probably more useful than Aegis for him I'm sure. Kellam has just as easy access to Luna as Stahl (just pop a master seal and gain 4 levels) and they support fast too, but is having Vantage more important than these other points for a nostank? I can always restart if so, I actually find the first few Chapters of vanilla Lunatic to be rather easy after playing them over and over (or I'm just used to them). Any feedback on this?

[Radiant head]

I don't think it's worth restarting. The only benefit I can see here is that Laurent can take a crap father that no one wants and still be good, while Stahl is really in demand. Gregor!Laurent might be worth a restart because he also gets Armsthrift and Sol, but if you're not doing that, and you aren't tempted to put Stahl somewhere else, than this should be fine.

[Lucina's Husband]

Would it be possible to do an all magic-users run of Apotheosis? Gerome and Yarne look like they might be a little hard to find parents for, but on the bright side, I can leave Nah unpaired, undeployed, and unfathered if need be. What about the rest? If I did Female Robin, I guess I could marry Laurent and pair Male Morgan with Lucina for maximum magic blasting haha!

Aversa or Emmeryn! Morgan @Valkyrie X Libra! Owain @Sage

Ricken! Severa @Dark Flier X Virion! Inigo @Sage

Chrom! Cynthia @Dark Flier X Gregor Laurent @Sage

Sumia! Lucina @Dark Flier X Lon'qu! Brady @Sage

[Bunselpower]

In a challenge run, are berserkers still typically used for support? Say you were doing a no lb run. Is berserker (assuming hexathema or hit+20) still the support of choice or is the lack of skill too much without lb help? Also, just as a theoretical, are classes like wyvern Lord and other low base speed classes used?

[Czar_Yoshi]

Just beat Chapter 4 on my nogrind lunatic file, and I've been pairing Stahl and Miriel to get a Sorceror Laurent with Luna and Vantage. I thought this pairing was appealing, as it was easy for Stahl to pass Luna and Vantage will help Laurent tank well later. However, then I read about Kellam!Laurent, who has more magic and res, less speed, and could trade vantage for Renewal and Pavise, the latter of which is probably more useful than Aegis for him I'm sure. Kellam has just as easy access to Luna as Stahl (just pop a master seal and gain 4 levels) and they support fast too, but is having Vantage more important than these other points for a nostank? I can always restart if so, I actually find the first few Chapters of vanilla Lunatic to be rather easy after playing them over and over (or I'm just used to them). Any feedback on this?

Luna, Renewal and Pavise? How's he gonna get that and have time left to use it? I mean, I guess you could pass Renewal from Miriel with enough staff abuse, but General 15 is a lot of levels, a lot of E weapons and a very low class Mag growth. Sounds like way more trouble than it's worth, especially since Nos only heals you when you're weak enough to take damage and strong enough to deal it.

Just use Gregor!Laurent, pass down AT (and Tomefaire or DSp+, depending on which way you go) and get to DM immediately if you really want to Nostank. He's way better than either of those. Probably no need to restart unless you didn't train Miriel in Cht.3 or something, and even then that's far from a game over.

Would it be possible to do an all magic-users run of Apotheosis?

You can. It's really monotonous and I don't recommend it.

If you want to anyway, Gerome already comes with Sage so he's mostly set (Henry for mods, maybe). Give Yarne Ricken, Severa Virion, Inigo Libra and Owain Stahl- you'll get your magic Yarne that way, and the rest of your team will stay strong (Hit+20 Yarne and a proc for Inigo). Try to set it up so you can switch your classes later to reuse the pairs for something else, so you don't spend all the grinding for just one run.

In a challenge run, are berserkers still typically used for support? Say you were doing a no lb run. Is berserker (assuming hexathema or hit+20) still the support of choice or is the lack of skill too much without lb help? Also, just as a theoretical, are classes like wyvern Lord and other low base speed classes used?

They're very important, much moreso than without restrictions, but you'll want to do Hit calcs on a case-by-case basis, rely more on Breakers and avoid making assumptions.

Wyverns sometimes are, but it becomes an active sacrifice of Spd/Skl in exchange for the high Mov/Str (and sometimes Def) instead of the best-of-both-worlds scenario it is with everything on the table. Like everything else, they're good if you're careful with them and a liability otherwise.

[Bunselpower]

Ok that is a perfect answer, exactly what I needed, thanks.

[TheSilentChloey]

So Donnel!Nah or Gaius!Nah, again like with Severa who gives the better classes and stats? (I am thinking of leaving Nah as a Manakete, but I might not depending on how I go)

[Radiant head]

neither are that good, so just pick which ever you want.

gaius passes thief/myrmidon, and can pass something from fighter, and donnel passes mercenary, and a skill from either fighter or villager.

[Zog58]

Luna, Renewal and Pavise? How's he gonna get that and have time left to use it? I mean, I guess you could pass Renewal from Miriel with enough staff abuse, but General 15 is a lot of levels, a lot of E weapons and a very low class Mag growth. Sounds like way more trouble than it's worth, especially since Nos only heals you when you're weak enough to take damage and strong enough to deal it.

Just use Gregor!Laurent, pass down AT (and Tomefaire or DSp+, depending on which way you go) and get to DM immediately if you really want to Nostank. He's way better than either of those. Probably no need to restart unless you didn't train Miriel in Cht.3 or something, and even then that's far from a game over.

In regards to those skills, I mean to grind postgame via DLC and skirmishes before Apotheosis. That is what renewal/pavise are for. I planned to pass luna and tomefaire from stahl and miriel and hop to drk mage, but when I saw the Kellam mods and classes, which are better than Stahl bar Vantage, I planned to go that way instead. Gregor is an option, but Luna is so much better than Sol for Apo, and I was just going to stack Laurent with Wastes, Gales, and Nosferatus anyway. Paired with that Valkyrie Morgan, hell be faster and can sponge only when needed, which is the plan. My frontliner will be my Freddy!Inigo, not as much Laurent. I essentially plan to have Morgan kill with GForce and swap so Laurent can protect them better with Nosferatu. Is that a resonable Apotheosis pair up strategy?

[Shadow Mir]

In regards to those skills, I mean to grind postgame via DLC and skirmishes before Apotheosis. That is what renewal/pavise are for. I planned to pass luna and tomefaire from stahl and miriel and hop to drk mage, but when I saw the Kellam mods and classes, which are better than Stahl bar Vantage, I planned to go that way instead. Gregor is an option, but Luna is so much better than Sol for Apo, and I was just going to stack Laurent with Wastes, Gales, and Nosferatus anyway. Paired with that Valkyrie Morgan, hell be faster and can sponge only when needed, which is the plan. My frontliner will be my Freddy!Inigo, not as much Laurent. I essentially plan to have Morgan kill with GForce and swap so Laurent can protect them better with Nosferatu. Is that a resonable Apotheosis pair up strategy?

I'd say not really - Nosferatu tanking isn't too good in Apo, for one.

[Zog58]

I'd say not really - Nosferatu tanking isn't too good in Apo, for one.

I've read that several times, and I assume that is due to the abundance of Aegis+ and Dragonskin enemies? Regardless, would Laurent still function well as a Sorceror due to Waste and Gales with Luna there? His defenses as Sorcerer aren't awful and he certainly shouldn't get attacked often if I play right. I guess there is Mire too but even though I've only ever watched Apo videos, I know that damage would be pretty meh, with Olivia dance support or no. I know people are saying that armsthrift is extremely valuable to keep all your weapons from going poof with so many enemies, but is it a NECESSITY? Can Luna ever outweigh it? That is my other big question here, really.

[Shadow Mir]

I've read that several times, and I assume that is due to the abundance of Aegis+ and Dragonskin enemies? Regardless, would Laurent still function well as a Sorceror due to Waste and Gales with Luna there? His defenses as Sorcerer aren't awful and he certainly shouldn't get attacked often if I play right. I guess there is Mire too but even though I've only ever watched Apo videos, I know that damage would be pretty meh, with Olivia dance support or no. I know people are saying that armsthrift is extremely valuable to keep all your weapons from going poof with so many enemies, but is it a NECESSITY? Can Luna ever outweigh it? That is my other big question here, really.

Ayup. As to the second question, I wouldn't bother with Waste - it's too inaccurate. What's more, Sorcerers, for the most part, are outclassed by Sages in Apo, or so I've heard.

[Zog58]

Ayup. As to the second question, I wouldn't bother with Waste - it's too inaccurate. What's more, Sorcerers, for the most part, are outclassed by Sages in Apo, or so I've heard.

Ah well, that isn't too much of a problem then. He can just be a Sage for Apo and switch back to Sorcerer after, no problem (which means he will definitely be acting as support fodder for Valkyrie or Sage Morgan with DG+ and possibly Support +, who will hit hard and be rescued to safety.) Thank you!

[Vascela]

Sorcerers are outclassed by Sages, but if you don't have Sage, it's still a strong option. It's not like they're obligated to use Waste either, but in the instance they have archer tree with a hexnathema support (assuming they aren't running those auras), it's still a viable option.

[Czar_Yoshi]

In regards to those skills, I mean to grind postgame via DLC and skirmishes before Apotheosis. That is what renewal/pavise are for.

Renewal/Pavise are already really bad in Apo, but Laurent shouldn't even be coming up front there (he has Agg, when both units in a pairup have Braves the rear unit gets to attack twice as many times, thus twice the Agg boost from being in back, thus he should always be in back since he can't contribute nearly enough up front to make up for that), so they won't actually do anything. Same goes for Luna/Sol, he can have them or not but he won't ever use them.

Apo Laurent usually wants to be a hard support Sage, and if his mods are right (Gregor or Stahl), hard support Berserker is also useful. He just runs a bunch of flat +Damage/Hit skills, most of which he comes with at base, so don't worry about passing him anything other than good mods for Apo.

Unless you mean using them only while grinding for Apo, in which case sure, go ahead. But Sol will still be better than Luna for that, and I usually load my grinding teams out with money skills instead.

Edited December 10, 2015 by Czar_Yoshi

[TheSilentChloey]

neither are that good, so just pick which ever you want.

gaius passes thief/myrmidon, and can pass something from fighter, and donnel passes mercenary, and a skill from either fighter or villager.

Merc is not the only thing that Donnel passes down you know. I had a look and he passes down the Troubadour line as well (which Gaius does not). I am still not sure as to whom (I could go Gregor!Nah because Nowi supports raise quicker with him) and have someone else do Severa (once I work out who is left to pair with Cordy). Lon'qu is going to be for Owain in my F!Mu playthorugh that I am of course sharing. Of course if I do use Gregor for Nah, and Lon'qu is busy with Lissa, who would be the next best father for Severa?

[Czar_Yoshi]

Lon'qu is going to be for Owain in my F!Mu playthorugh that I am of course sharing. Of course if I do use Gregor for Nah, and Lon'qu is busy with Lissa, who would be the next best father for Severa?

How about Virion?

[Ezrius]

Always a personal favorite. In addition to the stats, breakers, Bowfaire, Tomefaire (though usually I make her physical), and Wyvern Lord, it gives Severa Virion's hair. The blue hair and yellow outfits always made me think of Noriko Ashida, AKA Surge, who has sadly fallen into obscurity in the past decade along with the rest of the New X-Men. Sorry if that was off topic, my mind just goes there every time I see Virion!Severa, and to me it's not a bad thing.

Edited December 10, 2015 by Ezrius

[Bunselpower]

How about Virion?

Not that my opinion bears much weight, but I second Virion big time. He gives her the speed and skill she wants, wyvern just like lon'qu, tome faire should you want it, and the sniper line. It really opens up a lot of avenues for her, and let's lon'qu send his speed and Astra to someone who really needs it, like Brady.