BBM Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 I hope to god you're not CO-DRIVERS because fuck that shit Also in that case we've already had town/scum co-drivers, And even in any other co-ability role, having to work together to use your role doesn't mean that one of you can't be scum. I'm pretty sure everybody has a power role in this game so it's not like picking one element over the other when we don't know much about any of the elements as of yet really matters... fun fact I started this post like 2 hours ago and forgot about it oops I still think Marth is scummy because like... his kirsche vote feels lazy in that it seems like an easy one to just park on. For all that Marth is saying that Mancer's ED1 stuff was townie it wasn't really because Mancer I'm pretty sure would do that as either alignment. His most recent stuff gives me a townier feel, but even so, kirsche isn't obligated to agree, and Marth hasn't explained how not doing so is scummy. He's just said that kirsche is 'ignoring why Mancer is town' and that's it. Poly's vote on Mancer sucks but I feel like if he was scum he would have just said something like 'yeah I noticed the scumslip that everyone else did' instead of giving a different one so idk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MancerNecro Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 If I appear grasp, it's because I follow all of my suspicions on a whim and probably press everyone a little too much. Don't really think this is a scum tell since scum benefits more from laying low and sheeping the majority of the players and not drawing as much attention as me. If your cases on me are solely for me being all over the place and being graspy with my suspicions, I hope this addresses that and makes you change your mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBM Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Speaking from a theory standpoint, that's not really true; some players simply can't lurk without it looking suspicious, because they're so active when they're town. And you've always been an aggressive and public player, regardless of your alignment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MancerNecro Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 I really think we should be going onto players who have posted but did not really draw any attention to themselves. I have several names of players I've forgotten were even in the game: Shin, Levity and Bluedoom. Even Elieson is pretty much unnoticeable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MancerNecro Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 True. I feel like the votes on me are on me because I'm overly aggressive which really isn't a scum tell at all. Going to ISO those players I just mentioned. I'm at work now so pardon me if I'm slow or miss out stuff cause my attention is currently split up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NekoRex Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 I'm treating the Neighbor claim as null still, but it still rings alarm bells for me whenever someone posts It's my other role that made me almost absolutely certain that my Neighbour was town. because it's almost begging to be untrue. I'm having some trouble keeping up but I don't think my reads will change much until Rapier comes in. I have the feeling the 'scumslip' is just a mistake after all. not sure where our vote should go but i think my other half probably has a better idea then me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elieson Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 If I appear grasp, it's because I follow all of my suspicions on a whim and probably press everyone a little too much. Don't really think this is a scum tell since scum benefits more from laying low and sheeping the majority of the players and not drawing as much attention as me. If your cases on me are solely for me being all over the place and being graspy with my suspicions, I hope this addresses that and makes you change your mind. Tell me more about how you would behave as scum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MancerNecro Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 I'm not really sure since I don't pay any particular attention to how I behave. You might want to direct that question at players who've played with a scum me before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MancerNecro Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Players voting Rapier should really ease off of him right now since he's not posted for a really long time and there's not much that can be gotten fr op met having your votes lazily stacked on him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rapier Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Wait, Rapier... what? You said Neighbour just allows you to talk to the other party and said it's not so useful but you decided to vote for the class that enables my Neighbour role anyway. Has anyone else noticed the contradictions he's making? You said Neighbor was only half of your role. I thought you also had another ability, but it seems I was wrong from your answer. Deselect ##Select: Archer Also, how do you plan to do a '1vs1 shoot off to find scum' on NOC? tbh, even ignoring the scumslip, Rapier has made some very contradicting posts where he says something is useless to town yet goes to vote for whatever he has just said is useless to town. Then he goes to say that it is more useful to vote for something and yet votes for whatever he said is not as useful to town. Meaning he's openly showing that he's not doing things in favour to town. Unless he derped super hard or he is some role that wins by getting himself lynched. No shit. You first told me I was being contradictory for not selecting Knight when I thought the Cop was an Archer role, judging from Prims' post, but I wasn't: I explained that Neighbors are useless compared to a possible Cop. It was when I reread your post and saw the 'Neighbor is just half of my role' part that I thought it was worth voting for Knight. come on it was late at night give me a break guys Basically, he goes on to select a class that he thinks provides town with an investigative ability but to him, it is more useless for town to get investigative roles through the selection. I meant useful. USEFUL. Remind me to never post at midnight ever again. --- So, here's my testimony: I mistook the color of the class for the element. So, instead of remembering we're using Fire/Wind/Earth I remembered the colors, aka Fighter/Archer/Knight (and they're not the same as the elements, from what I can see in the role pm. Mine differs in element & color, at least, and this is the only thing I'll reveal). I blame Prims for using the same color for Archers and Townies (thanks for clarifying, Randa). But still, clarify which is the scumflip everyone's referring to, please. I don't see how mistaking the colors is such a huge tell. I could be a townie who mistook my role color for my affiliative color. Everyone who just decided to sheep clipsey and disappear into the void should do more than being lazy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRDRHAWK Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Yeah, it's partly why I moved off you; that is kind of a shit reason to do that. Also, from what I'm reading, I'm actually townreading Randa for the first time ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MancerNecro Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Rapier, read again, I said multiple times that I had another ability..... Neko even quoted it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rapier Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Players voting Rapier should really ease off of him right now since he's not posted for a really long time and there's not much that can be gotten fr op met having your votes lazily stacked on him. Timezones, son. Give me time to catch on (I'm still on page 6). So, while I catch up, I'll leave this: Why am I scummy? Mancer says I'm scummy because of my contradictions (can't blame him here for my derpyness), yet was there any scum intent? We don't just vote someone for being a derp, we vote them when we sense scum intent. Otherwise, it's just opportunistic voting someone with an easy justification. About my "scumslip", Prims used green for both Town and Archer on his post detailing about the rules, it is easy to make a mistake based on this and associate green with Archer roles instead of Town. The rest should stop being lazy and come back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MRDRHAWK Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 @Rapier: I already explained what I saw was the "scumslip". It probably wasn't what Clipsey thought it was, but whatever. In any event, who do you actually find scummy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eclipse Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Oh, hey, a wild Rapier appeared! So did a wild clipsey, but she needs to read the topic and all. As my target finally appeared. . .he gets to explain himself, because Rapier needs to talk himself out of that (and I don't intend on helping him do that). Meanwhile, I get to compile reads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MancerNecro Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Explain your derps and why and how you made them, Rapier. If you can't explain how you made those derps or your thoughts when you made them, then I'm inclined to think you're scummy for making those derps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluedoom Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Scum! Mancer pursues most thing he considers a lead but not all. He's a little low-key in that sense. So I read Neko/Randa playerslot and I feel bad about it. Neko starts off with a gut scumread on Mancer but doesn't really get into it in detail in later posts, that and things like "Why are people flocking to mancer when eclipse started it" but not pursuing it further/analysing it rub me off the wrong way. Randa also has mostly spent his time scumreading Mancer without pursuing any other scumreads so that adds to the scumread on this playerslot. Vote will still be on kirsche because his reactions reads basically this to me: "Scum who made a slip and then flailed hard with an OMGUS full of reasons that don't really make sense to me and look scummy." Rapier has arrived! I don't have time to read his posts in detail and get in a reply but I definitely will when I come back in 10 hours. If you see me on then it means I'm on my phone and replies will be hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluedoom Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 and for clarification mancer, kirsche is scummier than Poly for the aforementioned reasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belisarius Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Eclipse's dark vote doesn't make any sense as town since I think it's fair to guess that dark has a vig and a vig is one of the least desirable roles at this point. ##Vote eclipse Earth/Knight probably has a roleblocker, Holy/Cleric probably has a doc, Wind/Archer probably has a investigative role (I'm thinking thats why we're sheeping kirsche on wind?). Fire and Water I'm seeing as wildcards so it'd be a good idea to choose one to find out. Getting wind out of the way. ##Select Archer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rapier Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 I can ascertain that elements have their own colour. I think Rapier is scum because he assumes that players have only one role. My role has two parts: One part that can be used anytime and the Neighbour part that can be used only if the current class is Knight. I'd think that most town players will have somewhat similar role PMs. I feel that I have to explain this because players are taking the fact that I have not revealed my thoughts as a scum tell. This is a flawed motive. Why am I scum for believing that players have only one role (which is, you know, what usually happens in Mafia)? And how can you tell most town players have two parts in a role? This is baseless rolespec. The point I was trying to make was that the "scumslip" isn't the reason Rapier looks bad, it's his bizarre attitude with regards to the selection and his vote on Poly. RVS votes usually aren't solid reasons for believing someone is scum. I really think we should be going onto players who have posted but did not really draw any attention to themselves. I have several names of players I've forgotten were even in the game: Shin, Levity and Bluedoom. Even Elieson is pretty much unnoticeable. This sounds a bit like redirecting attention to someone else. BBM pressed Mancer, then he said it was better to go for inactives instead. Explain your derps and why and how you made them, Rapier. If you can't explain how you made those derps or your thoughts when you made them, then I'm inclined to think you're scummy for making those derps. I already did, go read my post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xinnidy Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 I'm pretty sure I saw Xinnidy reading the thread before I went to bed yesterday but there's no post from her yet... "Why does this game have 7 new pages." - Serenes forest user Xinnidy ragequitting this afternoon. You guys suck. Agree with BBM that we probably want investigative over protective if we want to find scum. Kinda bothered by how mancer was gunning so hard to activate his role that he wanted to sell his element as a protective role element for people. Though I think since his hypothetical neighbour is not speaking up about that it's more likely that Mancer is the more likely to be town-sided neighbour to a town/maf neighborhood if his claim is true. Rolespec aside: This post feels awkward to me because NNR votes for the element of the person he's lynching. It's mostly gut but it feels counterintuitive to reduce the utility of the roles you're voting for unless you're really that confident Mancer is mafia while Knight has another awesome role? This, in the context it was posted in, makes no sense. How are you going to derive an 1v1 off of that? You're already assuming one of the neighbours is scum? I can see what part of rapier's reasoning might have been lost in a typo but I want to get a full explanation from rapier for this post. Not only if it means what I think it means but the switch to voting Knight. Which went, as far as I know, unexplained. This post is inconsistent with how you pushed two classes as having protection roles earlier, Mancer. I find elieson's reaction more weird than rapier's presumed slip, to be honest. But the frustration in his more recent posts is not a scumtell on him for me. #emmetareads On the rapier wagon I think eclipse is less likely to be scum by virtue of simply starting it with her logic. I'd look moreso either bbm or poly. Probably poly thanks to elieson's comment. Kirsche's interactions with the slipwagon are by far the most positive and sensible from an opposing town pov. This post is poor. At the very least bring something to the table if you want people not to focus on the rapier wagon. And despite all the analysis potential, marth just discards all events as "not much actually happening" and sheeps one elieson post to keep his vote on poly. Further up you could explain your class selection for starters, also suddenly acting with some certainty that Rapier is the D1 lynchee is awkward. A point brought up here that I can't understand is how eclipse is (presumably inherently) more suspect for finding this scumslip that others disagree with. Elieson define the difference between a slip and a derp. You talk about how scum is less likely to 'derp' than 'slip' but your definition of 'slip' is not implicit. I can see the sense in this post regarding claiming neighbours when they aren't always active but I don't think it would guarantee an 1v1. I'm confused and would like if mancer explained. This post makes me confused on shin's rapier stance as he mentions to be careful with Rapier's clumsiness and call mancer's case on him bad while reverting to approve of lynching rapier on the following paragraph, it meshes poorly with his final sentence as well. This change of stances can't do without explaining why the first paragraph is invalid. Ok further select posts make me believe the role PMs are not consistent. That changes my perspective a fair amount on the scumslip matter. I don't really understand what you mean here, Shin. How did Rapier suspect that wind would have lame roles when he explicitly said he thought wind had cop? Regarding poly's new post while I don't exactly understand their perception of the scumslip it came to me that I might as well be the one seeing things differently now that I look back at eclipse's quoted rapier post. A can of worms regarding roles is opened and all this claims and crumbs talk in page 10 is going over my head, mafia sucks. PEDIT: while I was being slow rapier posted! The explanation satisfies me regarding the switch to knight. Concerning the derps regarding rolespec, town isn't meant to be lenient when you can full well explain yourself. It seems hardly fair to shut people down by asking why you're scummy when most of your activity links to your derps, which leads to suspicion you're supposed to explain. Tl;dr: I don't feel marth is contributing wherein there is content he can opine on while keeping a very ambiguous rapier read and shin's flop around the rapier slot based on contradicting information are both suspect to me. Right now Marth > Shin. ##Unvote ##Vote:Marth Select: Archer Let's hammer investigative roles today. (I personally want Fighter over Knight/Assassin because of a certain read I feel positive about.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NekoRex Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 I haven't had a chance to go further into eclipse because eclipse has basically not been posting until now. Don't like eclipse's reply, she still leaves everything vague about her scumread yet tells Rapier to 'figure it out and defend himself'. rapier on the other hand I don't really like either, his tone bothers me, it's kind of unnecessarily angry and combative. Still clipsey is basically essentially parking on the vote without explaining it, while doing nothing else, and that's a lot worse imo. ##Unvote ##Vote: Eclipse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prims Posted September 10, 2014 Author Share Posted September 10, 2014 (edited) Day 1.4 - Votals Bluedoom (3) - BBM, MancerNecro, Xinnidy eclipse (3) - Belisarius, Randa & NekoRex Burakkuhoku (2) - Rapier, Shin kirsche (2) - Bluedoom, Sara. MancerNecro (2) - kirsche, Burakkuhoku Rapier (2) - eclipse, Refa Not Voting (1): Quote Class Selection Archer (6) - kirsche, Burakkuhoku, MancerNecro, Rapier, Belisarius, Xinnidy Fighter (3) - Sara., Refa, BBM Assassin (1) - eclipse Cleric (1) - Quote Knight (1) - Bluedoom Indecisive (2): Randa & NekoRex, Shin You have 47 hours and 10 minutes left in the day. With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Edited September 10, 2014 by Prims Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NekoRex Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 I haven't had a chance to go further into eclipse because eclipse has basically not been posting until now. Don't like eclipse's reply, she still leaves everything vague about her scumread yet tells Rapier to 'figure it out and defend himself'. rapier on the other hand I don't really like either, his tone bothers me, it's kind of unnecessarily angry and combative. Still clipsey is basically essentially parking on the vote without explaining it, while doing nothing else, and that's a lot worse imo. ##Unvote ##Vote: Eclipse Eclipse's dark vote doesn't make any sense as town since I think it's fair to guess that dark has a vig and a vig is one of the least desirable roles at this point. ##Vote eclipse Earth/Knight probably has a roleblocker, Holy/Cleric probably has a doc, Wind/Archer probably has a investigative role (I'm thinking thats why we're sheeping kirsche on wind?). Fire and Water I'm seeing as wildcards so it'd be a good idea to choose one to find out. Getting wind out of the way. ##Select Archer This is unneeded and bad role speculation and voting based on it is pretty terrible imo. You are making far too many assumptions here on the setup. - This is a Prims Game (see Spellcard and CYOR for historic examples); it isn't bastard, but assume things at your own risk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NekoRex Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 I don't really care which class we choose, does anyone mind if I hammer Archer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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