My Little Pony: Friendship is Mafia (Game Over)

[SB.]

I'm not really avoiding contributing considering most of the discussion is taking place while I'm asleep.

Cut: I could say the same to you.

[Zkirsche]

You were probably awake for the Proto post, so I'm pretty certain you've been procrastinating a post.

[SB.]

Yeah, but with the majority of people not here I don't really mind if my post sits half-formed in notepad for a few hours while I do other stuff.

[Mitsuki]

@Mitsuki, the point about your blank vote park on Refa still stands and tells us why it is bad to have an early Refa wagon.

isn't pointing out something and not doing anything else just like licking icing off the cake?.

also, because of my own personality, just cause someone is scummy, I do not believe the person is scum. What Refa did was scummy, but I didn't think that big enough reason to throw him on a side

Dude, I was out for more than 24 hours. This is the 3rd time I say that I would be inactive for a long period of time. I know scum tend to be inactive, but the game has just begun, why don't you wait and see if I keep being inactive or if I actually do something from now on?

I think Blitz's voteparking just now, because his vote on me just started as a prodvote and now he's keeping it instead of doing something else.

Blitz, answer this as well. Do you think I'm scum? Why?

You stated that Refa was somehow scummy to change it to a neutral read later on. That was my point asking you that question and what I want you to answer.

Also, stop saying that I voted you because you made me angry, that's ad hominem and not true.

Mitsuki, why wouldn't a townie defend someone else from votes they perceive as bad? The thing you quoted isn't even a Refa defense, it's Blitz saying he doesn't like the votes on him as he thought people weren't doing much else. Also your last line is bad too imo, as in the first post you linked he sounded kinda neutral on him in that too, so I don't really think there was a change there at all. Her suspicion on Refa also seems to have vanished in her most recent post, which I don't like either.

What I wrote on my previous post already answers the question.

It's definitely a Refa defense because he gave reasons on why Refa would do that as town.

I know it wasn't a huge change but there was definitely a change. The answer won't be the most relevant thing ever but I still think it will be useful to know.

I never thought that Refa was that suspicious anyways and I don't see anything else scummy in his recent posts. Then again, I still need to focus on him and the other people as well. I'm thinking/reading.

[Da Bear]

3 hours 15 minutes remain.

Sorry about lack of votals but I've been phonebound. Should be able to get them out more in the future.

[Grace]

not playing

it's 72 hour days, there's +24 hours on what bearclaw just said (I double checked for you)

not playing

[Vhaltz]

Votals by random person not playing or modding v2.0

Refa (2) - Proto, SB
Mitsuki (2) - BBM, Blitz
Blitz (2) - Mitsuki, kirsche
kirsche (1) - Kay
Kay (1) - Refa
SB (1) - Prims

Co-mods should probably put up some ISOs and stuff

[Da Bear]

Fun. I apparently forgot how the calendar works.

[Mitsuki]

My effort to scumhunt more is mostly rendering useless.

If you really are a mason then okay, but if later you go "teehee I'm actually neighbor, we were pulling a gambit!!!!!" then you should lynched immediately. No takebacks.

Would you want to lynch the other if one of them flipped town but not mason, based solely on their claim? If so, why?

Ehhhhh, Blitz's responses are making me think he's a townie imo, something about his posts since I voted him just don't make me think he's scum anymore. I just don't see scum making them, I guess.

I'd like you to elaborate on this, if possible.

I've read Refa and now I don't think that his Prims vote was a contradiction anymore, he said that he thought that BBM's point was stronger than his townread and I think that voting like that is legit. However, I don't like how both of his serious votes are based on weak reasons (his Prims vote is based on a reaction and his Kay vote is based on her attitude towards the mason claim). I don't think it's too meaningful for now as there's not really that much content to elaborate, but I'd like him to put more effort into the game if possible.

[BBM]

Mitsuki, is Vhaltz hydra-ing with you?

Finding it difficult to get reads atm. Yeah some of what Blitz said was weird, and I said that too, but I'm not liking either of the people voting Blitz right now. It just feels like a really easy vote on both of their parts and neither really seem to be voting him for scum intent, just his weird actions towards Refa. Mitsuki's posts about Refa are also all over the place. First she votes him, then forgets about him in her next post, and then why SB asks her what happened to that read, she says she never found him that suspicious. So then what's the point of going over and giving her opinions again about Refa's initial vote? And this makes her suspicion towards Blitz for changing opinions about Refa hypocritical too. She also classifies Blitz defending Refa as "trying to stop discussion" which is painting a null action in a really bad light. And the bit about Blitz answering for Refa is bad play, yes, but what's the scum intent in it? Do you think Blitz and Refa are scumbuddies Mitsuki?

idk I'm thinking like Mitsuki > Prims > kirsche atm? I just don't feel Blitz would seriously say "wow can't believe nobody finds me scummy" if he were actually scum.

[Da Bear]

Mitsuki

Railgun

Kay

Blitz

Kirsche

Refa

Prims

BBM

Isos.

Edited January 27, 2014 by bearclaw13

[Prims]

i have read the thread and the scumteam is: Refa/Mitsuki

##Unvote

##Vote: Mitsuki

[Mitsuki]

Mitsuki, is Vhaltz hydra-ing with you?

Finding it difficult to get reads atm. Yeah some of what Blitz said was weird, and I said that too, but I'm not liking either of the people voting Blitz right now. It just feels like a really easy vote on both of their parts and neither really seem to be voting him for scum intent, just his weird actions towards Refa. Mitsuki's posts about Refa are also all over the place. First she votes him, then forgets about him in her next post, and then why SB asks her what happened to that read, she says she never found him that suspicious. So then what's the point of going over and giving her opinions again about Refa's initial vote? And this makes her suspicion towards Blitz for changing opinions about Refa hypocritical too. She also classifies Blitz defending Refa as "trying to stop discussion" which is painting a null action in a really bad light. And the bit about Blitz answering for Refa is bad play, yes, but what's the scum intent in it? Do you think Blitz and Refa are scumbuddies Mitsuki?

idk I'm thinking like Mitsuki > Prims > kirsche atm? I just don't feel Blitz would seriously say "wow can't believe nobody finds me scummy" if he were actually scum.

I can talk to him about the game, but I don't think it can be considered hydraing. He's given me some advice and checks most of my posts for grammar/vocabulary mistakes. He won't give me any reads.

I do think that there's scum intent in some, if not all, of Blit'z actions. Read my posts, I've said that he's voteparked on me when his vote started as a prodvote (Question: how does his vote on me seem to you?), that he tried to stop discussion ED1 and some minor stuff more. I want an explanation for Blitz's change on opinion, and depending on what he says I'll think. There are several things that can make you change your opinion and some of them are scummy while others are not.

Defending someone might not be scummy. I was just pointing out that defending someone can go against town's wincon. It wasn't a point against Blitz, and I thought it couldn't be seen as one (I was saying so from town!Blitz's perspective, otherwise "giving explanations to potential scum" makes no sense)

I don't think Blitz and Refa are scumbuddies, I'm trying to forget about possible scumteams because I always screw up. Blitz is scummy and Refa is mostly null.

I don't really see why people wouldn't say sentences like that as scum. I recall reading scum doing similar things.

BBM, I'm a very disorganized person, like, much more than average. Ask Vhaltz about it if you want. It's normal for me to comment my opinions on a player like that.

Anyways, let me explain my train of thought. First of all I thought Refa was a bit scummy so I voted him, as I didn't really see something scummier but I didn't have real conviction. After that time passed and Blitz was definitely scummy, so I voted Blitz. Since I was asked, had read the thread and I basically hadn't changed my opinion I said so. My opinion kept being the same, "Refa is a bit scummy but what he did isn't that scummy", and I saw no point on mentioning anything else until I was asked (although I should have mentioned something, I know, but I was going to post after that anyways so it didn't even cross my mind). After that I decided to ISO Refa and my opinion changed, so I said it.

[Mitsuki]

I'm going to sleep soon, so if you want me to answer something please ask/say so now. Also, I'll spend morning/afternoon (GMT +01:00) tomorrow out, I'll be back way before the deadline though. I'll try to check mafia before I leave, but I don't know how much I will be able to answer.

[Prims]

there have been multiple times where Blitz has said somebody "scummy" as in he think they're objectively scummy but doesn't read them as scum so the Refa thing isn't really a contradiction so much as an ESL quirk.

[Mitsuki]

Ok, now I can say that it was null. Still, I'd have liked to get Blitz to answer.

Right now the scummiest thing I think he's done is his votepark, anyways.

Prims, answer my question.

I'm going to sleep.

[Prims]

I come in here and vote you with no basis and the most you want from me is my opinion on masons?

[Prims]

I guess I should realpost or whatever.

If BBM flipped Town Neighbor I wouldn't lynch Proto, but if Proto flipped Town Neighbor I'd lynch BBM.

@Blitz: You need to be more clear about Who Is Scum And Why. Talk less about what you expect other people to think and more about what you think and why people should agree with you. I mean you've had a lot of time to ask people questions by now... I agree with kirsche's point about your attack on Kay, is Mitsuki a better lynch or not?

I don't really have a solid case on Mitsuki, I just think her attack on Blitz is fake. I'll try to find a way to verbalize it when I'm more into the game. #HighLevelMafia

Her earlygame sheep was weak though; if you look at her recent posts she holds no accountability for it because "Refa wasn't actually that bad", which implies it was just made to seem productive. Would expect a townie to look for some sort of original line of inquiry if she didn't have anything.

Refa is scummy as well but he's got plenty of votes for this early in the phase,

I missed this but it's really bad. If he's scummy then what does town have to gain from you not voting him? Seems self-conscious, eg "if I vote Refa people might react badly because I'm wagon hopping / putting him super close to a lynch!". I don't buy the explanation for it either since voting kirsche instead still serves no purpose except to obfuscate votals. Given how much Kay has been focusing on Refa this whole voting inconsistency is very disproportionate.

Refa is actually OK I guess.

[SB.]

@Mitsuki, why were you voting for Refa if you didn't think that he was scum? I'm not really sure how to describe my feeling on Blitz, iirc it sparked around the post where he meta'd Prims. I don't see scum faking something like that, and I wasn't getting a super scummy read from his responses to me tbh, I just wanted to press it futher for his reactions.

@Prims, why is Refa suddenly not as scummy any more? Is it because other people are worse or something else? Also idk why the Neighbour thing would happen since I don't see town benefit to agreeing with it in the first place.

[Prims]

His content since the weird stance about me hasn't bugged me too much. The "Refa / Mitsuki scumteam" post was just gut. I wouldn't say he looks town though.

[Mitsuki]

So many posts since I went to sleep, wow.

I come in here and vote you with no basis and the most you want from me is my opinion on masons?

I wanted to see a post, that's part of why I said that if someone wanted me to answer something they should ask then. I thought you'd be writing your post while I was asleep, so what do you want me to do? Get angry meanwhile? I decided not to care much about your vote. I'm quite sure it made it easier to sleep.

My conviction isn't fake, but I don't know what else do you expect me to say other than "you're wrong".

I'm not very self confident but I try not to let that influence my actions, maybe that explains your thoughts.

I voted Refa because it's the best I could do at that moment. I didn't find anything else real suspicious back then. I did think Refa was a bit scummy, don't put words on my mouth. SB, Prims, why are you bringing that up now when it didn't bother you when I voted him?

All the votes on me are either weak, due to misunderstandings or because there is not really much content to elaborate.

Nice, but I'm not getting lynched so you'd better keep thinking.

Also,

Finding it difficult to get reads atm.

I see this as a towntell, as scum would probably think that they are not being able to form reads due to being scum, and they wouldn't point out their weakness just like that. I also doubt scum would come up with this to make players townread them.

[Zkirsche]

@BBM I'm voting Blitz because his actions have scum intent, instead of scumhunting he chose to vote park without justification and seemingly dropped a suspicion(Kay). Dodging scumhunting + randomly dropping suspicion is scummy, not weird play.

[BBM]

Probably won't be here for phase end. Mitsuki's conviction that she won't get lynched feels like an attempt at intimidation because I can't imagine Elie would put any super obvtown would-not-lynch roles in the game when there are also Masons. And she's at 2 votes and SB indicated earlier that he also found her suspicious, so she's definitely a viable candidate.

Also, scum say that they have trouble getting reads literally all the time as an excuse. What I said was pretty null. I think it's an attempt on her part to fake more content because she really doesn't have any solid opinions on anyone other than Blitz atm.

[Elieson]

The "OMG THE MODS FINALLY DID VOTALS" Votals

Mitsuki (3): Prims, BBM, Blitz (L-2)

Refa (2): Proto, SB

Blitz (2): Mit, Kirsche,

kirsche (1): Kay

Kay (1): Refa

With 9 alive, 5 hammers. There remains 14.5 hours in the day, and today only may end with either a hammer or with a vote leader.

Also, ISOs are in the OP. I did that last night and forgot to say so

[Blitz]

I am so sorry that I couldn't make it last night, I was so tired I fell asleep (I just got to do a quick skim)

anyways, I thought about the game a bit when I was away and if my memory is correct, I think there are a lot of things of Kay that bugs me, so I will try to make a post showing those.