Legendary Hero: Alm - Saint King

[Ice Dragon]

5 minutes ago, Nanima said:

Hardly. Infantry bows have been in a very rough spot for a while now.

But Alm's existence doesn't make it any worse for them. They suck just as much as before, but not any more than before.

Alm is an actually viable unit in a class that has had a lot of trouble being viable, and I find that to be a good thing.

 

10 minutes ago, Nanima said:

So instead of doing what Intsys sometimes does with other unit types ( Release neat inheritable weapons/skills or other such things), they are presenting Balm to us as a "solution". An overpowered unit with an exclusive weapon. "All the archer you could ever need" as it were.

No, they are not.

Alm is not a solution for anything and wasn't designed as such. Alm is designed as a standalone viable character.

You can't add "neat inheritable weapons" on Legendary Heroes in the first place, and giving them inheritable skills that are too specific to a certain unit type detracts from his value. There was never any place for Alm to exist as a "fix" to colorless infantry bows because he simply cannot be made with the tools needed to fix the class.

Fixing a class should be left to non-Legendary/Mythic banners where these restrictions do not apply.

[Cute Chao]

I admit, even though I knew the red spots were taken up, I was surprised to see the colourless bow symbol. I thought IS had forgotten they can do colourless bows outside of free units xD

My Reyson is nearly maxed on HM so Leanne would be useful. I still dislike Eirika but a staff armour wouldn't be awful to have in a pinch. Really want Alm and wouldn't mind a pitybreaker Roy or Marth if no colourless. No one else interests me on the banner .. although going for colourless does mean I have another shot at pulling Legault too :)

[Nanima]

3 minutes ago, Ice Dragon said:

Fixing a class should be left to non-Legendary/Mythic banners where these restrictions do not apply.

They haven't bothered to do that. The class has been in dire straits since late 2017 and they've never done anything about that. Releasing new shiny units is their solution to them. And yes, Alm couldn't ever have been an actual fix, but his apperance before even any attempt to elevate the rest of his class, is pretty much a slap in the face to anyone still struggling to use the other infantry archers. He makes things worse through the way he shines another light on just how bad things are by just being that much better. And no, that doesn't endear him to me at all (or Intsys for that matter). 

[Sasori]

Thats odd. I could have sworn IS had completely forgotten about Alm.

but its good to see him get a legendary. His stats look great and I believe he’s the first infantry archer since Nina?

hopefully he brings in some dumb puns.

[daisy jane]

Alm vs. Lion King...
i wonder who wins...

[Ice Dragon]

12 minutes ago, Nanima said:

They haven't bothered to do that. The class has been in dire straits since late 2017 and they've never done anything about that. Releasing new shiny units is their solution to them.

Yes, they have bothered to try fixing the class. Their attempts so far have simply been largely unsuccessful, but that's not at all for lack of trying.

Shining Bow was their first attempt at creating an inheritable weapon that counter-acts the high Def that common bulky units have. Unfortunately, it doesn't have a large enough effect and also fails to work on units that are bulky on both sides.

Other skills that have been released more recently with direct benefit to bows have been Death Blow 4, Sturdy Impact, Fury 4, Null Follow-Up, Chill Def, and Sorcery Blade, but each has had the drawback that they are extremely hard to obtain.

Finally, we've recently gotten brand new weapons for Niles and Klein, though Niles is still horribly outclassed simply because his stat spread is extremely poor.

Edited April 26, 2019 by Ice Dragon

[Nanima]

1 minute ago, Ice Dragon said:

Yes, they have bothered to try fixing the class. Their attempts so far have simply been largely unsuccessful, but that's not at all for lack of trying.

Really? They watered down the Shining Bow so much from what it was in Fates that I could basically hear them thinkin "We can't actually make it strong. Think of the armour meta". Because keeping armours as the highest meta does seem to be their priority here.

And all those skills you listed may be useful for archers, but I doubt Intsys created them with the idea to fix that specific class when those skills are amazing on almost anyone.

The refines are nice, but they also don't help the class in general. Especially when you look at many of the other bow refines, like the absolute joke of a skillset they put on the Fuujin Yumi.

So no, I don't feel very moved to give them any credit for their half-heartedly implemented, mediocre handouts.

[Zangetsu]

So can I start hating on Alm now or do I have to wait for 3 more alts to be validate?

 

46 minutes ago, Lau said:

Alm! He looks really good. I was expecting him to be a red bow, but colourless is fine.

I'll be pulling red and colourless. I still need Legendary Roy, I really want Alm, and more Legendary Marth merges are nice.

How many do you have so far?

[Ice Dragon]

11 minutes ago, Nanima said:

Really? They watered down the Shining Bow so much from what it was in Fates that I could basically hear them thinkin "We can't actually make it strong. Think of the armour meta". Because keeping armours as the highest meta does seem to be their priority here.

It literally has the exact same effect as Light Brand, which is the only other magic physical weapon in the game right now.

 

14 minutes ago, Nanima said:

And all those skills you listed may be useful for archers, but I doubt Intsys created them with the idea to fix that specific class when those skills are amazing on almost anyone.

That doesn't change the fact that several of those, namely Sturdy Impact and Fury 4, have a larger effect on ranged units than melee ones due to their stat spreads.

 

17 minutes ago, Nanima said:

The refines are nice, but they also don't help the class in general. Especially when you look at many of the other bow refines, like the absolute joke of a skillset they put on the Fuujin Yumi.

Fujin Yumi was literally in the first wave of refines where they were clearly still testing the waters with the new functionality. Trying to fault them for trying by citing Fujin Yumi is as invalid as trying to fault them for trying to make melee infantry good by citing Arthur's marked mediocrity while completely ignoring all of the things they've done in the meantime.

Since then, we've gotten refines for Parthia, Nidhogg, Niles's Bow, Argent Bow, all of which are spectacular weapons, even if some of them are niche.

 

You're basically just saying, "I don't think they're trying hard enough, so I'm not going to give them credit for trying at all," which to me sounds rather juvenile.

[Kiran_]

Finally!!! Alm with good art!! Haha. I'm excited I've been waiting, he look really amazing!

Darting Blow 4 is great. His weapon is amazing. I'm vey pleased, I can complete a SoV team now (assuming I get L!Alm). Alm, Kliff, Gray, Boey. All the colors. Excited to have another good colorless after Eir!

[KMT4ever]

Alm himself is no surprise, although his colorless status is. As for his stat spread and skillset, they're completely bonkers as people have been saying. 49 Speed on the offense at neutral, never mind with an asset or any outside buffs. An automatic Moonbow (albeit slightly weaker) and a seriously powerful, quick-charging special means he's even going to be punching through high-defense units like paper. For the banner as a whole:

• Red: I've got Ike and Roy, but the former needs merges for all of the work I put him through and the latter is -Spd, which is massively awful. Marth is Marth, so he's definitely on my wanted list. Definitely going for this color.
• Blue: My Fjorm is already +2, so she's fine on that front. I don't really care about Nailah or W!Ephraim, so pass here.
• Green: I've got Sue+1 with +Atk, so she's perfectly fine already. L!Hector is somebody I can go without. W!Fae could use a merge to get rid of her Defense flaw, but if she's the only one here that I want, it's not worth the risk.
• Grey: Alm himself is obviously amazing, and I could really use W!Eirika for armor teams. Leanne is meh, but I wouldn't mind getting her. Yes to this.

I think I'm going to snipe reds and greys, although for how long I don't know.

[Punished Dayni]

That's the Alm. Man I wish he'd gotten an alt in the last two years.

He's the earth Pair-up and an Infantry Colourless Bow (I mean, Blue and Green have legendaries, Colourless has 3 total and Red would overlap with the sword) and comes with Luna Arc (Spd +3, deals +25% of foe's Def on top of the damage he'd deal), Lunar Flash (Reduces Enemy's Def/Res by 20% and adds 20% of his speed to damage. Think it's inheritable.), Darting Blow 4 (To match Celica I see. :P, it's also +9), Full Follow-up 3 and Odd Atk Wave. I will say he's kind of worth it as fodder, considering Null Followup and DaB4 can both be inherited now, need to see his stats to make a good call. 

As for the others, Red has eL Roy, L!Ike and HK!Marth, where I have two but that Boi's there and well crap I'm still temped to pull Red, Blue has Fjorm, Ephraimas and Nailah, where I'd love to get Nailah bit don't really care about the other two, Green has L!Hector, Faemas and Sue, which while I don't want Sue I would like the other two a lot more and Colourless has Leanne and Eirimas, where I have her but a merge could be good/fodder and Leanne is a unit I don't have.

So, this time around I think it's Colourless > Green > Red > Blue. 1. Colourless is first. Weird. 2. Why does every colour have a unit I wish wasn't there?

[Baldrick]

1 hour ago, Nanima said:

So instead of doing what Intsys sometimes does with other unit types ( Release neat inheritable weapons/skills or other such things)

Examples? Recently there’s the Short Bow which is pretty solid for an inheritable weapon. Most skills aren’t weapon specific, either.

As far as the meta goes, class balance is concerned with units, not characters. Not everyone’s favourites can be top tier all the time.

[Sunwoo]

No offense Nanima, but it just comes off as you being upset about Takumi getting further invalidated more than actually being upset about archers. Shrug.

To which I think IS should probably address some of their older characters, as I am sure a good portion of their fanbase wants to play with the characters they like rather than just going for the "new shiny thing", but IS hasn't been listening to anything lately, really.

[XRay]

4 hours ago, Fire Emblem Fan said:

I really think literally every other bow unit in the game NEEDS a serious boost, whether it be a permanent stat raise or a weapon refine or SOMETHING.

I do not think so. I think they are currently fine as is. They might be outclassed by SK!Alm, but they can still perform their current jobs well. I run Firesweep BH!Lyn for Aether Raids and she is doing fine in her role. For PvE content, I use Firesweep ASS!Takumi and he is perfectly fine in Infernal with only merge +1, and he is still often times serviceable in Abyssal with Brave Bow. The only improvement Firesweep archers may want is Null Distant/Close Counter, but Null C-Disrupt is not so common to the point where Null D/C Counter is necessary yet.

Brave archers have issues dealing with armor units, but that is what Blade mages are for.

2 hours ago, Nanima said:

Hardly. Infantry bows have been in a very rough spot for a while now. Outside of Brave and Firesweep bow, there really aren't any bows worth using for anything other than niche situations. And even those two bows haven't helped them keep up with the armoured/high def meta. There's a reason archers as a whole slipped down many tiers over time. So instead of doing what Intsys sometimes does with other unit types ( Release neat inheritable weapons/skills or other such things), they are presenting Balm to us as a "solution". An overpowered unit with an exclusive weapon. "All the archer you could ever need" as it were. So yes, we have reason to dislike this blatant powercreep.

Firesweep archers are doing fine as is. Their primary purpose is to take down any Enemy Phase units (besides Null C-Disrupt ones) safely, and they are still able to do that within a reasonable time. Infantry Firesweep archers can also run Special Spiral for a boost to their damage output.

Brave Bow does have damage output issues against Def tanks, but they have always had that issue anyways and it is not limited to infantry. In my opinion, the current Weapon effects distribution for ranged Weapons is pretty reasonable. Archers have a monopoly on Firesweep and mages have a monopoly on Blades (raw damage output).

Edited April 26, 2019 by XRay

[Nanima]

Please forget I wrote anything.

Edited April 26, 2019 by Nanima

[daisy jane]

9 minutes ago, Nanima said:

Fine then. I know I suck and am a terrible adult and person in general.I am such a child it's a miracle I can type correctly.

Thank for ganging up on me along with every single person in my entire fucked up worthless life. haha

(hug)

you don't suck, and you aren't a terrible adult and person, and all of that either. 
you're entitled not to like Alm. you're not the only one, looking in the salt thread in reddit. 

I do get your point  - I don't agree with it (to a point - but to be fair I like Alm) - but as someone who also likes Setsuna and Rebecca it does really push them further down the "ummm" pool. Archers for the most part are getting the shaft. Cordelia has been (until Alm) one of the best - if not the best archer in the game and you can only get her once a year.  Alm at least is once every few months - but if you don't like him yah i can see why this is poop. especially since most archers have yet to have a Prf, Klein being the only one. (for colourless). and as pointed out most people don't like coloured bows. (I do and I like using Lyn + Lucy, it's fun for me though i can see how it can suck for the most part). so hopefully this just means more prfs for Gen 1/Gen 2 archers are on their way (though I simply don't see how they will compete with a 37/37 Archer spread. 

(unless this is an indicator that any archer (infantry at least) - will be at least roughly around Cordelia's level which would also be nice. 
 

 

*4am posting

Niles, and Jeorge have refines too. (I forgot - i just don't use them) lol

Edited April 26, 2019 by daisy jane

[Sunwoo]

5 minutes ago, Nanima said:

Fine then. I know I suck and am a terrible adult and person in general.I am such a child it's a miracle I can type correctly.

Thank for ganging up on me along with every single person in my entire fucked up worthless life. haha

Nobody is saying that.

There's nothing wrong if we're a little petty about things. I think the fact that Alm is your second most hated lord and is sharing a color, weapon, and move type as your favorite character is making you cranky. That's fine. There's no shame in just admitting that if that's how you truly feel instead of saying that "Alm invalidates infantry bows" if that's not the true story.

I don't want to assume because I don't know what your mindset is, but just from where I am standing it sounds like you're more upset about Takumi specifically than the actual class. In which case, that's fine. He's in a bit of an unfortunate situation. But if that really is the case, you'll probably feel better about just saying that.

[redlight]

Niles:

L!Alm: That's how whalebait works

[XRay]

21 minutes ago, Baldrick said:

Recently there’s the Short Bow which is pretty solid for an inheritable weapon.

I would not call Short Bow solid though. In terms of raw damage output, I think Brave Bow is still the best option for archers.

[Humanoid]

I wouldn't mind a re-skin feature where on the client side, you replace any given unit with the sprite and general art of any other unit you own. People fighting you in arena and whatnot would still see the base unit for countering purposes. If I want a +10 Dire Thunder-wielding blue mage cavalry Palla, what of it?

[Nanima]

Sorry for the outburst. I think it's best if I just take a break from this discussion for now. I'm not mad at anyone here, I just think it's best for me to not further engage in a discussion that's bringing out nothing but my personal grievances with some contribution from real life issues.

Thanks for the calm and level-headed responses @daisy jane and @Sunwoo.

[Etrurian emperor]

Nice! A new Alm was long overdue. I'll certainly pull for him but not as eager as usual considering I know a freebie Brave Alm is on the way.

This being a conqueror outfit and focussing on Alm's ties to Rigel does make me fear the dong armor is inevitable for his brave alt. 

[Sunwoo]

2 minutes ago, Etrurian emperor said:

This being a conqueror outfit and focussing on Alm's ties to Rigel does make me fear the dong armor is inevitable for his brave alt. 

Yep.

Edited April 26, 2019 by Sunwoo

[Michelaar]

Really enjoying Alm's art, looking quite good! His set seems simply fantastic and is made to just Nuke everyone so watch out everyone! I'll just do my free wheel since I'm still saving up orbs.