To Become an Elitist [Playlogs FE1-5] [currently playing: Genealogy]

[Shaky Jones]

21 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

I won't lie, I lost half my team to crits and just kept on going. It's dumb. But look, I'm a TF2 player, I'm used to crits being dumb.

We're different kinds of masochists'. 

1 hour ago, gnip said:

Case in point - Roshe being protected by Jeigan, Kain, and Hardin. I actually like how that part of the map plays, with not exactly a choke point, but the possibility to block the path with three units in different configurations depending on where the enemies are.

Archanea has some solid map design despite it's seemingly simple appearance. It's something I praise in FE11, but is obviously still apparent in the original. I'd be willing to call FE1 a solid title for its time if I wasn't so annoyed with the lack of battle windows and crappy convoy menu. Afraid I'm just that petty. Oh well. 

1 hour ago, gnip said:

Hardin's growths are slightly lower than Kain and Abel's, in particular his HP growth, but they're still quite good. Basically the pre-leveled, slightly worse cavalier in case you didn't train the Xmas cavs or got them killed or were just unlucky with their level-ups.

I suppose if you don't give much xp to the christmas cavs, Hardin would stand out more as a great unit given the solid bases and primarily his wpn lvl letting him use the silver sword you get earlier, which just lets him mop the floor with enemies, although Abel and Kain have such high wpn lvl growths that you can easily just reach the threshold. Kaga had a habit of purposely worse units for the sake of the ironman design, but I'm pretty sure this is just Abel and Kain being way too OP for their own good. 

1 hour ago, gnip said:

• Wolf is quite fast, considering the low weight of bows, although his growth is only 20%. Otherwise, his growths are pretty decent - 50% Str being the most important one, and enough WLv growth that he should get to Parthia eventually. On average, he'd get there at Lv.15, so it's not a guarantee, though. He seems... OK, a character with unique qualities, being a high-movement archer, but also not the most amazing stats.
• Zagaro is a worse Wolf, in both bases and growths

Well, he is the leader, being the wolfguard and all that.

A shame that Wolf is so busted in FE11. I like him, but I have to ban him. And then Fe3 only lets me get Roshers. I wanted Vyland dammit!

1 hour ago, gnip said:

Roshe has a 10% Spd growth. Like, his other growths are fine, or at least not the worst, but oof.

Roshe, Darros. Just throw in Bord and you got the whole squad. 

1 hour ago, gnip said:

Vyland has twice of Roshe's Spd growth! Wow! Realistically, though, he's probably the worst cav in the game.

Zamn

1 hour ago, gnip said:

I gushed about Wendell's Spd base already, didn't I? A platotic example of Bases > Growths. Poor Marich.

It's an example of Old > teenager

1 hour ago, gnip said:

Next map, I will hopefully grab a Seraph Robe, as long as I spend a Warp use to save it (and another for the Killing Edge, too, I suppose). If I recall, thieves don't drop the items they get from chests in FE1, do they?

They're like Swiper from Dora. Unlike Dora though, you've come prepared, and have no morals.

1 hour ago, gnip said:

I suppose out of the requested characters, Julian would be the most logical choice, him being a relatively squishy melee fighter.

The boring choice is Marth. The aesthetically consistent choice is Julian (has a robe). The canon choice is Cord.

1 hour ago, gnip said:

As someone familiar with the concept of freedom, my idea was that everybody is free to suggest/request anybody they think would be funny to use, and I am free to ignore anything that would ruin my fun. Like, if three different people would've asked for Machis, Roshe, and Biraku, I'd still have said no to three bad units all falling in the same category of "cavalier with really low speed", all joining basically at the same point of the game.

Freedom?

1 hour ago, gnip said:

Would you look at that. Another Pegasus Knight crit. How nice.

1 hour ago, Saint Rubenio said:

He wasn't hurt by the attack, but it made him trip and fall on his own spikes. A shame.

Fun fact: My profile picture is actually a representation of Gnip's jeigan 5 chapters into his iconic let's play

1 hour ago, gnip said:

Oh, that was Mars dying; thus Jeigan telling him that he must hold on etc.

I guess Mars tripped and when Jeigan tried to catch him, he accidentally impaled Mars with his spikes instead. Tragic.

Fun fact: My profile picture is actually a representation of of Gnip's jeigan 5 days after accidentally killing Marth in the world's worst rescue attempt.

1 hour ago, Saint Rubenio said:

I'm glad we have all come together like this, boys. We did it.

Thanks you guys. Now I can ask for Cord again when the time comes.

[Saint Rubenio]

2 hours ago, gnip said:

Oh, that was Mars dying; thus Jeigan telling him that he must hold on etc.

I guess Mars tripped and when Jeigan tried to catch him, he accidentally impaled Mars with his spikes instead. Tragic.

Canon.

42 minutes ago, Shaky Jones said:

Archanea has some solid map design despite it's seemingly simple appearance. It's something I praise in FE11, but is obviously still apparent in the original. I'd be willing to call FE1 a solid title for its time if I wasn't so annoyed with the lack of battle windows and crappy convoy menu. Afraid I'm just that petty. Oh well. 

I mean, considering all games of that time were like that, you can still say that and mean it.

Edited August 31, 2023 by Saint Rubenio

[Punished Dayni]

2 hours ago, Shaky Jones said:

Shoulda specified.

Still cool to see the arguments for that too.

2 hours ago, Shaky Jones said:

I'd say Boah has a chance to be the potential worst cavalry if we include paladin prepromotes into the equation, but it could easily still be cav Wrys. As I explained earlier, there are merits to cav Merric. At least, more than cav Wrys. Heck, I'd sooner use cav Merric over Roshea. Merric has better bases aside from -1 strength and has more than 10% speed growth. Obviously, Wrys as a cav is just garbage, but at least Wrys has availability. Boah's bases as a paladin are nothing special. 13 speed isn't bad, but everything else is very low for the most part. Even at zero percent growths, Wrys as cav promoted at lvl 10 will mostly retain the same stats, with 7 strength and 22 HP, similar res and skl. Really, you'd be trading some speed for the pure availability aspect that allows you to obtain weapon rank dependent on your dedication. Are you really going to value Boah's non trained bases when there's way more better alternatives, and you're just way better off using sage boah or even sniper Boah? If I was forced to choose between the two, I personally think I'd have a better chance with Wrys.

Both have similarly bad growths, but Wrys has slightly higher growths, which could push him past Boah near the end. I don't think any other unit will have problems as bad as these 2. Maybe I'm undervaluing 13 speed, but Wendell has 14 (i think) at such an earlier chapter with time to gain weapon rank and as a wyvern/sniper, he can gain more speed. Not likely, but possible. He's an A or S tier unit, but Boah, while decent enough as a bishop with rank, doesn't offer quite as much given his jointime, despite the admittedly similar bases. Wrys could be a better paladin soley from luck growth. Wendell's biggest flaw as a physical class is his abysmal luck, so I often reclass to sniper past the early game for long term use of his speed, and he has a not so bad 30% spd growth.

I mean maybe Maria is worse, but I don't really want to get into the nitty griddy of whatever growths Maria could get in any given class before being allowed to transition into a paladin, and saying paladin elice seems unfair. 

All good observations, RIP Boah I guess.

2 hours ago, Shaky Jones said:

4 STR with 25% spd growth. Wow. (I'm assuming SM is sword master). Not only would he fail to double anyone at H5 (most earlygame speed is 9), but he'd barely damage anyone with an iron sword and you really need to hope for good early game str growths for not being weighed down by when you eventually get steel swords. Doesn't help that Fe11 is just cruel to SM's in general. 80% of the time, your sword rank bonuses will be negated by the 5000 enemy cavs and knights, and dracos. Honestly, he's better off as a mage. 

RIP Roches.

Also a fair point, the SM doesn't do well in SD at all, so it doesn't help him out either.

2 hours ago, gnip said:

• Roshe has a 10% Spd growth. Like, his other growths are fine, or at least not the worst, but oof.
• Vyland has twice of Roshe's Spd growth! Wow! Realistically, though, he's probably the worst cav in the game.

 And this is why we're pushing them.

2 hours ago, gnip said:

Next map, I will hopefully grab a Seraph Robe, as long as I spend a Warp use to save it (and another for the Killing Edge, too, I suppose). If I recall, thieves don't drop the items they get from chests in FE1, do they?

This also means that everybody can make an argument why it shouldn't be Sheeda eating the Seraph Robe. I suppose out of the requested characters, Julian would be the most logical choice, him being a relatively squishy melee fighter.

I'll say the boring option of Julian, just because I expect Marth to get levels and HP.

Also I like best cleric and her boy toy.

2 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

I'm glad we have all come together like this, boys. We did it.

The bad cav relay is set.

Glorious.

2 hours ago, gnip said:

I guess Mars tripped and when Jeigan tried to catch him, he accidentally impaled Mars with his spikes instead. Tragic.

The purple spikes are so because they're really red units in disguise on the blue Jeigan.

[Shaky Jones]

13 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

I mean, considering all games of that time were like that, you can still say that and mean it.

Some games age better than others. I wouldnt have the biggest reason to play the original Mario, but I could and it plays fine enough. Zelda 1 can be a fun time when you don't need a guide for throwing bonbs at the most random tiles to proceed, but I think the core engine is still playable today even. FE1 just really pushes it with needing a manuel to see weapon stats and the clicking and confirmation that comes with an srpg being really difficult to tolerate given the NES limits.

But I should've said that I do mean that FE1 is quite respectable for pushing boundaries with the unique ganeplay structure at such an early age for gaming, and my obvious bias for strategy games makes me find fire emblem way more articulate to construct over something like adventure or platforming. I mean thats gotta be like 90% of the NES library. There wasn't much to compare FE to. If I grew up with the NES, I like to think I woulda loved FE1. But now its a lot more therapeutic to just trash on le archaic cuz of how I could've spent that time playing doing my 13th Darros run. That and forced crits is just objectively horrid game design.

3 minutes ago, Punished Dayni said:

good observations, RIP Boah I guess.

Thanks. I was feeling like a fool fighting a losing battle, like Napoleon trying to conquer the world or me trying to get Ruben to give FE3 another chance, but I thibk i did a good enough job presenting my case, even if I turn out to be wrong.

5 minutes ago, Punished Dayni said:

I'll say the boring option of Julian, just because I expect Marth to get levels and HP.

Might be boring, but Kain and Mars woulda been more boring.

5 minutes ago, Punished Dayni said:

Also I like best cleric and her boy toy.

Couldn't help yourself, could ya?

[ping]

1 hour ago, Shaky Jones said:

Roshe, Darros. Just throw in Bord and you got the whole squad. 

Don't forget Wryf and Jeigan.

1 hour ago, Shaky Jones said:

Zamn

More like Zoomn

Because he's so fast

Get it

46 minutes ago, Punished Dayni said:

Also I like best cleric and her boy toy.

I'm sorry Ruben made me use the other best cleric

fwiw, Lena is guaranteed to be fielded next map, since she's still carrying the Warp staff. I'm afraid Wendell might grab that, though.

(and given that poor Wryf gets liquified into a Vulnerary for FE3, I did kinda have to use him when I could)

1 hour ago, Shaky Jones said:

Archanea has some solid map design despite it's seemingly simple appearance. It's something I praise in FE11, but is obviously still apparent in the original. I'd be willing to call FE1 a solid title for its time if I wasn't so annoyed with the lack of battle windows and crappy convoy menu. Afraid I'm just that petty. Oh well. 

I'm pretty much in agreement on the individual points, although we'll see what my eventual verdict is going to be. Apart from some stinkers like Book 2 Chapter 3 (but what game doesn't have any of these), Akaneia's maps are just... good. Objective diversity hasn't been invented yet, of course, but BinBla apologist that I am, I think that Seize is more or less the best case scenario if you're stuck with just one win condition. But menuing is clunky and when you say "lack of battle windows" I raise you "lack of any combat stats". It would already go a long way if the unit windows would display attack, hit, avoid, and crit.

[Punished Dayni]

Just now, Shaky Jones said:

Couldn't help yourself, could ya?

Lena's one of my favourites from Archanea and should have been allowed kill Gharnef in MotEII/NMotE

Just now, gnip said:

I'm sorry Ruben made me use the other best cleric

fwiw, Lena is guaranteed to be fielded next map, since she's still carrying the Warp staff. I'm afraid Wendell might grab that, though.

(and given that poor Wryf gets liquified into a Vulnerary for FE3, I did kinda have to use him when I could)

Just because she's a favourite doesn't mean I have to be pushing her for this. No bother.

Speaking of, it might be worth giving the Seraph robe to Rickard instead, he never gets recognised.

You're not wrong, the Vulnerarwrys is a sad thing.

Spoiler

See?

[Saint Rubenio]

1 hour ago, Punished Dayni said:

I'll say the boring option of Julian, just because I expect Marth to get levels and HP.

Also I like best cleric and her boy toy.

Riff though

1 hour ago, Punished Dayni said:

The bad cav relay is set.

Glorious.

We did it. We trapped Gnip. He cannot escape.

1 hour ago, Shaky Jones said:

Some games age better than others. I wouldnt have the biggest reason to play the original Mario, but I could and it plays fine enough. Zelda 1 can be a fun time when you don't need a guide for throwing bonbs at the most random tiles to proceed, but I think the core engine is still playable today even. FE1 just really pushes it with needing a manuel to see weapon stats and the clicking and confirmation that comes with an srpg being really difficult to tolerate given the NES limits.

But I should've said that I do mean that FE1 is quite respectable for pushing boundaries with the unique ganeplay structure at such an early age for gaming, and my obvious bias for strategy games makes me find fire emblem way more articulate to construct over something like adventure or platforming. I mean thats gotta be like 90% of the NES library. There wasn't much to compare FE to. If I grew up with the NES, I like to think I woulda loved FE1. But now its a lot more therapeutic to just trash on le archaic cuz of how I could've spent that time playing doing my 13th Darros run. That and forced crits is just objectively horrid game design.

No yeah, in all seriousness, FE1 is a game you gotta respect and admire for just how big and good it is for a NES title that predated... basically all strategy games. That doesn't mean it's fun to play today. I found it fun, but I know I'm the anomaly there lol

11 minutes ago, gnip said:

I'm sorry Ruben made me use the other best cleric

fwiw, Lena is guaranteed to be fielded next map, since she's still carrying the Warp staff. I'm afraid Wendell might grab that, though.

(and given that poor Wryf gets liquified into a Vulnerary for FE3, I did kinda have to use him when I could)

Yeah Lena can have her chance in 3, Riff only gets this game.

5 minutes ago, Punished Dayni said:

10/10 beautiful

[ping]

4 minutes ago, Punished Dayni said:

Speaking of, it might be worth giving the Seraph robe to Rickard instead, he never gets recognised.

To be honest, I think I want to keep using Julian, to see how far his high crit can get him. He's actually the character with the 2nd highest "crit growth" (Skl+Lck) that's on the team thus far - 130%, which I believe only loses to Sheeda's 140% and (once they join) Linde's 150% and Chiki's 180%. If I didn't miscount, an average Julian will have 17% innate crit, or 37% crit with a Killing Edge, which seems quite fun in a game with no crit mitigation at all.

Rickard, meanwhile, is one of those unfortunate cases of "lesser replacement in case the better unit dies", and he's "lesser" by a pretty substantial amount. Like, his growths are fine, but they really don't compare to Julian's actually excellent growths, and his bases are pretty noticably worse, too.

7 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

We did it. We trapped Gnip. He cannot escape.

Careful, I might use Catria and Palla in Book 2.

Assuming they're at least half as good as they are in New Mystery. And even if they aren't, I know your Opinions(tm) on Pegasus Knights.

[Saint Rubenio]

Just now, gnip said:

Careful, I might use Catria and Palla in Book 2.

Assuming they're at least half as good as they are in New Mystery. And even if they aren't, I know your Opinions(tm) on Pegasus Knights.

I mean, Palla's not that bad. She's too powerful, but at the same time I tend to use her as a jeigan until like, Anri's way, before the more unconventional projects come into form. She's not like Catria who's just like "give me all the kills and I become OP", like no, you can go fuck yourself.

So, in the Peggy ratings, it goes like, Syrene > Caeda > Palla > The rest like probably?

[Punished Dayni]

1 minute ago, gnip said:

To be honest, I think I want to keep using Julian, to see how far his high crit can get him. He's actually the character with the 2nd highest "crit growth" (Skl+Lck) that's on the team thus far - 130%, which I believe only loses to Sheeda's 140% and (once they join) Linde's 150% and Chiki's 180%. If I didn't miscount, an average Julian will have 17% innate crit, or 37% crit with a Killing Edge, which seems quite fun in a game with no crit mitigation at all.

Oh good grief.

Julian once again griefing the enemy.

1 minute ago, Saint Rubenio said:

So, in the Peggy ratings, it goes like, Syrene > Caeda > Palla > The rest like probably?

Caeda as an exception is funny to me.

[ping]

2 minutes ago, Saint Rubenio said:

So, in the Peggy ratings, it goes like, Syrene > Caeda > Palla > The rest like probably?

So that's two hilariously OP characters (considering the Wing Spear in SD) in your top 3? I'm surprised.

[Saint Rubenio]

10 minutes ago, Punished Dayni said:

Caeda as an exception is funny to me.

She's just kinda cool.

9 minutes ago, gnip said:

So that's two hilariously OP characters (considering the Wing Spear in SD) in your top 3? I'm surprised.

Caeda is a cool character. Syrene is genuinely great and I so wish she had more time to shine. Palla is very, very, very borderline because I sometimes like using her as another jeigan in FE12 and because I like green, but that's about it, I care very little for her character. Everyone else is identical.

[Shaky Jones]

1 hour ago, gnip said:

Don't forget Wryf and Jeigan.

Rief is a healer. His speed isn't the world's most important thing. 

Jeigan is cool. He would make the other no speed gang insecure.

1 hour ago, gnip said:

More like Zoomn

Because he's so fast

Get it

1 hour ago, gnip said:

I'm pretty much in agreement on the individual points, although we'll see what my eventual verdict is going to be. Apart from some stinkers like Book 2 Chapter 3 (but what game doesn't have any of these), Akaneia's maps are just... good. Objective diversity hasn't been invented yet, of course, but BinBla apologist that I am, I think that Seize is more or less the best case scenario if you're stuck with just one win condition. But menuing is clunky and when you say "lack of battle windows" I raise you "lack of any combat stats". It would already go a long way if the unit windows would display attack, hit, avoid, and crit.

Oh wow, it doesn't even say your hit on the stat sheet? Un-fricken-lucky.

I'm glad we all seem to agree about how decently Akeneia handles map design. 

1 hour ago, Punished Dayni said:

should have been allowed kill Gharnef in MotEII/NMotE

Matthis should've been allowed to recruit Lena in MotE B2/NMotE. 

Seriously, why isn't this allowed? There is no reason. Let me use FE12 Matthis over reclass-less Julian. Does he mean nothing to her? I weep.

1 hour ago, Punished Dayni said:

See?

You just gave me an amazing idea.

1 hour ago, gnip said:

Careful, I might use Catria and Palla in Book 2.

I'm destroying all of Serenes Forest.

1 hour ago, Saint Rubenio said:

I mean, Palla's not that bad. She's too powerful, but at the same time I tend to use her as a jeigan until like, Anri's way, before the more unconventional projects come into form. She's not like Catria who's just like "give me all the kills and I become OP", like no, you can go fuck yourself.

FE12 almost makes you use her in higher difficulties, so I often bench her in Anri's way like you do. I'm sure it's possible without her in lunatic (I've only insta-benched on maniac), but when I typically avoid using Catria nowadays, I need something to get through early game, although doing a no Kris run taught me that you can do just fine if you use Ryan. Use him. The true green haired powerhouse.

1 hour ago, Saint Rubenio said:

So, in the Peggy ratings, it goes like, Syrene > Caeda > Palla > The rest like probably?

I like Syrene and.....uhhhhh

...

I mean...

...

Marcia says "Oh crackers"...I say that sometimes at home...That's relatable...

Oh! I got it.

Juno the conservative

1 hour ago, Saint Rubenio said:

1 hour ago, Punished Dayni said:

Caeda as an exception is funny to me.

She's just kinda cool.

Disloyal sl-

1 hour ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Caeda is a cool character. Syrene is genuinely great and I so wish she had more time to shine. Palla is very, very, very borderline because I sometimes like using her as another jeigan in FE12 and because I like green, but that's about it, I care very little for her character. Everyone else is identical.

Palla has more than enough fans. Syrene is cool as heck.

Really, I just use Est to spite elitists. I like using lategame growth units. Like I give a damn about her character though. 

[ping]

• FE1 Chapter 6 - Fire Emblem

Spoiler

So Maji almost ruined an attempt by whiffing five out of six attempts at whacking an Armour Knight with a hammer. He only survived thanks to Wryf's healing, and thanks to Jeigan bringing a nearby Archer low enough on HP to trigger healing AI.

Who then actually ruined that run was Darros, who "only" missed 3/4 attacks vs. armor knights while he was off protecting a treasure chest and got killed because of it. I shall henceforth refer to this experience whenever anybody whines about FE6 axe users and their trouble hitting stuff.

Unfortunately, I wasn't very good about making screenshots in the successful attempt, but here's the gist of the earlygame: Darros gets warped to the chest that he's standing on in the picture, so that the three thieves starting near the boss have to go after the chests slightly closer to our own starting location. Meanwhile, Kain gets a warp to block the chest to the north; simply because he has the best combat stats and thus the easiest time going up against the two Cavaliers in that area, one of which carries a Silver Lance.

Two of the approaching thieves, standing on the marked tiles (as I said, not very good about making screenshots) have to be killed on turn 3. This was to be done by Marich and Mars getting rid of the first, while Sheeda one-rounds the second, which she can do with a Silver Lance even at base Str. In this particular case, however, Marich got a crit, so Mars chipped the other thief instead, allowing Sheeda to use her Iron Lance instead.

And as long as the closer treasure chest is blocked (as it is by Marich), the third thief is one tile short of reaching the other chest on the next turn.

What makes this a bit RNG dependant is clearing the path to get to the thieves to begin with, as the Armour Knight and the two Archers guarding the door to the room north will come and block it. This is where Maji had his rather embarrassing missfest, so this time, Mars killed the Knight on enemy phase after a miniscule, but necessary two-point chip from Roshe. Sheeda also didn't have the most advantageous starting point, either, and she needed to get her full movement every turn in order to reach that one thief. Had he gone to the tile above Mars, she just wouldn't have been able to intercept him at all. I think Jeigan would've been able to box him in, though.

RNG was much more favourable in this clear, though, so no plan B really had to be hatched. The closest thing was probably Kain missing the Thief he had been blocking with a Javelin, which would've allowed the thief to run past him thanks to the wood tiles around that entrance, but Maji was already close enough to reblock the entrance.

And speaking of favourable RNG... Yes, this is Roshe. Now, if you could grab a point of Str or two, as well...

With the Thieves been dealt with, the rest of the map doesn't pose much of a challenge anymore. I just wanted to show this position because I think it's neat: because both the Archer and the Mage can attack Mars, but will block the other from following up, this formation guarantees that they will not gang up on either Mars or Jeigan.

Not that it matters, I'm pretty sure only Sheeda (and maybe the Clerics) would die to these two, but it's neat.

And finally, everybody (well, Marich and Wendell) did some chipping so that Darros could do this. He actually speed-ties Mariones, making this bosskill unreliable, but not dangerous - had he missed, Roshe (w/ Armourslayer) could've made another attempt, and had he missed, Mars could've waited next to the throne in order to tank the hit (and potentially kill with his Rapier).

Conveniently, Julian happened to be the one grabbing the AnglRobe, so he immediately puts it on. He's now the character with the most HP on the team! ...although Darros is just a single point behind. Being busy recruiting Rickard and grabbing chests, he unfortunately didn't see any combat this map.

	Lv  	HP  Str Skl WLv Spd Lck Def
Mars	4.77	20    6   4   5   9   8   7
Jeigan	4.03	21    7  10  10   8   1   9
Kain	7.65	24    9   8   9  10   5   8
Sheeda	6.47	17    3  10  10  17  12   9

Wryf	10.10	18    1   5   4   7   2   3
Maji	6.70	23    7   5   6  11   5   5
Darros	8.66	26   10   2   7   8   6   8
Julian	4.58	27    5   7   2  12   8   4  	+9 HP

Marich	1.95	20    1   3   5   6   3   4	(base)
Roshe	6.36	21    6   7   9   9   4   7
Wendell	1.80	22    3   1  10  14   4   8	(base)
Lena	1.00	base

Gordon	1.00	base
Abel	4.01	19    8   7   7   8   5   9
Rickrd	1.40	16    3   1   2   9   0   2	(base)

• I said it before about Rickard: He's unfortunately outclassed wholesale by Julian. His growths (outside of the 0% WLv shared with Julian) aren't even that bad, but they're almost all lower than Julian's, and his non-Spd bases are just pretty tragic, period. He ends up as a classic "thief/10" character with not a ton of potential as a combat unit.

 

[Saint Rubenio]

1 hour ago, gnip said:

And speaking of favourable RNG... Yes, this is Roshe. Now, if you could grab a point of Str or two, as well...

Speedrosh! Speedrosh! It keeps happening @Shaky Jones, everyone I forced others to use turns out godly.

1 hour ago, gnip said:

Kain	7.65	24    9   8   9  10   5   8

1 hour ago, gnip said:

Roshe	6.36	21    6   7   9   9   4   7

He's as fast as Kain. Comedy.

1 hour ago, gnip said:

I said it before about Rickard: He's unfortunately outclassed wholesale by Julian. His growths (outside of the 0% WLv shared with Julian) aren't even that bad, but they're almost all lower than Julian's, and his non-Spd bases are just pretty tragic, period. He ends up as a classic "thief/10" character with not a ton of potential as a combat unit.

Rickard has very little going for him. He lacks Julian's super growths and Mars's... well, Marsiness. So he ends up being this really weird unit that kinda exists in case you lose Julian but still refuse to run around the map with Mars to grab all the chests.

...Julian died to a crit in my run, so I tried to make him work. He doesn't work.

[ping]

1 hour ago, Saint Rubenio said:

everyone I forced others to use turns out godly.

I will say that "-3 HP, -3 Str, -1 Def compared to Kain" might not quite be Zeus tier of godly. Maybe Zeus's heavenly (well, olympic, rather) gardener.

Now, Wryf on the other hand - that guy got stronger by getting shot at. If Dragon Ball Z taught me anything, it's that this kind of person will invariably end up strong enough to dwarf any god.

1 hour ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Rickard has very little going for him. He lacks Julian's super growths and Mars's... well, Marsiness. So he ends up being this really weird unit that kinda exists in case you lose Julian but still refuse to run around the map with Mars to grab all the chests.

Rickard does wear pants - shorts, but still - which does make him as unmarsly as one can be.

Edited September 1, 2023 by gnip

[Saint Rubenio]

Just now, gnip said:

Now, Wryf on the other hand - that guy got stronger by getting shot at. If Dragon Ball Z taught me anything, it's that this kind of person will invariably end up strong enough to dwarf any god.

Need I post the video again

1 minute ago, gnip said:

Rickard does wear pants - shorts, but still - which does make him as unmarsly as one can be.

That's where Mars's power comes from. His pantslessness.

[Shaky Jones]

3 hours ago, gnip said:

So Maji almost ruined an attempt by whiffing five out of six attempts at whacking an Armour Knight with a hammer.

3 hours ago, gnip said:

Who then actually ruined that run was Darros, who "only" missed 3/4 attacks vs. armor knights while he was off protecting a treasure chest and got killed because of it. I shall henceforth refer to this experience whenever anybody whines about FE6 axe users and their trouble hitting stuff.

1RN hammers on their way to be become the lottery of Fire Emblem.

Usually, I only use hammers on games that can forge them. A true Fe6 fighter can just bow an armor to death anyways.

3 hours ago, gnip said:

What makes this a bit RNG dependant is clearing the path to get to the thieves to begin with, as the Armour Knight and the two Archers guarding the door to the room north will come and block it. This is where Maji had his rather embarrassing missfest, so this time, Mars killed the Knight on enemy phase after a miniscule, but necessary two-point chip from Roshe. Sheeda also didn't have the most advantageous starting point, either, and she needed to get her full movement every turn in order to reach that one thief

Believe in the Maji. He will prevail. Simply have faith.

3 hours ago, gnip said:

And speaking of favourable RNG... Yes, this is Roshe. Now, if you could grab a point of Str or two, as well...

It's always when they have 10%. I get speed blessed Darroses all the time, or any growths on Jeigan. 40% is the cursed number that never gets anything, for strength at least. I think there's a conspiracy afoot.

3 hours ago, gnip said:

With the Thieves been dealt with, the rest of the map doesn't pose much of a challenge anymore. I just wanted to show this position because I think it's neat: because both the Archer and the Mage can attack Mars, but will block the other from following up, this formation guarantees that they will not gang up on either Mars or Jeigan.

This is one of those strats that make you feel like Jimmy Neutron when you first discover it, but it's quite helpful when playing difficult FE games, and it might even make you appreciate the structure of map design in fire emblem.

And then you play Genealogy.

3 hours ago, gnip said:

I said it before about Rickard: He's unfortunately outclassed wholesale by Julian. His growths (outside of the 0% WLv shared with Julian) aren't even that bad, but they're almost all lower than Julian's, and his non-Spd bases are just pretty tragic, period. He ends up as a classic "thief/10" character with not a ton of potential as a combat unit.

Player: "I don't really see a point in using Rickard. I'll deploy Julian when I need him".

Julian gets killed by a crit

Kaga: 

2 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Speedrosh! Speedrosh! It keeps happening @Shaky Jones, everyone I forced others to use turns out godly.

You have the power to bless others.

I have the power to curse them.

[Punished Dayni]

6 hours ago, gnip said:

And speaking of favourable RNG... Yes, this is Roshe. Now, if you could grab a point of Str or two, as well...

Roshe, hero of RNG subversion.

6 hours ago, gnip said:

I said it before about Rickard: He's unfortunately outclassed wholesale by Julian. His growths (outside of the 0% WLv shared with Julian) aren't even that bad, but they're almost all lower than Julian's, and his non-Spd bases are just pretty tragic, period. He ends up as a classic "thief/10" character with not a ton of potential as a combat unit.

5 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

...Julian died to a crit in my run, so I tried to make him work. He doesn't work.

Well, looks like Rickard will be staying benchbound. 😞

2 hours ago, Shaky Jones said:

Player: "I don't really see a point in using Rickard. I'll deploy Julian when I need him".

Julian gets killed by a crit

Kaga: 

5 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

I will inconvenience the player on purpose.png

[ping]

11 hours ago, Punished Dayni said:

Roshe, hero of RNG subversion.

Silly Dayni, Roshe is the cavalier of RNG subversion

• FE1 Chapter 7 - Trap of Lefcandy

Spoiler

To be honest, this might be the first map of the game that I don't think is very good. The village being in a dead end doesn't really do anything but waste time or, if you're impatient like me, a Warp use. If there was another path south of the village (maybe also with a door, or with the Thief positioned a bit further away), it might not be so bad, but even then - the rest of the map is pretty empty. You have the three flying enemies coming at you... and that's it, pretty much. Reinforcements spawn on turn 13, which is pretty easy to avoid, so once you've beaten the Wyvern Rider, the map is very easy, but also rather slow, which isn't the greatest of combinations.

But to get to the clear: Step one was to have Marich kill the two Archers behind the door, delaying opening it until the second turn so that Mars can get closer without drawing fire.

Once again, I split up the group. The formation behind the door should be safe - the pillar tiles are impassable even for flyers, so Mars can only be attacked from two tiles (and he's faster than the Peg Knights as long as he doesn't equip Steel), so he will lure the Wyvern into Marich's range while he, Sheeda, and Roshe deal some enemy phase damage to the Pegasi and at least one of the Mercs.

____

...except that didn't happen. I am confused. The Wyvern Rider moves first - the three screenshots are in the correct order - so he clearly would've been able to attack Mars, but didn't. The heck? I thought Mars's "provoke ability" was reliable? This was rather awkward, with Marich being one tile short of reaching the Wyvern.

Luckily, Wolf was a bro, weakening the Wyvern, but missing his follow-up attack to allow somebody else to take the XP.

____

That somebody ended up being Maji - Kain dealt 2x3 damage, Darros would've killed with his Steel Axe (5 damage), Maji dealt exactly 2x2 damage with his Steel Axe. His Str growth hasn't been entirely agreeable thus far, by which I mean he's still at base Str, which made this a little unreliable.

Anyway, Banutu recruited, reinforcements about to be blocked. Rickard, after emptying his pockets, made himself useful by doing so for the northernmost fort. ...which, as I'm looking stuff up on FEWoD, doesn't actually spawn anything. Still, it's the thought that counts.

__

Unfortunately, the boss hits everybody really hard, and physical attackers have hit rates against him that range from "awful" to "unreliable", thanks to the +30 Avo bonus of his Castle tile. Darros and Roshe both get a hit in, with Mars making sure that they can do so safely (although who knows how safe it really is, after that Wyvern experience), but it would've taken a lot of time to actually whittle him down without taking stupid risks.

So, Marich gets to take the boss kill. He also procced Def in both of his level-ups, which makes him almost as tanky as Roshe, so I think I might be obligated to keep using him now. "Almost as tanky as Roshe" does mean that his bulk is almost godly, after all.

The clear took 10 turns in the end, which is what lead me to the conclusion that the reinforcements don't really matter, or rather only matter if you're caught off-guard by them. They're entirely irrelevant if you warp Mars across the mountains (or, heaven forbid, don't recruit Banutu) and still pretty trivial to prevent if you don't. There's barely anything trying to prevent you from reaching the forts, if your Mars is taking the scenic route.

The Team:

	Lv  	HP  Str Skl WLv Spd Lck Def
Mars	5.42	21    7   5   5   9   9   7
Jeigan	4.11	21    7  10  10   8   1   9
Kain	8.13	25    9   8  10  11   5   8
Sheeda	7.17	17    3  11  10  18  13  10

Wryf	10.54	18    1   5   4   7   2   3
Maji	7.48	24    7   5   6  11   5   6
Darros	8.79	26   10   2   7   8   6   8
Julian	4.86	27    5   7   2  12   8   4	(+9 HP)

Marich	3.55	20    1   3   7   7   5   6
Roshe	6.86	21    6   7   9   9   4   7
Wendell	2.08	22    3   1  11  14   5   8
Rickrd	1.40	base

Wolf	3.21	base
Bartz	5.14	base
Banutu	1.00	18    2   3   2   4   1   3	(base)

• 15 Def and 18 Atk is certainly not too bad for Banutu, although non-Sheeda characters with high enough WLv can match (Roshe) or exceed (Kain) the latter. If I recall, there's some bug that allows him to reach truly silly Def numbers, but even "legit", Banutu seems pretty decent for his high Def alone. We'll see how common enemies with Silvers and more than 1 AS are going to be.
• Not a new unit at all, but I want to point out that Sheeda got her 3rd Def proc this map. Honestly, I would've preferred 6 Str/7 Def over her current stats, just to make it easier for her tor grab some kills (and neither 6 Str nor 10 Def are above Wyvern bases, anyway), but it's still a funny little outlier to see her as the unit with the thickest armour. ...although her HP growth has been pretty bad as a bit of compensation.

 

[Saint Rubenio]

14 hours ago, Shaky Jones said:

You have the power to bless others.

I have the power to curse them.

I mean, Maji in my FE1 run turned out positively godly, so who knows, really.

11 hours ago, Punished Dayni said:

I will inconvenience the player on purpose.png

Remember Leteena?

6 minutes ago, gnip said:

To be honest, this might be the first map of the game that I don't think is very good. The village being in a dead end doesn't really do anything but waste time or, if you're impatient like me, a Warp use. If there was another path south of the village (maybe also with a door, or with the Thief positioned a bit further away), it might not be so bad, but even then - the rest of the map is pretty empty. You have the three flying enemies coming at you... and that's it, pretty much. Reinforcements spawn on turn 13, which is pretty easy to avoid, so once you've beaten the Wyvern Rider, the map is very easy, but also rather slow, which isn't the greatest of combinations.

Yeah, pretty much.

6 minutes ago, gnip said:

Wyrvern? Never saw that particular spelling. Also "dodged quickly"? @Polinym that an Earthbound reference?

8 minutes ago, gnip said:

So, Marich gets to take the boss kill. He also procced Def in both of his level-ups, which makes him almost as tanky as Roshe, so I think I might be obligated to keep using him now. "Almost as tanky as Roshe" does mean that his bulk is almost godly, after all.

No, it's still two points of def and HP under Wendel.

...Wendel is so fucking insane in this game, seriously. No wonder they spent three whole games nerfing him.

8 minutes ago, gnip said:

15 Def and 18 Atk is certainly not too bad for Banutu, although non-Sheeda characters with high enough WLv can match (Roshe) or exceed (Kain) the latter. If I recall, there's some bug that allows him to reach truly silly Def numbers, but even "legit", Banutu seems pretty decent for his high Def alone. We'll see how common enemies with Silvers and more than 1 AS are going to be.

I used Banutu the entire game in my run and he was a lot of fun. Big tanky times.

[ping]

1 hour ago, Saint Rubenio said:

No, it's still two points of def and HP under Wendel.

...Wendel is so fucking insane in this game, seriously. No wonder they spent three whole games nerfing him.

¿Por qué no los dos?

I mean, with Wryf not being able to use Physic, Warp, or even Barrier, Wendell is going to have to use staves more often, so I don't think it's a bad idea to field a second offensive magic user. Don't worry, Wryf will still get the first Guiding Ring

[Saint Rubenio]

16 minutes ago, gnip said:

¿Por qué no los dos?

I mean, with Wryf not being able to use Physic, Warp, or even Barrier, Wendell is going to have to use staves more often, so I don't think it's a bad idea to field a second offensive magic user. Don't worry, Wryf will still get the first Guiding Ring

He had better.

[Polinym]

5 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

@Polinym that an Earthbound reference?

...kinda.

Subyakumi (quickly, swiftly, nimbly), kawashita (dodged).
Hence, dodged quickly. Dragon Warrior words it similarly too.

Spoiler

Definitely not me creeping around here, looking for the elusive translation feedback... Nope. Pay me no mind.

 

[Punished Dayni]

9 hours ago, gnip said:

Silly Dayni, Roshe is the cavalier of RNG subversion

Silly me indeed.

9 hours ago, Saint Rubenio said:

Remember Leteena?

All according to Kaga.

9 hours ago, gnip said:

Not a new unit at all, but I want to point out that Sheeda got her 3rd Def proc this map. Honestly, I would've preferred 6 Str/7 Def over her current stats, just to make it easier for her tor grab some kills (and neither 6 Str nor 10 Def are above Wyvern bases, anyway), but it's still a funny little outlier to see her as the unit with the thickest armour. ...although her HP growth has been pretty bad as a bit of compensation.

10 Def Caeda is certainly not the number I'd have been expecting.