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Grand Hero Battle: Michalis


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My Palla has 37 Str, though since I used Eirika, she gave her a +3. So she could inflict 14 damage, and it was the special attack that I used next, anyway.

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1 minute ago, Anacybele said:

No, she's +res. And I suppose your idea could work, but my female Robin is too weak at 3 stars.

Fair enough. Good thing we still have 3 days :D

-----

Anyways, someone asked me about my units earlier, so here is my spreadsheet.

Spoiler
Hero Raritiy Level Boon Bane
Camilla 5 40 SPD ATT
Lyn 5 40 X X
M!Robin 4 40 ATT HP
Marth 5 40 ATT DEF
Reinhardt 5 40 SPD RES
Takumi 5 40 RES ATT
F!Robin 4 39 X X
Frederick 4 39 HP SPD
Lissa 4 38 X X
Catria 4 37 HP RES
Felicia 4 37 X X
Maria 4 34 DEF SPD
Nino 4 34 ATT HP
Olivia 4 32 X X
Anna 4 32 X X
Selena 4 32 RES DEF
Subaki 4 31 SPD RES
Narcian 4 31 X X
Eliwood 4 30 ATT RES
Azama 3 29 DEF RES
Sakura 4 29 RES DEF
Rebecca 5 29 SPD ATT
Gunter 3 28 X X
Shanna 4 28 ATT HP
Sully 4 27 DEF HP
Cecilia 4 26 ATT SPD
Odin 3 26 DEF RES
Sharena 4 26 X X
Nowi 4 26 HP RES
Hinata 4 25 DEF ATT
Clarine 4 25 SPD RES
Tharja 4 25 HP SPD
Laslow 3 24 DEF SPD
Lon'qu 3 24 X X
Ogma 4 24 ATT HP
Alfonse 4 23 X X
Beruka 3 23 ATT SPD
Donnel 4 23 DEF RES
Draug 3 23 SPD DEF
F!Corrin 3 23 DEF SPD
Florina 4 23 ATT RES
Ursula 3 23 X X
Barst 4 22 ATT DEF
Fae 4 22 X X
Marth 5 22 HP DEF
Virion 4 22 DEF RES
Wrys 4 22 RES HP
Gaius 4 21 ATT DEF
Gordin 3 21 RES HP
Palla 3 21 ATT HP
Saizo 3 21 SPD RES
Abel 4 20 ATT DEF
Barst 3 20 ATT HP
Bartre 3 20 HP RES
Est 3 20 X X
Hana 4 20 SPD HP
Henry 3 20 DEF SPD
Niles 3 20 HP SPD
Oboro 3 20 RES SPD
Raigh 3 20 ATT HP
Seliph 5 20 HP SPD
Setsuna 3 20 DEF RES
Sophia 2 20 X X
Stahl 3 20 RES SPD
Tiki (Adult) 3 20 SPD HP
Maria 4 19 HP DEF
F!Corrin 3 18 SPD RES
Seliph 4 18 HP SPD
Lachesis 5 17 SPD HP
Maria 5 17 HP DEF
Palla 3 17 HP SPD
Cherche 3 16 RES DEF
Fir 3 14 DEF SPD
Matthew 2 13 X X
Camilla 4 1 SPD DEF
Camilla 4 1 HP ATT
Cecilia 3 1 DEF ATT
Clarine 4 1 ATT RES
Eirika 4 1 ATT RES
F!Corrin 3 1 RES HP
Fae 4 1 RES HP
Felicia 3 1 RES HP
Florina 3 1 SPD RES
Gaius 3 1 RES HP
Maria 4 1 SPD HP
Michalis 3 1 X X
Niles 3 1 DEF ATT
Palla 3 1 DEF ATT
Serra 4 1 RES ATT
Sully 3 1 X X
Tiki (Adult) 3 1 RES DEF
         
         

 

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8 minutes ago, CaptainObvious said:

I'm glad I decided to make Narcian my first 5*. I also gave him Triangle Adept 3 to make him the ultimate Blue Killer.

This map was kinda easy with him. And I used Lilina to oneshot Michelis. I don't know if Henry or Sophia can do the same, but I'm not fond of them.

I have some bad news

Triangle Adept and Gem weapons don't stack.

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@Anacybele How to bait Michalis with Roy.

Retreat Narcian and bring Roy up (TAdept 3 -- I died from Michalis w/ TA1).  As long as Narcian is behind Roy.. he's safe.

Worse comes to worse. Olivia is there.
 

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2 minutes ago, Ryuke said:

@Anacybele How to bait Michalis with Roy.

Retreat Narcian and bring Roy up (TAdept 3 -- I died from Michalis w/ TA1).  As long as Narcian is behind Roy.. he's safe.

Worse comes to worse. Olivia is there.
 

Why are you saying Narcian? I don't have him as my screenshots have shown.

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13 minutes ago, Arcanite said:

Beruka still works as long as you have a red mage and a bow user or something to keep her away from Michalis and the red peg.

My only red mage is a lv. 32 4* Sophia with low attack and I think high resistance and the 2* Raigh I left benched since I started the game and my only archer is starter Virion and... a 3* duplicate Virion who showed up when I promoted starter Virion. Since 15 summons, I've only summoned that Virion, so yeah... You cannot believe the rage that is inside me of not even summoning any non-Virion archer since while people complain about how they keep getting Niles. That and the lack of blue units in the early summons, but I digress. Man, I wished 4* Merric was a 5* so he could have Excalibur for the other flyers, but I'm too stingy with feathers and I feel like there's another way. I do have a lv. 40 4* F!Robin, though.

I've tried using Palla to bait Michalis, but I think that's like poking a shark. He got angry. Really angry. Also tried sending in a lv. 36 4* Subaki -- don't ask why, I thought it was a brilliant idea for some reason -- on the right side, but he got dragged back by the lance flyer and Michalis finished him off. This was before I realized she had drag back since I don't think she had that on hard or she died to Subaki.

The dumbest idea I can think of is to send in a lv. 40 5* Effie on the right side and hope she somehow lives and destroys everything -- she won't.

Somehow, I think that if I could get Michalis to focus only on my lv. 39 4* adult Tiki, then it would be fine as he's the main powerhouse while the others while powerful, are making him and themselves even stronger.

Edit: Might want to invest time into Beruka. Of the two, the first one and the highest level one has high HP, low res, so she'll definitely be tanky; other Beruka has low attack, high speed. My only Cherche had to have low attack for high res... Still powerful, though.

Edited by Kaden
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16 minutes ago, Arcanite said:

Beruka still works as long as you have a red mage and a bow user or something to keep her away from Michalis and the red peg.

Sorry, but I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one.

For the strategy to work, you have to be able to ORKO the lance peg otherwise you'll get dragged back into the range of Michalis, and you definitely don't want that.

On Lunatic mode, the lance peg has 45 HP, 22 Def, and 36 Spd (and darting blow, so 42 when she initiates). To ORKO her, you either need to do 23 x 2 or 45 damage in one shot. 

To do 23 x 2, you'd need an axe flier with at least 38 Atk and 47 Spd. No flier has a spd like that, so to double you would need Lancebreaker, which neither Beruka nor Cherche naturally have (now if they inherited that then that's a different story, but I'm assuming they didn't). The reason Narcian works so well is because he has innate Lancebreaker and also Emerald Axe, which lowers his atk requirement. 

To do 45 damage in one shot, you would need an axe flier with 56 atk, and quite frankly no one has stats like that. Cherche comes close if you have a +Atk 5* Cherche (she would have 53 damage), which you could then boost with an attack buff, but I'm going to assume the person asking does not have a +Atk 5* Cherche.

As unfortunate as it is, you cannot substitute Narcian for any other axe flier if you want to use the "bait lance peg with axe flier" strategy unless you inherit Lancebreaker because only Narcian has that naturally. 

Other strategies are still viable, of course, but if you wanted to use this particular one, Beruka and Cherche do not work as Narcian replacements. 

 

Edited by MaskedAmpharos
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5 minutes ago, Anacybele said:

Why are you saying Narcian? I don't have him as my screenshots have shown.

My bad. Saw the wrong screenshot.

I checked... you really have to use Olivia to position. I am assume you are chasing HARD Michalis. If its LUNATIC... Roy will have trouble. (at least at level 30)

Edited by Ryuke
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5 minutes ago, MaskedAmpharos said:

Sorry, but I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one.

For the strategy to work, you have to be able to ORKO the lance peg otherwise you'll get dragged back into the range of Michalis, and you definitely don't want that.

On Lunatic mode, the lance peg has 45 HP, 22 Def, and 36 Spd (and darting blow, so 42 when she initiates). To ORKO her, you either need to do 23 x 2 or 45 damage in one shot. 

To do 23 x 2, you'd need an axe flier with at least 38 Atk and 47 Spd. No flier has a spd like that, so to double you would need Lancebreaker, which neither Beruka nor Cherche naturally have (now if they inherited that then that's a different story, but I'm assuming they didn't). The reason Narcian works so well is because he has innate Lancebreaker and also Emerald Axe, which lowers his atk requirement. 

To do 45 damage in one shot, you would need an axe flier with 56 atk, and quite frankly no one has stats like that.

As unfortunate as it is, you cannot substitute Narcian for any other axe flier if you want to use the "bait lance peg with axe flier" strategy unless you inherit Lancebreaker because only Narcian has that naturally. 

Other strategies are still viable, of course, but if you wanted to use this particular one, Beruka and Cherche do not work as Narcian replacements. 

 

Yeah, I was wondering about that since the lance flyer and doesn't the sword flyer also have drag back? I could get Lancebreaker on either Beruka or Cherche, but I'd have to sack one of my Arthurs who does have a crappy stat variation of low attack for high HP. That said, I haven't done and refuse to do Inherit Skill until I know enough I about it that I'm confident in what I'm doing.

Should I just list the units I have that are around level +35?

Edit: I find it funny how the GHB units counter each other in some way. F!Robin counters Ursula, Ursula is supposed to counter Xander, and Narcian counters one of Michalis's allies. I wonder who Michalis will end up countering.

Edited by Kaden
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2 minutes ago, Ryuke said:

My bad. Saw the wrong screenshot.

I checked... you really have to use Olivia to position. I am assume you are chasing HARD Michalis. If its LUNATIC... Roy will have trouble. (at least at level 30)

Uh, no, I did the hard battle a long time ago and it was very easy with my usual team (Frederick, Palla, Sharena, male Robin). The lunatic one is the one I wanted to win from the start for a 4 star Michalis instead of 3.

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20 minutes ago, TheTuckingFypo said:

Fair enough. Good thing we still have 3 days :D

-----

Anyways, someone asked me about my units earlier, so here is my spreadsheet.

  Hide contents
Hero Raritiy Level Boon Bane
Camilla 5 40 SPD ATT
Lyn 5 40 X X
M!Robin 4 40 ATT HP
Marth 5 40 ATT DEF
Reinhardt 5 40 SPD RES
Takumi 5 40 RES ATT
F!Robin 4 39 X X
Frederick 4 39 HP SPD
Lissa 4 38 X X
Catria 4 37 HP RES
Felicia 4 37 X X
Maria 4 34 DEF SPD
Nino 4 34 ATT HP
Olivia 4 32 X X
Anna 4 32 X X
Selena 4 32 RES DEF
Subaki 4 31 SPD RES
Narcian 4 31 X X
Eliwood 4 30 ATT RES
Azama 3 29 DEF RES
Sakura 4 29 RES DEF
Rebecca 5 29 SPD ATT
Gunter 3 28 X X
Shanna 4 28 ATT HP
Sully 4 27 DEF HP
Cecilia 4 26 ATT SPD
Odin 3 26 DEF RES
Sharena 4 26 X X
Nowi 4 26 HP RES
Hinata 4 25 DEF ATT
Clarine 4 25 SPD RES
Tharja 4 25 HP SPD
Laslow 3 24 DEF SPD
Lon'qu 3 24 X X
Ogma 4 24 ATT HP
Alfonse 4 23 X X
Beruka 3 23 ATT SPD
Donnel 4 23 DEF RES
Draug 3 23 SPD DEF
F!Corrin 3 23 DEF SPD
Florina 4 23 ATT RES
Ursula 3 23 X X
Barst 4 22 ATT DEF
Fae 4 22 X X
Marth 5 22 HP DEF
Virion 4 22 DEF RES
Wrys 4 22 RES HP
Gaius 4 21 ATT DEF
Gordin 3 21 RES HP
Palla 3 21 ATT HP
Saizo 3 21 SPD RES
Abel 4 20 ATT DEF
Barst 3 20 ATT HP
Bartre 3 20 HP RES
Est 3 20 X X
Hana 4 20 SPD HP
Henry 3 20 DEF SPD
Niles 3 20 HP SPD
Oboro 3 20 RES SPD
Raigh 3 20 ATT HP
Seliph 5 20 HP SPD
Setsuna 3 20 DEF RES
Sophia 2 20 X X
Stahl 3 20 RES SPD
Tiki (Adult) 3 20 SPD HP
Maria 4 19 HP DEF
F!Corrin 3 18 SPD RES
Seliph 4 18 HP SPD
Lachesis 5 17 SPD HP
Maria 5 17 HP DEF
Palla 3 17 HP SPD
Cherche 3 16 RES DEF
Fir 3 14 DEF SPD
Matthew 2 13 X X
Camilla 4 1 SPD DEF
Camilla 4 1 HP ATT
Cecilia 3 1 DEF ATT
Clarine 4 1 ATT RES
Eirika 4 1 ATT RES
F!Corrin 3 1 RES HP
Fae 4 1 RES HP
Felicia 3 1 RES HP
Florina 3 1 SPD RES
Gaius 3 1 RES HP
Maria 4 1 SPD HP
Michalis 3 1 X X
Niles 3 1 DEF ATT
Palla 3 1 DEF ATT
Serra 4 1 RES ATT
Sully 3 1 X X
Tiki (Adult) 3 1 RES DEF
         
         

 

Camilla could work better than Narcian if you want a 5 star instead of a 4 star. Other than that I think you're fine. If you want even more five star comfort, you can opt to bring reinhardt for the cav. Oboro also works pretty well and can buff defense with rally (as you can see I'm a strong advocate for her but since yours is three star, just use Subaki). I also have Lyn and she doesn't really handle Michalis too well with out taking a Truckload so keep Selena.

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2 minutes ago, Kaden said:

Yeah, I was wondering about that since the lance flyer and doesn't the sword flyer also have drag back? I could get Lancebreaker on either Beruka or Cherche, but I'd have to sack one of my Arthurs who does have a crappy stat variation of low attack for high HP. That said, I haven't done and refuse to do Inherit Skill until I know enough I about it that I'm confident in what I'm doing.

Should I just list the units I have that are around level +35?

Since you have Lancebreaker available, it would certainly be an option to give it to Cherche or Beruka (I personally favor Cherche), but if you don't want to mess with skill inheritance, then yes, it would help to see your units and maybe figure out an alternative strategy.

At the very least though, you have inheritance to fall back on if you needed it. 

@Arcanite Unfortunately, Camilla can't replace Narcian for the particular strategy you have in mind, even at 5*, for reasons I listed in a post above. 

Edited by MaskedAmpharos
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Just now, Arcanite said:

Camilla could work better than Narcian if you want a 5 star instead of a 4 star. Other than that I think you're fine. If you want even more five star comfort, you can opt to bring reinhardt for the cav. Oboro also works pretty well and can buff defense with rally (as you can see I'm a strong advocate for her but since yours is three star, just use Subaki). I also have Lyn and she doesn't really handle Michalis too well with out taking a Truckload so keep Selena.

I tried Camilla before but her low def isn't fun :(

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I just tried using Olivia, and it doesn't work. Michalis still has the buffs even after I use Olivia to let Virion take out the blue Peg, so Palla can't kill Michalis and he kills Virion the next turn.

I can't do anything to win the lunatic one and I'll just have to accept that, as disappointing as it is.

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Just now, TheTuckingFypo said:

I tried Camilla before but her low def isn't fun :(

Well then your team is already perfect! Narcian Selena Subaki and Takumi/Olivia

It's up to you now. 

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I was sleeping.

49 minutes ago, MrSmokestack said:

@Arcanite

 

Guess I'll mention @Eselred

We don't have enough whales to see this so @Shiro

@Effies_Home because why not

@Falcom and @Othin while we're at it.

@pianime94 too

Wot?

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@TheTuckingFypo Of the units you listed, I agree with Arcanite on Narcian and Subaki, but as for the other two, I actually think you'll get more mileage on this map out of Tharja and Olivia. Even without Raourblade buffs, Tharja should have an easier time killing Michalis than Takumi because WTA and because she targets his weak res as opposed to Takumi who targets his high def. 

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Just now, MaskedAmpharos said:

@TheTuckingFypo Of the units you listed, I agree with Arcanite on Narcian and Subaki, but as for the other two, I actually think you'll get more mileage on this map out of Tharja and Olivia. Even without Raourblade buffs, Tharja should have an easier time killing Michalis than Takumi because WTA and because she targets his weak res as opposed to Takumi who targets his high def. 

@MrSmokestack @Arcanite

Looks like it's a 3-way bet!

@MaskedAmpharos - Interesting. I'll have to level Tharja as well...

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5 minutes ago, MaskedAmpharos said:

@TheTuckingFypo Of the units you listed, I agree with Arcanite on Narcian and Subaki, but as for the other two, I actually think you'll get more mileage on this map out of Tharja and Olivia. Even without Raourblade buffs, Tharja should have an easier time killing Michalis than Takumi because WTA and because she targets his weak res as opposed to Takumi who targets his high def. 

Oy vey.

Alright Amphy. You want give new ideas and join the bet you can. But that only means that you run the risk of losing. If you want to join this bet and lock that in as your team of choice then it's settled, but if you want to leave this between me and smokestack then it's okay. Choose wisely ;)

Edited by Arcanite
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Did this with a team of M!Robin, Young Tiki, Narcian, and Serra. Tiki 2RKOed Narcian and 1RKOed the Sword Units (inherited Swordbreaker), M!Robin provided crucial Defence points with his Spur Defence skill + got Tiki out of trouble with the lance infantry (thanks to inherited Reposition) after baiting both him and Michalis, Narcian made the lance units a piece of cake with his Emerald Axe and Lancebreaker skill which ensured that he could kill off the lance flier who caused my team so much grief during the many attempts at this map + his flier mobility let me easily get him to relieve M!Robin after the lance infantry hit him once, and Serra healed Tiki back to levels where she could safely take on the sword units (and reactivate Swordbreaker in time for the sword units) after killing Michalis before they could ruin my day + provided essential Hone Attack 2 bonuses for Tiki as well.

Edited by Folt
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After many tries using my Eirika/Tsubaki/Camilla/Virion and Eirika/Stahl/Camilla/Olivia teams, I've realised that those teams without some skill inheritance weren't going to take down Michalis on Lunatic. So I think I'm going to pump levels into my 4* Narcian and 4* Tharja and try out an Olivia (or Eirika, if my Tharja ends up being - Speed)/Tsubaki/Narcian/Tharja team.

I love these hard Grand Hero battles; Narcian and Female Robin weren't anywhere near this difficult (can't comment on Ursula's, since I've only recently gotten back into Heroes). Need more of these, IS.

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I was somewhat reading this topic until it got filled with fluff, so I stopped bothering until I saw my name mentioned. (Why am I responding to my summons? WHY WON'T THE 5* UNITS RESPOND TO MINE! *cries*)

Anyways, @Arcanite@MrSmokestack, I did some stuffs. The table assumes max level, but the actual levels are found in the notes. Watch as this be too late...

Name		HP	ATT	SPD	DEF	RES	Total
Narcian		39	27	26	30	24
Subaki		37	23	36	33	17
Selena		35	23	33	27	28

Olivia		34	26	31	24	23
5* Takumi	40	29	33	25	21
--------------------------------------------------
"Narcian is level 31, balanced. (Anti-Lance Flier & Soldier)
Subaki is level 32, +speed/-resistance (Anti-Sword Flier & Cavalier)
Selena is level 32, +resistance/-defense I think. (Anti-Michalis)

Olivia is level 32, balanced
Takumi is level 40, +resistance/-attack, but y'all knew that already.

They are all 4*, besides Takumi."

1. -ATT Takumi can not one-shot the Fliers. They have 45 Health while -ATT Takumi can only do 41. Then this is not even considering the Fortify Fliers buff, which will reduce his damage by 6. (29+14 = 43 || 43 * 1.5 MOD = 63 || 63 - 22 = 41)

2. Narcian one rounds the Lance Flier. Since it provided Fortify Fliers, it cannot buff itself. (27 + 8 = 35 || 35 * 1.4 WTA = 49 || 49 - 22 = 27 || 27 * 2 = 54)

2A. Narcian will have to engage in two rounds of combat against the Lance Infantry. She has 52 HP. Yes, the Lance Infantry are female, like Sharena. (27 + 8 = 35 || 35 * 1.4 WTA = 49 || 49 - 30 = 19 || 19 * 2 = 38)

3. Subaki will not be able to one-round the Sword Flier without an ATT Buff. This is also provided the Sword Flier does not have Fortify Fliers on. (23 + 8 = 31 || 31 * 1,4 WTA = 43 || 43 - 22 = 21 || 21 + 21 = 42) Remember, fliers have 45 health. The ATT Buff can be provided by Olivia, or Takumi can finish off the target.

3A. Subaki will have to engage in two rounds of combat against the Sword Cavalier. He has 49 Health. (23 + 8 = 31 || 31 * 1.4 WTA = 43 || 43 - 26 = 17 || 17 + 17 = 34)

4. Selena will only do 14 damage to Michalis. He has 60 Health. (23 + 8 = 31 || 31 * 1.4 WTA = 43 || 43 - 36 = 7 || 7 + 7= 14) Given that he will have his charge ready after combat and Takumi won't do much to him, I highly recommend running a Red Mage to deal with Michalis, like @MaskedAmpharos has stated. Edit: Selena will actually do less to Michalis since she only learns Triangle Adept 2, which is only a 15% modifier instead of 20. So, WTA actually is 1.35 instead of 1.4

5. Olivia dances and provided Hone ATT support. Currently, I would say it is better running Olivia than Takumi given your setup and natures. -ATT Takumi is not going to cut it for this map, dancing and the ATT buff offers far more utility. The only reason to bring Takumi over Olivia is to have him act as an additional off-tank and offer ranged support.
* * * * *
So yeah, since I was dragged into this, my team setup would prefer... Narcian, Subaki, Red Mage (Tharja?), Olivia

...the same team that MaskedAmpharos has suggested.
* * * * *
So, in terms of strategies...
1. Narcian lures Lance Flier, kills Lance Flier. Subaki moves to the right to eventually engage the Sword Cavalier. "Tharja" and "Olivia" get into position to attack Michalis.
2. Hostiles move down.
3. Kill Michalis with "Tharja" and "Olivia," hoping they survive an attack from Sword Flier. Try and move Narcian to the left to try and intercept the incoming Lance Infantry, without getting range range of either the Sword Flier or Sword Cavalier. Subaki engages with the Sword Cavalier.
4. Finish up the remnants.

Alternatively, instead of moving Subaki to the right to deal with the Sword Cavalier, have him deal with the Sword Flier first or guard "Olivia" and "Tharja." Subaki can kill the Sword Flier, Olivia can dance Subaki, and Subaki can move to cover the incoming Sword Cavalier.

Edit 2 & 3: It may help to give Narcian Pivot so he can easily move over to the left side. You may be able to pull it off without Pivot, but it definitely will help with positioning.

Without Pivot, a Level 40 Tharja with neutral HP will survive with 1 Health. Since yours is +HP, (the -SPD was worrisome, but the Sword Cav will not double), all should be well.

- - - - -

Hope this helps, for whatever it is worth.

Edited by Sire
Fixed Stuff, Alt Strat
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