Mafia Question of the Whenever - LYLO

[Sunwoo]

I consider a game to be bastard if either 1) you cannot trust your role PM, or 2) the game uses nonstandard or unexpected elements in the game that affect how the game is normally played without warning the players. I'd consider unannounced no-flip games to be bastard, for example. Unannounced death miller probably toes that line too.

[Paperblade]

% roles aren't bastard, they're just stupid

Most people would say "lying to the player" but in some instances that's okay (godfathers ninjas etc.), so maybe something like "Lying to a player and not because of the result of another player's role"

But then there's things that I would consider bastard like including roles like miller/godfather with no cop etc.

Also yeah no flip when it's not in the rules is bastard

Edited May 10, 2014 by Paperblade

[Baldrick]

A bastard game IMO, is one that has elements that affect the player's ability to have fun, or explicitly lie to the player. Miller without a cop and variants are not bastard to me unless the role PM says "There is a cop in the game". Rolespec and the like are generally frowned upon anyway and if you don't try to break the setup functional vanilla roles won't affect you.

[spoiler=this part's a bit off-topic]

As both a host and a player, I tolerate setup/role speculation if Actual Scumhunting would take an impractical amount of time and effort. As a player, I understand the risk that I may be making a faulty assumption, and would the same expect players in my game.

[Grace]

6) Avoid adding bastard elements to the game, unless the game is explicitly advertised as such. Bastard elements can be generalized as:

a) Hidden role abilities, active or passive, which the player is never made aware of (cop sanities besides sane are a good example);

b) Roles that lie about role flips (death miller/death godfather) in closed setups;

c) Roles that lie about investigation results where it is explicitly stated that investigation results are accurate;

d) Roles that lie about a player's alignment.

e) Roles that have a counterintuitive wincon, eg Fool/Jester, in closed setups;

f) Open setups where the advertised setup is false in any way, shape, or form;

g) Closed setups where there are moles/mason infiltrators and the like; announced it's not so bad but unannounced is straight up cruel.

that's my answer Edited May 11, 2014 by Curly Brace

[eclipse]

ITT: Someone hasn't been a mole in a game where moles were announced. That was NOT fun.

[Blitz]

I really couldn't resist this thread so, I just HAD to pop up

IMO, other than all the aforementioned reasons, I find a game falling in the category when the balance is intentionally rigged (by the mod) to support the group s/he wants to see win and takes it too far. Games which aren't balanced for mod error (unintentional I meant) should not fall in the category though( cause it should not take things too far).

What is worse is when the mod lies to the checker about some abilities of roles so that the game looks balanced, but actually isn't.

[SB.]

ITT: Someone hasn't been a mole in a game where moles were announced. That was NOT fun.

This just kinda supports the idea moles are terrible more than anything?

[Paperblade]

I don't think a bastard game is necessarily an imbalanced game, ditto for vice versa

[eclipse]

So apparently we're on a rotational schedule.

Day 5: Which mafia game that you've played in is your favorite?

I'll answer this in a bit.

EDIT: After a bit of thought, it's both Radiant Dragon games - Mitnala for being a functional vanilla in OC and Ivalice because I was THE most protown SK before Elieson signed up.

Edited May 11, 2014 by eclipse

[MRDRHAWK]

Healer, because I got to be Cop and somehow got Town MVP despite the fact that I played like crap for about 3/4 of the game

[FrostyFireMage]

I'll answer that question when I can actually play worth a damn.

[Junk]

while not a full game probably persona 3 mafia. I sucked hard in that game.

[Vhaltz]

ITTD because it was the first game I've ever felt like my reads kicked ass and it felt really good.

It's not like I could pick any other SF game anyway, I got busdrive-vigged in Healer, N1 killed in FE6 and had to replace out N1 in NOCers

[euklyd]

CY'OR definitely, despite only being a sub. Certainly a favorite role, and I played okay. I think.

[Zkirsche]

PiG Mafia was probably the most fun I've had in a long time.

[Refa]

Healer because we busdrived vigged Vhaltz

Badass Mafia, I had a lot of fun playing that one. Probably a combination of my role + a neat scumteam + I like OC. Also every flip was like the best thing ever. Weird I picked that one because I didn't play that well AND I lost...

Also SFMM4 because I FINALLY rolled third even though I fucked up on D3. At least my reads were good!

Why are all of my favorite games the ones in which I lost...

[Sunwoo]

One of Touhou, Xenoblade, or Trainwreck, I don't really have one that's a "favorite". Touhou because that game was plain nuts and my first game being third party, Xenoblade because it was my first game and I shot mafia on the final cycle to end the game, and Trainwreck because first scum game. Inception is near the top as well.

My favorite game as a host was AM/PM. It went pretty well … at least, most of it.

[Junk]

I read that as least favourite. woops, so for my real answer it probably has to be shining force sword of hajiya mafia. Felt like I was playing with completely different people. Also felt good to know that one of my reads was right.

Edited May 11, 2014 by DO NOT EDIT POSTS GUY

[Shin]

Trainwreck for the sheer audacity. I didn't understand mafia at all and I literally had to have Boron telling me what to say. Semi-precious was probably my best game though, pro-Brit scumteam.

[SB.]

Semi-Precious, MLP and Masquerade. Being scum who manages too fool the town completely for most of ghe game is pretty satisfyig. Badass was basically the same thing except being Cult. For town games, maybe Touhou or CY'OR. Super large role madness games are fun I guess.

[MRDRHAWK]

Badass was super fun too, definitely my #2 after Healer

[BBM]

My favourite game was probably Kirby. I had a cool role and helped town win. Another town games that was fun was CM5. Unfortunately for me when I play well I tend to get killed early, especially in anon games.

Favourite scumgame was probably Touhou even though I lost because it was during that short time that I preferred playing scum to town and also had an active team to chat with all the time. SF3 was fun too.

[Elieson]

School teacher mafia. Hands down. Catching cult n1 as alignment cop then lasting until final lylo was a blast!

HM to Void.

Self aligned itp hunter with communication with the SK in a mafia-less game was fun.

[Grace]

yeah schoolteacher was cool

considering i managed to wiggle out of a D2 lynch after subbing into a scummy playerslot and proceed to rek some mafia scums

(also apologies for not providing questions; i was out yesterday and when i got home i was ded and it was late)

[riariadne]

Magic the Gathering, though I am fairly certain I'm alone on this one